Batoning?

[daily_grind]

Ok - not looking to start a war, more of a knife-design question. I don't do a bunch of bushcrafting, but whenever I go camping and know that I will need to process firewood, I bring a hatchet. It never crosses my mind to use my knife to baton firewood. What baffles me is why batoning seems to be the "ultimate test" of utility/survival knives. Granted, my preferred utility knife is something Kabar-esque, and batoning a Kabar is not advisable. Perhaps I am missing the point, perhaps it is the case of "you only have what is in your government-issued gear." In that case, yeah, your only "hatchet" would be that knife, but if I went out bushcrafting - I'd feel naked without my hatchet, and I'd feel silly beating my knife with a log to split another log.

I'm actually thinking of making a few knives for some woodsy friends, one or more of whom beats their knives with logs ... and wanted to know what the knife-maker community had to say about batoning. I guess if they want to baton things, I'll make it out of thicker steel, full tang, etc.

 

[Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith]

I don't get it either. Use a tool that is made for the task.

 

[Maroco]

Batoning seems way safer to me when processing smaller logs in the back yard for nighttime fires. I really don't want to be swinging a hatchet the back yard with dogs and kids. Battoning allows me to keep from swinging a sharp blade around. Instead I'm swinging a piece of wood.

Is it ideal? No, but it's safe.

If you're actually camping or bushcrafting, I don't see a point in batoning.

 

[GmpaJim]

It seems to me, batoning is a kind of fidget activity.
I’ve sat around fires 70 yrs. and never needed to process firewood. (in the woods)
I think most fires end up too big anyway. (in the woods)
Yours truly, The Curmudgeon

 

[ferider]

Batoning seems way safer to me when processing smaller logs in the back yard for nighttime fires. I really don't want to be swinging a hatchet the back yard with dogs and kids. Battoning allows me to keep from swinging a sharp blade around. Instead I'm swinging a piece of wood.

Is it ideal? No, but it's safe.

If you're actually camping or bushcrafting, I don't see a point in batoning.

Couldn't have said it better. And the knife needs to be large enough.

No point in batoning for me unless the wood that I baton has been sawed before. I have an axe but no hatchet.

And I have to admit, it's fun So you do you ....

 

[Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith]

Just to play devil's advocate - you can baton a hatchet.

 

[Lorien]

it's a totally legit way to process wood for all kinds of things, beyond just making a fire.
if I'm designing and building a bushcraft knife, it's going to be able to handle getting hit with a baton- it's kind of a baked in consideration as far as I'm concerned, for a knife meant for living in the woods.

 

[Maroco]

Just to play devil's advocate - you can baton a hatchet.

Well hell, now I I gotta try that! I'll use a hatchet for tonight's fire and report back which was easier!

 

[daily_grind]

Couldn't have said it better. And the knife needs to be large enough.

No point in batoning for me unless the wood that I baton has been sawed before. I have an axe but no hatchet.

And I have to admit, it's fun So you do you ....

Ok - that knife is a monster! But what really grabs my attention in that photo is the log in the lower right corner ... what happened there? Like a big bushcraft pulley or something ...

 

[daily_grind]

I like the replies - I'm willing to have my mind changed about it. I haven't tried batoning ... maybe I should give it a try. I think my friends think I like arguing too much to be fully convinced one way or the other. However, now I want to get/make a froe ... that's what I think of first when I think of batoning.

 

[daily_grind]

Well hell, now I I gotta try that! I'll use a hatchet for tonight's fire and report back which was easier!

Too wet here for a fire today, but I am all about fires that are too big. I'm sure that makes the neighbors twitch, but hey ... those people burn couches and stuff like that. (And they never invite me to those parties)

 

[Seedy Lot]

I do some what regularly baton but it is more as I kneel in front of a fire prep spot and need smaller wood or dry wood to get the fire going. I am not going to carry an axe with me when I go deep into the Montana mountains during a winter outing but I do carry a small folding saw and 4 inch bladed belt knife in the pack.

Just now I needed some fine kindling to get the wood fired hot tub going and so I batoned some wood.

