Benchmade Inflation

[bpeezer]

Emerson sells a few hundred thousand knives a year without being in any big box stores???

Is that a guess?

Maybe he meant a few hundred thousand dollars worth of knives? I can't possibly imagine that Emerson sells hundreds of thousands of knives in a single year

 

[pbcg]

But Mannlicher, the new pricing edict Benchmade has enacted will not make them more money. They're simply telling dealers that they can no longer sell to consumers at discounted prices. They're not charging those dealers more for the inventory they buy from BM. This policy does not/can not equate to more money in BM's pocket. It does, however, alienate a large portion of their base customers IMO which could, and probably will, actually end up making them less money.

I don't think any of us would be complaining if BM would've raised prices slightly due to increased production costs, but this simply is not the case. I don't know if they're trying to artificially inflate the value of their brand, or if this is an odd strategy to even the playing field among their retailers, but in the current economy where money is tight it seems like a bad idea, or piss poor timing at the very least.

I agrre with you and Saintly Brees.

I think it was a couple years ago that Cold Steel announced that they were going to be forced to raise their prices across the board due to increased manufacturing costs. That labor, materials, and everything else had been steadily raising and they could no longer remain profitable without increasing their prices
That they had held off as long as they could but had no choice.

They sent out flyer's, e-mails and posted it on their site. Then one day, overnight that $50+ Recon 1 just became a $70+ Recon 1 along with everything else.That's a pretty substantial increase but there didn't seem to be much push back.

I think people understood that the cost of thing's had gone up and they were doing what they had to do to maintain the bottom line and stay in business and the company was up front about it.

This is very different as there is no increase in production costs or profits, at least not claimed byBM.

If they are in fact doing this as suggested to support their B&M dealers, although I think misguided at least it has a hint of nobility to it. If it's just that some "Marketing Guru" or head of the company decided that this was a good time make BM have a "perceived" higher value, or take them to a higher level of value without actually increasing the quality and materials, then that's a harder pill to swallow. At least for me.

Perhaps it's both as Saintly Brees and others suggested but I think they would have been better served doing so incrementally and on future releases. Not with currently in production models that are already on the shelves. Very poor decision in my opinion.

The causal or new buyer may not even notice the difference or even care, but the hardcore base of fans and enthusiasts who have been buying multiple BM knives for years for their use and collections sure do! We are being effected the most and in a big way. We may represent smallest group or share of the market but I have to say their "Statement" was frankly an insult to my inelegance and an affront to all the loyal, long time fans.

My loyalties are not really feeling very appreciated at the moment because of this new policy. It's their company and they can do what they want.

Guess we'll see in a year or so how this all pans out for them.

I doubt it but I hope Benchmade is listening because I think they are in real danger of alienating some of their biggest's supporters and loyal fans. .

 

[JNewell]

Emerson and Strider are - IMHO - false comparisons, at least in real life. We could debate (and it's been done and done and done and over-done here) whether Strider and Emerson knives are worth the tariff. However, it's beyond debate - IMHO - that they enjoy a sort of consumer image that supports their price. Face facts: Benchmade does not have that sort of image, and simply raising retail prices is simply not, repeat: NOT, going to change that image or support these price points. I love Benchmade, I have been buying Benchmade knives for longer than some people posting here have been alive, but this is not their home territory in the knife marketplace, and I doubt very much that arbitrarily raising prices is going to change that in our lifetime.

 

[Moxy]

First post in this thread, just my $.02 here but I get nearly all my knives either here on the forum or on eBay. Yeah, eBay. I know many don't like eBay, but so long as you buy from sellers with alot of positive feedback I don't think you have any thing to worry about. There are alot of "mom and pop" stores that now work though eBay and I've always been able to find production knives that are on average 10-20% cheaper than other online retailers. Just search by lowest price first and buy the fist one that looks good. I've been doing that for a year and never had a problem. As far as I can tell the Benchmade markup isn't affecting all the sellers on eBay. And since they're all competing with each other to sell you the same product, there is a substantial incentive for them to keep their prices as low as possible. So my point is, take a look at eBay and I guarantee you'll find what you want cheaper than anywhere else.

As far as reputation goes, I don't give a s#$%. I care about the intrinsic qualities only. Benchmade knives are fantastic in quality. In my opinion Strider Knives are also fantastic and well made. Emerson is crap.

 

[jbmonkey]

Been thinking about this. Seems the dealers selling close to MSRP prices were the big box stores...aka Cabelas and such. Besides some mom and pops places. Course what those little dealers think doesn't matter. I'll bet the big box stores put big time pressure on benchmade and the caved in cause its a big piece of their sales. I could be wrong. ...but sure seems the boxers like cabelas, etc are much more competitive now.

 

[CrialJLA]

Benchmade will quickly learn that consumers do not respond well towards price-hikes. In this case, BM seems to want venders to sell their items closer to MSRP. I am not sure what the reasoning behind this is. Looks like I won't be buying any Benchmades in the near future. They're asking $180 for a 470, give me a break.

 

[cncpro11]

Maybe he meant a few hundred thousand dollars worth of knives? I can't possibly imagine that Emerson sells hundreds of thousands of knives in a single year

Wikipedia shows EKI's annual revenue at $10 million.
I suck at math but for a small privately owned company with about 25 employees, that's a lot of knives.

 

[RamZar]

Wikipedia shows EKI's annual revenue at $10 million.
I suck at math but for a small privately owned company with about 25 employees, that's a lot of knives.

