Back from Oz...

Codger_64

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No, not Australia. The land of ultralight backpackers. For the past week I've been cruising their sites and mining information and ideas about home made gear, new cutting edge gear, trail food and cooking, wilderness medical knowledge, tarps, bivvys and tents and condensation, some excellent information all around. I did find a bit of enviro-whacko and anti-hunting stuff, but that is everywhere these days. As I was just lurking, not posting, I pretty well just ignored that mess.

What I spent the most time on was stoves. Manufactured and home made. Cannisters, alcohol, esbit, white gass and wood fired. I think I got some pretty cool ideas and know I have a better knowledge of the thermodynamics involved in making a decent design.

The information on sleeping bags and pads gleened was great. Sleeping systems, I should say. Lots of great hints on increasing the warmth of bags, which features are warmer different pads available and how they compare.

Those guys (and gals) are as "ate up" with their hobby as a lot of us are. Some describe themselves as "gram-weenies" and set a goal for uber-light base pack weights that had me in awe. Like 4 or 5 pounds before food and water. That includes shelter bag, and complete kit. Packs that weigh in the ounces not pounds. Fibers like Cuban and Dyneema.

They have excellent research and experience in water purification too. And water storage. And even "high altitude flatulance". Foot care is a common topic, and logistics of resupply so minimum weights can be carried.

Now don't get me wrong, I am not contemplating going this route anytime soon. My winter load for a two week canoe trip will likely top a hundred pounds. But I don't have to carry it further than from the truck to the river, and the river to the truck. All in all though, I've gotten some great ideas to lighten my gear and make better use of some of my gear. And some great tips on manufacturers I had never heard of, as well as gear I'd never heard of. Remember those dehydrated mini-towels we talked about here? They do the same with beach towels now the size of a snuff can!

It might be worth taking a look-see yourselves sometime. I was certainly amazed at the changes since I hiked the AT back in the early 1970's.

Codger
 
Those guys are titanium freaks! But you're right--real gear heads all the way. I've got a touch of that mentality about camping and hiking gear, but I'm not nearly as weight conscious as some of the ultra-light folks. I always have redundancy in some areas because my more important motto is "Be prepared."

As for the whacko factor, just start a thread entitled, "Which gun should I choose for backpacking?" and watch the sparks fly! :p
 
Out of curiocity, what sites did you browse for your research? I've really been thinking a lot about bivy sacs and tarp shelters lately.

L
 
backpackinglight.com was a great one, one of the best. A lot of content isn't available to non-subscribers because it is an online magazine. whiteblaze.net is another one not so weight oriented, more AT oriented. That is just two but there are hundreds of links from there. Oh, and pack out your coffee grounds. :D

Codger
 
Those guys are titanium freaks!

Yeah, titanium bicycle spokes make the lightest grilles. Then titanium wedding bands?

As for the whacko factor, just start a thread entitled, "Which gun should I choose for backpacking?" and watch the sparks fly! :p


Lol! Or making a deer skin tarp and a buffalo paunch pack, antelope bladder water bottle and fox fur hat. Nah, if you go there be respectful of their mindset like you would want them to respect ours here. Trolling isn't appreciated anywhere.

Codger :)
 
As for the whacko factor, just start a thread entitled, "Which gun should I choose for backpacking?" and watch the sparks fly! :p

you'd be surprised, i've seen a lot of posts on ultralight boards about what guns to pack-

I saw the 10mm glock mentioned as a light weight cougar solution :D
 
Nah, if you go there be respectful of their mindset like you would want them to respect ours here. Trolling isn't appreciated anywhere.

Codger :)

Totally joking. I'd never start such a thread myself, but I have seen those kinds of sparks on hiking boards. Lots of people with "guns have no place on the trail" attitude clashing with folks who like a little insurance in the "wild."

Codger, not trying to hijack your thread with my comment either. Be interested in hearing what you discovered about stoves.
 
Totally joking. I'd never start such a thread myself, but I have seen those kinds of sparks on hiking boards. Lots of people with "guns have no place on the trail" attitude clashing with folks who like a little insurance in the "wild."

Codger, not trying to hijack your thread with my comment either. Be interested in hearing what you discovered about stoves.

Oh, I know that Guyon! I couldn't help myself, thinking how I'd like to show them how to entertain the kids in camp by making finger puppets from chipmunk skins! :D I knew you weren't seriously suggesting such.

I'll try to do a discourse on the stoves tomorrow after work. Might help me unwind from the 1 1/2 hour drive home.