 

[Maroco]

Too wet here for a fire today, but I am all about fires that are too big. I'm sure that makes the neighbors twitch, but hey ... those people burn couches and stuff like that. (And they never invite me to those parties)

Ah! I call those big ones "weekend fires"! Our nightly fires with the family are usually contained the the chiminea per the wife's request. The fire isn't as fun but it gives me a reason to process wood past the point I normally would. It keeps my hands busy at least.

 

[C_Claycomb]

I posted this in another thread just one week ago.

“Using a baton is a skill. Its purpose is to expand your knife’s functionality within your knife’s capability. Regardless of its design. If you are concerned that your need exceeds your knife’s capabilities, or you are concerned you lack the mechanical sympathy for your knife to recognise when you near its limits, maybe you need an axe, or a Skrama. . A lot of baton advocates come from experience in boreal forest. Very different wood to what you find in the southern US. Not much gnarly oak or Osage up there.”

If all you have is a 4” belt knife and you want to take 1/4 to 1/2” side limbs off a sapling you could traipse back to camp for a bigger tool, or grab a 12” x 1” baton and finish the job in minutes. Batons make cutting notches quick and easy for pot hangers, snares and similar wood crafted stuff. Safer than sawing with even a pruning saw, and a cleaner cut.

In the UK, batons are often used to split down sub-3” diameter sawn wood for fire starting, rather than using twigs. There are some (surprisingly many) places where fine match lightable twigs just don’t exist.

BUT…the world of environments and skills encompassed by the term “bushcraft” is vast enough that there are places where opportunities to use a baton will be rare. No big deal.

Chris

 

[ferider]

Ok - that knife is a monster! But what really grabs my attention in that photo is the log in the lower right corner ... what happened there? Like a big bushcraft pulley or something ...

Handmade baton / mallet.

Holds a couple of weeks making shingles to start a wood stove once or twice a day. You might say "any excuse to use a favorite knife" and you might be right

 

[daily_grind]

Ah! I call those big ones "weekend fires"! Our nightly fires with the family are usually contained the the chiminea per the wife's request. The fire isn't as fun but it gives me a reason to process wood past the point I normally would. It keeps my hands busy at least.

Yeah - the day before, you hear lots of roosters crowing ... the next day ... silence ... perhaps someone batoned the chickens?

 

[Seedy Lot]

There are plenty of people who carry huge knives and go out of there way to split nasty wood by batoning, lots of the Gossman fan boys to mention a few. Nothing wrong with this but I prefer to carefully select what wood I am going to batton and go about it with a little thought like instead of trying to split through a knot spilt next to the knot.

 

[Danke42]

Handmade baton / mallet.

Holds a couple of weeks making shingles to start a wood stove once or twice a day. You might say "any excuse to use a favorite knife" and you might be right

Isn't it cheating to use a circular saw to cut out a baton?

 

[C_Claycomb]

Hehe

Was writing this just before Seedy Lot posted

I think batonning gets a bad reputation from idiots people trying to get knives to perform like axes by using ever larger knives and ever bigger clubs to beat on them with. Cool as a demo or test, but not cool that observers conclude that’s all batonning is.

Bushcraft is about skills. One is aiming for efficiency. There is often a divide between whether the skill is in using the tool at hand with the material immediately to hand, or recognising the local materials are sub optimal and going and finding better materials. Or carrying a better tool.

 

[bikerector]

Yeah, I think you're missing the point. Government issued has nothing to do with it either.

You can baton a SAK safely, it's all in how you do it and understanding your tools.

For most of the wood I split in the woods, a hatchet is more than needed and unnecessary. I don't make bonfires if I'm away from a drive in campsite, generally, and cooking fires don't require a lot of wood especially with a twig stove.

Why bring a hatchet when a knife will suffice?

It's not about doing it one way, it's about doing it a way thay works, and both knives and hatchets can work to split wood. Then, it comes down to doing it the way you want to do it.

Personally, I really dislike hatchets. If I need more than a large knife, give me a larger axe, small forest axe at a minimum but I prefer something longer yet. Having said that, my CT saddle axe is one of my faves, not because it's the most practical but because it brings me a lot of joy to use. Joy should not be under appreciated. I don't pack the saddle axe anywhere though, it's for around the backyard or car camping.

Usually, a leuku and saw, or a similar sized knife, is what I will pack if I think I need a lasting fire, like in winter camping wth friends and we want to hang around a camp fire at night since it's dark so long.