Bear Grylls is not quite a survivor

runningboar said:
More interesting reading, it just gets better and better.
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I suppose "duelling info found on the Internet" is a dangerous game to get into, but this site seems legit and they do make some interesting points.


Bear reportedly left SAS 21 TA following a parachute accident. We don't know what happened back then, but we do know that after his 1998 Everest summit, Bear was airlifted from BC with frostbite to his feet. He managed to get these in spite of being in a commercial expedition climbing on supplementary oxygen, and in fairly good weather.

In this link, 'Harry Hill' shows episodes from the series including a section where Grylls teaches survival after falling into an ice hole. ExWeb double checked Bear's technique with one of ExWeb's own; Tina Sjogren who - in an unsupported skiing trip to the North Pole - actually did fall through the ice into the Arctic Ocean, wearing no survival suit.

"What is he doing?" Tina commented the youtube burp in disbelief. "And who dug those hand-holds for him?"

"There were two problems when I fell in the water," Tina says. "1. There were no holds to grab when I tried to get out. 2. The thin edge of the ice kept breaking off under my weight."

Spotting her ski pole floating around, Tina managed to catch it and swim to a thicker section of the ice, where she could drag herself up using the sharp tip of the pole. "It's important to know that you have more time than you think in the water. Don't panic, and don't kick about. Take a deep breath before hauling yourself out - the air in your lungs will increase your buoyancy."

And on Bear's push-ups in the nude, "I definitely did not strip afterwards. That would have been extremely stupid - leading to instant hypothermia," she said. "Wet or dry, the clothes will insulate, giving you enough time to find a suitable place to make camp. You can roll in the snow to remove excess water from the clothing if you want to, but if you strip you'll really find yourself fast in trouble!"

Tina survived the ordeal, along with 4 Everest expeditions, all without frostbite. "There's nothing wrong with inexperience, we've all been there," she adds, "but it's another matter when taught to a TV audience. Or when actors forget they're just that - it's like Sylvester Stallone starting to believe he actually is the World Heavyweight Champion."

Yet Tina has a reservation to make, "I have a hard time to believe the episode. Is it Bear for real? Eating a raw fish right after, too? That's the last thing you'd want to do - plus it's bad for you. Perhaps it's a comedy interpretation? I don't know what to think anymore. Why would people even want to watch this?"

A quick google on the subject reveals that the training for the 'Bear SAS' (21 TA) is a shortened version of the regular SAS selection - where most 21 TA's never make it. Bear's apparently pretending to be - but not being a "real" SAS is just one of the things that have ticked people off.

The main question remains though - how Discovery and sloppy documentary film makers will adjust to the criticism. Media can't fabricate stories and claim they're real: Fairy tales need to be advertised as exactly that - anything else is deception.
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m_calingo said:
If Bear was in the British SAS, he has enough cred to be a survival expert, IMO. !
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My grandfather was a fur trapper in the north for 60 years and he had forgotten more about living off the land and survival than any commando on earth will ever know. He wasn't on a training mission or operation he lived it.

Living off the land and combat survival is 2 entirely different things, sometimes they overlap for brief periods.

A part time SAS reservist for a couple yrs is not a full SAS operator by any stretch no matter how you spin it. Hes a fraud simple.

Skam
 
OK! we all here have some kind of an idea of Survival and the kind of kind of knives we may use, and of course you use what you have with you at the time but Bear has a choice and his choices are very poor! any thoughts on his selection of knives!

RickJ
 
RickJ said:
OK! we all here have some kind of an idea of Survival and the kind of kind of knives we may use, and of course you use what you have with you at the time but Bear has a choice and his choices are very poor! any thoughts on his selection of knives!

RickJ
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You have to remember, the fact that were here on Bladeforums... Well, almost all of us are knife snobs. We know more and care more than most people about our cutlery choices.

That being said, theres really nothing wrong with his knife choices, it's the kind of everyday, widely available outdoor cutlery that people all over the world use everyday.