Codger
 
Wow, I didn't know they made those things in towel sizes too! I just picked up 40 of those mini-towel things from wally world today for $5.00 usd. ($1 for eight). I usually try to pack light, I have a Fieldline belt pack that I started officially using today when I went fresh water fishing at a county park nearby. I went out on the trails that nobody uses and made some of those aluminum whistles and kept myself entertained all day (I actually didn't fish, but I lugged around my little pole just in case). I always try to pack light, but nothing beats having a "Real" sleeping bag and pad when it comes to laying down on mother earth all night. As much fun as it would be to down-size my pack, I just can't bring myself to pull stuff out that I might be able to use in the future. Without water, my pack only weights about 2~4 pounds (rough guestimation). Of course that doesn't include a shelter or bedtime stuff, but plenty of things to "survive" for a couple of days if I really wanted to (more like if I had the time). Thanks for the links, J.
 
I think most here are familiar with the "penny stove", an easy home project using a soda can. But the ultralight guys have taken the alcohol stoves to the next level, performed all sorts of experiments on designs and materials looking for the "magic combination" of quick boiling times, fuel economy, and adjustable flame simmer control. The stoves now fall into the following catagories:

Open Flame Stoves
Chimney Stoves
Low Pressure SideBurners
TopBurner Jet Stove
SideBurner Jet Stove
Pressurized Jet Stove
Pressurized SideBurner
Gelled Alcohol

Most (not all) require priming, preheating the stove to cause the alcohol to boil and vaporize (particularly at low temperatures). And for these guys, light weight is always a major consideration, usually more so than durability. Alcohol has a relatively low BTU output, so the best designs maximize the transference of heat from flame to the cook pot. Some of the "prettiest" titanium manufactured units fall short in this regard. Some are also used with esbit fuel as either a primer to heat the alcohol, or as an alternate primary fuel. Esbit also burns hotter than alcohol.

Next are wood fueled stoves. Some are simple "hibachi" affairs, some are "turbocharged" with battery powered fans or manual "blow tubes". More recent innovations use gassification, or carefully contrived air intake vents to boost output. These stoves are much heavier than the simple aluminum alcohol stoves, but aluminum cannot handle the higher heat output of a wood fire.

Then we have the cannister stoves, mostly burning Iso-butane, a mixture of propane and butane. Why? Um... I think because they vaporize at different temps and so will still work (for a while) at lowere temps, at least until teh lower temp vaporized portion is depleated. But the fix for this is to preheat the cannister with a hand warmer packet, or store it in a warm place like a jacket pocket or sleeping bag. The cannister stoves generally give good simmer control, but gas cannisters cannot be shipped by air. And empty cylinders aren't recycled. On the up-side, the burner units themselves have been refined and become quite light weight.

White gas stoves we are probably all familiar with. Though they are improving as well. Most no longer have the resivoir contained in the box with the stove, but are remote from the burner with a longer connecting hose. Several are multi-fuel in the truest sense and will burn white gas, unleaded auto fuel diesel and kerosene.

Discuss?

Codger
 
Very interesting. My dad has been making penny stoves for a while, but they are too sensitive for me. I'm very interested in the wood burning stoves. I've seen the Sierra stove, but I don't know how I like it. I'd like something simpler. Did you see many different variations of this?

L
 
Yes. One in particular grabbed my interest. I'll go fetch a link. Meanwhile, here is the guru site for alcohol stoves, complete with explanations and instructions:

http://zenstoves.net/


Ryan Jordan used this as his sole stove on his Arctic 1000 expedition, the BushBuddy:
http://www.ryanjordan.com/photos/arctic_1000/imgp1345800.html

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/bushbuddy_ultra_wood_stove.html

This is the one hailed by Cliff Jacobson, the Littlbug:

http://www.littlbug.com/index.htm
 
I was just cruising through the zen stove last night and they give great instructions. Went and made 3 stoves in 2 days. 2 with regular sized cans and one made from those really slim cans ( V drink). They work great and i can boil a cup of water in about 2 mins. Havent tried with a pot or anything yet.
I chose to make the Open Jet type because i didnt like the idea of priming then sealing it off. There were also warning that if constructed badly it might explode.
 
I've never had a 'personal experience' with Jacobson, just read some of his books and got some good advice from them, like on making touring spray covers. Be that as it may, just look at the stove and judge it by it's own merits. I like the design myself.

Codger :)
 
I've never had a 'personal experience' with Jacobson, just read some of his books and got some good advice from them, like on making touring spray covers. Be that as it may, just look at the stove and judge it by it's own merits. I like the design myself.

Codger :)

Cliff is a local guy around here and takes a bit of ribbing:D all in good fun, he's a great guy with a ton of paddling knowledge.:thumbup:
 
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