Beer

how about a vote for The King's Arms, in Oxford?

(even though, the first time I was there, the bartender asked me if I wanted ice cubes in my beer after hearing my accent)
:D
 
dunc5 said:
HHHHMMMM beer ,do you guys in the states get real ale or is it just us brits that drink it , its not fizzy and its not cold and it tastes great and not as may additives in it as lager ,Dont mind the odd Bud when the weather is hot but dont really go for the Stella act-a-twat stuff.
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Real ale is not commonly available in the states. The only place I have had it is the Toronado Pub in San Francisco. I think more places carry it than in the past but cellaring is an issue in most American pubs, plus a place would have to cater to a clientele with a more sophisticated palate than is common.
 
mycroftt said:
Real ale is not commonly available in the states. The only place I have had it is the Toronado Pub in San Francisco. I think more places carry it than in the past but cellaring is an issue in most American pubs, plus a place would have to cater to a clientele with a more sophisticated palate than is common.
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Hmmm, do you guys have some kind of non-standard definition of "ale"? Outside of the undrinkable industrial rice-corn beers (Bud, Miller, etc), ale is more readily available than lagers in this country. Most of the medium-sized and smaller breweries brew more ales than lagers, if they brew lagers at all. And not always in imitation of the European breweries; some of the better breweries here have created American styles or sub-styles of ales, e.g., APA, AIPA, etc. Any bar you go to that has selection beyond the industrial rice-corn beers, and also serves Sierra Nevada or whatever, will have plenty of ales.

Joe
 
mycroftt said:
[....]plus a place would have to cater to a clientele with a more sophisticated palate than is common.
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I think most people would love and demand good beer if they had the chance to try it and drink it for a while. Sadly, the worst beers are the most available and widespread.
 
Joe Talmadge said:
Hmmm, do you guys have some kind of non-standard definition of "ale"? Outside of the undrinkable industrial rice-corn beers (Bud, Miller, etc), ale is more readily available than lagers in this country. Most of the medium-sized and smaller breweries brew more ales than lagers, if they brew lagers at all. And not always in imitation of the European breweries; some of the better breweries here have created American styles or sub-styles of ales, e.g., APA, AIPA, etc. Any bar you go to that has selection beyond the industrial rice-corn beers, and also serves Sierra Nevada or whatever, will have plenty of ales.

Joe
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I suspect mycroft is referring specifically to REAL ALE, which is unfiltered, unpasteurized, unpressurized and served at cellar temperature via a hand pump. Not all drinking establishments, even in Britain, have a suitable old-fashioned cellar.

Andy
 
A.W.U.K. said:
I suspect mycroft is referring specifically to REAL ALE, which is unpasteurized, unpressurized and served at cellar temperature via a hand pump. Not all drinking establishments, even in Britain, have a suitable old-fashioned cellar.

Andy
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Yes, indeed - I was responding to the question about "real ale" which is specifically as described by A.W.U.K., rather than about ales in general. Drinking a real ale is quite an experience as one can notice subtle changes in the color, turbidity, carbonation, and even the flavor profile, as a gang of hearty fellows work their way through a cask.
 
Joe Talmadge said:
Hmmm, do you guys have some kind of non-standard definition of "ale"? Outside of the undrinkable industrial rice-corn beers (Bud, Miller, etc), ale is more readily available than lagers in this country. Most of the medium-sized and smaller breweries brew more ales than lagers, if they brew lagers at all. And not always in imitation of the European breweries; some of the better breweries here have created American styles or sub-styles of ales, e.g., APA, AIPA, etc. Any bar you go to that has selection beyond the industrial rice-corn beers, and also serves Sierra Nevada or whatever, will have plenty of ales.

Joe
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Ales are readily available, but not real ales (see other posts about that particular style). The term ale is used generaly to describe the beers produced by "top fermenting" yeasts, even though the fermentation actually occurs throughout the vessel and the yeasts rise to the top due to their tendecy not to flocculate, or drop out of suspension, as readily as the "bottom fermenting" or "lager" yeasts. The varying rates of flocculation are not well understood but are believed to be related to the tendencies of yeast strains to clump or not clump as well as genetic differences in cell-surface hydrophobicity.

What is well known is that the ale yeasts are generally much more "forgiving" of temperature variations during primary fermentation so they are preferred by homebrewers who do not have the facilities to tightly control temperature (like me :) ) as well as microbreweries and brewpubs of all stripes. I believe the ales produce a more robust flavor profile and allow for greater experimentation with hops scheduling, too. Producing good lagers requires very tight control of temperature or your flavor profile will suffer badly from over-production of fruity esters.
 
Gotcha. I'd never heard the term "real ale" before, but I know the style you're talking about. I agree, it's not to find the hand-pumped variation you described. Oh well, another trip to the Toronado!

Joe
 
Yeah! The Toronado in SF is my favorite bar - I think it's all local stuff on the hand pumps, but very tasty, and $2.50 pints at lunch time (hey, that's cheap for SF!). For a more Olde World selection, the Mad Dog In the Fog across Haight Street has Guiness, Boddingtons, London Pride, Fullers, etc, etc.

For a while I got into the habit of going to the Mad Dog on Saturdays at 6:00 AM to watch the live Premier League football matches on the satellite (having a pint at 6:00 AM takes some getting used to, but I adjusted nicely). One day the satellite was acting up and it was all wavy lines when the match should have been on. Someone walked in, saw that the satellite was screwed up and remarked "Well, at least the taps are working." Cheers!
 
Looking at the listing on the Toronado website it appears that the handpumped stuff is all American right now. The lineup changes regularly at the Toronado, though, and I have seen British real ales (and quaffed them) there - you never know what will turn up there. I'd like to try the handpumped American ales and see how they measure up to the British real ales but, alas, I haven't been to the Toronado in 3 or 4 years.

I wonder if the guy still sells the sausages next door.
 
Yes, the sausage shop is going strong. Tuesday is hamburger day, and they make some of the tastiest burgers I've ever had.
 
Julian Elliot said:
Yes, the sausage shop is going strong. Tuesday is hamburger day, and they make some of the tastiest burgers I've ever had.
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Jullian, we must have crossed paths on the lower Haight at one time or another. I have a flat on Divisadero and Oak for when I'm working in SF and drop by the Toronado for a pint and a sausage next door at least once a week.
 
Drifting a little off topic, but if you SF local guys can find a place near there where we can find a private room, we can try to pull together an SF-local knife show-and-tell get-together, followed by beer-and-sausages. Knives, beer, and sausages, can't imagine a better day!
 
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