If it were me...... well, I'd have a Becker or a R.A.T. 5 or 7, and a Leatherman, and a Manix, and a Nessmuk repro, oh yea, don't forget a Woodswalker, or would I take a Hoffman Harpoon, and a few Busse's, cant forget the Busse's and.....
 
They included scenes where Grylls apparently killed a snake and ate it (the snake was found dead by the side of the road), cooked a dead badger (actually a steak inside a badger skin), and freed himself when his parachute tangled in a tree (he was pulled up into the tree and wore a safety harness).

This is the stuff that makes me mad. There is no reason that his show has to be so phony.
 
shotgunner11 said:
You have to remember, the fact that were here on Bladeforums... Well, almost all of us are knife snobs. We know more and care more than most people about our cutlery choices.

That being said, theres really nothing wrong with his knife choices, it's the kind of everyday, widely available outdoor cutlery that people all over the world use everyday.

If it were me...... well, I'd have a Becker or a R.A.T. 5 or 7, and a Leatherman, and a Manix, and a Nessmuk repro, oh yea, don't forget a Woodswalker, or would I take a Hoffman Harpoon, and a few Busse's, cant forget the Busse's and.....
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Busse's are pretty costly for my blood, but I like your choice of the "Rats". Right now I'm looking into either the Rat-7 or the RTAK-II with a Gerber LMF-II for a smaller knife back-up. The way I see it I could buy all three and still have plenty of cash left over if I leave Bear's Bailey out of the equation.
 
skammer said:
Living off the land and combat survival is 2 entirely different things, sometimes they overlap for brief periods.

A part time SAS reservist for a couple yrs is not a full SAS operator by any stretch no matter how you spin it.
Skam
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The theme of Man vs. Wild is to get out of the "situation" alive. There is nothing that implies that Bear Grylls is there to stay longer than the amount of time it takes to find "help" or a road, or a phone, or whatever.

Based on the information available, Grylls was in the SAS for three years before his parachute accident. How many more years does one need to be in the SAS before they are considered "full SAS operators?"

If he's a fraud it won't be based on his military background.
 
Lets face it, there is very little reality on tv. The Crocodile Hunter always found the critters he was searching for, even if he was thousands of miles from home. Do you think that none of that was staged? It certainly didn't detract from the educational or entertainment value of the show. And it beats watching Paris and Nicole shopping on Rodeo Ave.

GB
 
m_calingo said:
Based on the information available, Grylls was in the SAS for three years before his parachute accident. How many more years does one need to be in the SAS before they are considered "full SAS operators?"

If he's a fraud it won't be based on his military background.
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He was the equivalant of the national guard with an SAS title, hardly a battle hardened shooter. And only for a couple years:rolleyes: . How does this add up to what the show advertises as his credentials? It doesn't.

Research before drawing conclusions.You are buying into the marketing machine BS of the highest order.

Skam
 
Gerberblades said:
Lets face it, there is very little reality on tv. The Crocodile Hunter always found the critters he was searching for, even if he was thousands of miles from home. Do you think that none of that was staged?
GB
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Steve, never claimed to be the expert in saving lives, it was an animal show hardly the same thing.

Skam
 
skammer said:
Steve, never claimed to be the expert in saving lives, it was an animal show hardly the same thing.

Skam
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Thats not my point. Steve claimed to be a wildlife expert, which he was. But he did not simply stumble upon all of those animals he handled. The scenes were often staged as they are in MvW. It was never much of an issue.

Is Bear Grylls the world's foremost authority on wilderness survival? Probably not.
But hes the guy on tv. As long as viewers find the show entertaining, he'll be there.

GB
 
OK! I should have been more specificate in my last post, not the brand or type but I guess the big problem I have is he uses 50/50 knives usually partial serrated and partial plain edge. I don't think this is a good choice for survival, that was the point I was trying to make so I stand by his knife choices are poor based on blade choice.

RickJ
 
RickJ said:
OK! I should have been more specificate in my last post, not the brand or type but I guess the big problem I have is he uses 50/50 knives usually partial serrated and partial plain edge. I don't think this is a good choice for survival, that was the point I was trying to make so I stand by his knife choices are poor based on blade choice.

