ATS-34 or BG-42

M

MaxPower

Joined
Jun 24, 1999
Messages
124
Which steel do you feel is better all around? Which is tougher, holds a better edge etc... I still believe ATS is superior over most steels in folding knives but I'm not sure in larger fixed blades. The bottom line is if given a choice in a 12in. tactical/utility knife what would be better.
 
I have found that ats is extremely tough at high hardness....but ive read where a lot of other people dont agree....but i think the heat treat may be the key....so it is with bg42.....ive been making knives out of this material for almost two years and it seems to hold up very well....better than ats in the edge holding dept....pretty stain resistant....and faily tough...i am about to make a bg42 knife for one of my severe field testers....he will probably break it... usually does... i will report back...

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http://www.mayoknives.com


 
I think that BG42 is a superiour steel. I have not had the chance to really test out BG 42, but its not that hard IMO to be better than ATS.I have found that ATS is not very tough at all at high hardness(My 2 knives in it at both BM). And the edge holding is medicore at best. Also, one more factor to concider is price. BG42 thens to cost quite a bit more than ATS-34.

Sincerely,
Adam

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Self improvement is a hobby of mine :).

 
Big knives in BG-42? I used to talk to Edmund Davidson to order an integral piece. He informed me that there was some size-limitation on the BG-42 stock so larger models may have to be scaled down. That was last year. I don't know whether things change nowadays. For some reason I still have never seen something like a big BG-42 camp knife.

Dew.


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My excuse to boss at home, being caught buying a new knife:
"Honey, this is different. It has vanadium in it."


 
BG-42 is a superior steel to ATS-34. This is based on it's higher Vanadium, Chromium and Carbon content.

Most of the ATS-34 that is used in todays knives is full of impurities. BG-42 is a much cleaner steel.

You won't see many big blades as BG-42 is not currently available in 1/4" stock. You could however contact Latrobe and order a mill run (400 pounds at about $18.00 per pound).

Personally, I feel that D-2 is the best "overall" steel for a big blade. This is based on my own field experience.



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Les Robertson
Moderator
Robertson's Custom Cutlery
http://www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com/rcc/makers.shtml
I thought I was wrong once, but I was mistaken.
 
I personally believe that A-2 and/or D-2 are the best steels overall, but many makers do not offer these steels regularly.
 
D2? Les: doesn't that seem a bit brittle for a large knife that will probably be used for chopping and prying? I've always thought of D2 being a great edge holder, and for that you don't really need a 12 inch knife.

Sincerely,
Adam

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Self improvement is a hobby of mine :).

 
I think that I speak for Les when I point out that Walter Brend uses D2 in many knives.
If that doesn't mean anything to you let just state that Walter is know as one of the finest combat knife makers to ever exist, many of his knives exceed the 12in. mark and his knives are the roughest, toughest, hard as nails, never fail when it counts knives that anyone could hope for(these knives retail at about $800). I believe Les has personal experience with these knives during combat situations.
 
Really and truly, steel preformance depends on the heat treating process. Some steels(D2, A2, ATS-34) are absolute dynamos when prepared correctly. Whereas these steels can be butchered and be outpreformed by 440 series steels when the heat treating is done poorly.
 
Adam, D2, is often refered to as a brittle steel as its max hardness is very high and at that level it would be brittle (relative). A large fixed blade out of D2 at 64 RC would probably not be a very good idea. However, D2 at lower RC, like 56-58 will have no problems with durability and it will still have very good abrasion resistance. I believe this is about what Brend tempers his larger knives to.

-Cliff
 
Max and Cliff are correct. D-2 gets a bad rap from those who don't know what they are talking about.

Walter does RC his blades at between 57-59. He also cyrogencially treats the blades.

D-2 just like BG-42 has a high Vanadium content (this gives the blade it's toughness). So the trick is to not take these blades to max hardness and let the Vanadium do it's job.

As for folders, I think over the next 3-5 years that ATS-34 will fall out of favor. Three things will impact on this.

1)New Steels such as BG-42, 440V,420V and Talonite will show they are superior to ATS-34.

2)154CM is already starting to replace ATS-34 due to the fact that it's composition is almost the same and it is cheaper than ATS-34.

3)Even though the aforementioned steels in 1)have been around for 10 years. Watch for articles in the future in knife magazines talking about the "new" super steels.

For larger blades watch for 3V in the future. Currently, it is not available in 1/4" stock. Should it become available I will start using this in large knives. It seems to be an excellent comprimise between A-2 and D-2.

It will take awhile for the super steels to become standard fare. This is due in large part to the price.

ATS-34 $12-$14 per pound

BG-42 $18 per pound

440V $120 per pound

420V $180 per pound

Talonite $400 per pound

Prices are approximate and does depend on how much you buy and where you get it from.

So if you want the super steels be prepared to pay extra for it.



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Les Robertson
Moderator
Robertson's Custom Cutlery
http://www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com/rcc/makers.shtml
I thought I was wrong once, but I was mistaken.
 
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