RickJ
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What makes you think that? SE lasts longer between sharpening which is good if you are without a sharpening stick. The number 1and 2 complaints about SE is it is hard to sharpen (for some) and doesn't cut pretty. Neither is a concern when you are living long enough to be found/rescued. On the other hand you get some PE that most can at least touch up on a rock should be end up playing Tom Hanks on an Island for extended periods. YMMV
 
skammer said:
He was the equivalant of the national guard with an SAS title, hardly a battle hardened shooter. And only for a couple years:rolleyes: . How does this add up to what the show advertises as his credentials? It doesn't.

Research before drawing conclusions.You are buying into the marketing machine BS of the highest order.

Skam
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So, what you are saying is that British SAS soldiers are not trained in survival? In addition to that you are also stating that after 2-3 years in the military, with an SAS title, Bear Grylls knows less about survival than the average civilian living in most U.S. cities?

I'm not saying he is the ultimate expert on everything there is in survival. Even on his own show, there is credit given to their "survival expert."

I will admit I'm no expert myself as to how the Brits run their military system. However, having said that, if it is run like the military in the U.S., SAS troops have to go through survival training.

If it's different, please supply the links to prove your point.
 
m_calingo said:
So, what you are saying is that British SAS soldiers are not trained in survival? In addition to that you are also stating that after 2-3 years in the military, with an SAS title, Bear Grylls knows less about survival than the average civilian living in most U.S. cities?

I'm not saying he is the ultimate expert on everything there is in survival. Even on his own show, there is credit given to their "survival expert."

I will admit I'm no expert myself as to how the Brits run their military system. However, having said that, if it is run like the military in the U.S., SAS troops have to go through survival training.

If it's different, please supply the links to prove your point.
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m calingo I'm not arguing against you or for you but this raises an interesting question. So far that darn Wiki paints the best picture: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_Air_Service

From what I can tell Skammer saying he was essentially in the reserves is correct. You can join 21 SAS directly from civilian life. If you are in 21 SAS for 18 months then you can attempt to get into 22 SAS which is the regular unit.

Of particular interest is the selection and training part:

Selection is reputed to be the most demanding military training course in the British Army with a reported pass rate of less than 10%. It is a test of strength, endurance, and resolve over the Brecon Beacons and Elan Valley in Wales, and in the jungle of Brunei, taking around 6 months to complete.

Selection is held twice a year regardless of conditions. A candidate must be male and have been a regular member of the Armed Forces for at least three years or a member of 21 SAS or 23 SAS (which can be joined directly from civilian life) for at least 18 months. All soldiers who apply must have at least 39 months of military service remaining and to be eligible for selection the candidate must not exceed 32 years of age. A candidate who fails any stage of the selection is 'Returned to [his parent] Unit' (RTU'd). Candidates are allowed only two attempts at selection, after which they may never reapply. Many are not even allowed that.

Like other sections of the British armed forces, the SAS accepts members from the Commonwealth and The Republic of Ireland, with notable representation from Fiji, the former Rhodesia, New Zealand and Australia. The Parachute Regiment is frequently the SAS's main recruiting area.

The selection phase can be broken down in to three main sections: 1) Physical endurance 2) Combat 3) Survival and evading capture



Bear wasn't in the "real" SAS. Once you pass the test then you get all the training SAS is legendary for. However the question remains what sort of training does a soldier get in 21 SAS? Obviously something as he was hurt in 21 SAS during parachuting...

the search continues.
 
http://www.eliteukforces.info/special-air-service/

The above link is supposed to be the SAS homepage which confirms 22 SAS is the main unit and 21 SAS is a reserve unit. (see under organisation)

This next link http://www.specialoperations.com/Foreign/United_Kingdom/SAS/TA_SAS.htm

Gives some info on 21 SAS training. Survival training isn't really mentioned but some has to be included in some details (like jungle training). However this doesn't tell exactly which training Bear completed. Likely safe to say he has more than a regular army Joe, but less than a 22 SAS with a few years of training under his belt.
 
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