More like $1.1 million in annual revenues for Emerson Knives, Inc. in Harbor City, CA. This is data from D&B which incidentally has Benchmade at $20.1 million in annual revenue.

 

[bpeezer]

Wikipedia shows EKI's annual revenue at $10 million.
I suck at math but for a small privately owned company with about 25 employees, that's a lot of knives.

I'd hazard a guess that a good portion of their revenue is from licensing the Wave feature to companies like Spyderco. Besides that, I would be willing to bet that they bring in a good chunk of change with the training DVDs, accessories, and apparel. Also, if Emerson knives sell for an average of $150 (seems conservative enough to me) then that would put their sales at approximately 67,000 knives to get $10 million. But even that would be assuming that all revenue is due solely to knife sales, which it isn't.

EDIT: All that crap aside, yes that is still a lot of knives

 

[cncpro11]

I'd hazard a guess that a good portion of their revenue is from licensing the Wave feature to companies like Spyderco. Besides that, I would be willing to bet that they bring in a good chunk of change with the training DVDs, accessories, and apparel. Also, if Emerson knives sell for an average of $150 (seems conservative enough to me) then that would put their sales at approximately 67,000 knives to get $10 million. But even that would be assuming that all revenue is due solely to knife sales, which it isn't.

EDIT: All that crap aside, yes that is still a lot of knives

Agreed.
He does have a lot of things going on under the EKI banner, but my point was that they do fine with their overpriced knives even though many here on the forum don't support them, as I am sure Benchmade will too.
As RemZar pointed out they are around $20 million annually so a few guys on BFC threatening to quit buying isn't going to affect their bottom line.
I am a fan of Benchmade and will continue to buy their knives, but I think their absence from this conversation shows that they may have factored in the loss of sales from guys like us and decided it was a non issue.

 

[cncpro11]

More like $1.1 million in annual revenues for Emerson Knives, Inc. in Harbor City, CA. This is data from D&B which incidentally has Benchmade at $20.1 million in annual revenue.

Here is a quote from a July 2006 article by Mark Fritz of the Wall Street Journal. I added a link to the entire article if you are interested.

Mr. Emerson, 51 years old, says he insisted on selling that knife for $159, believing the high price, performance and custom look would give it cachet. The knife was a hit, and competition got hot. Mr. Emerson formed his own company in 1997 and says annual sales rose to about $10 million last year from $800,000 at the start.

http://www.post-gazette.com/busines...ome-a-1-billion-business/stories/200607250128

 

[bld522]

First post in this thread, just my $.02 here but I get nearly all my knives either here on the forum or on eBay. Yeah, eBay. I know many don't like eBay, but so long as you buy from sellers with alot of positive feedback I don't think you have any thing to worry about. There are alot of "mom and pop" stores that now work though eBay and I've always been able to find production knives that are on average 10-20% cheaper than other online retailers. Just search by lowest price first and buy the fist one that looks good. I've been doing that for a year and never had a problem. As far as I can tell the Benchmade markup isn't affecting all the sellers on eBay. And since they're all competing with each other to sell you the same product, there is a substantial incentive for them to keep their prices as low as possible. So my point is, take a look at eBay and I guarantee you'll find what you want cheaper than anywhere else.

This^^^

To me, the definition of "street price" is the lowest price I can find from a reputable eBay seller for a knife I want to buy. That doesn't mean I'll always buy a knife I'm interested in from a reputable eBay seller with the lowest price, but it gives me the basis for determining what a "fair price" ought to be. Until such time that Benchmade's MAP pricing policy affects the lowest prices for its products posted by reputable eBay sellers, I'm not going to get my knickers in a twist. Benchmade would do well to remember Proverbs 11:29, however.

 

[RevDevil]

Here is a quote from a July 2006 article by Mark Fritz of the Wall Street Journal. I added a link to the entire article if you are interested.

Mr. Emerson, 51 years old, says he insisted on selling that knife for $159, believing the high price, performance and custom look would give it cachet. The knife was a hit, and competition got hot. Mr. Emerson formed his own company in 1997 and says annual sales rose to about $10 million last year from $800,000 at the start.

http://www.post-gazette.com/busines...ome-a-1-billion-business/stories/200607250128

That includes stickers, clips, t shirts, classes, shot glasses, and all the other marketing stuff sold.

 

[cncpro11]

^^^ Absolutely, no doubt the guy is a marketing wiz.
His logo apparel is even more outrageously priced than his knives.

I have a skull pocket clip on my Super Commander that cost $185!

 

[RevDevil]

I've seen them, incredible.

 

[RamZar]

Here is a quote from a July 2006 article by Mark Fritz of the Wall Street Journal. I added a link to the entire article if you are interested.

Mr. Emerson, 51 years old, says he insisted on selling that knife for $159, believing the high price, performance and custom look would give it cachet. The knife was a hit, and competition got hot. Mr. Emerson formed his own company in 1997 and says annual sales rose to about $10 million last year from $800,000 at the start.

http://www.post-gazette.com/busines...ome-a-1-billion-business/stories/200607250128

For what it's worth, I also searched InfoUSA Business Lookup and that one says annual sales of $2.5-$5million. Both have it at 20 employees.

My Emerson Commander is still one of my first batch of folders back in the Fall of 2005. My favorite these days is the A-100 Mini with a 3" spearpoint blade.

 

[jac_solar]

Emerson sells a few hundred thousand knives a year without being in any big box stores???

Is that a guess?

Yeah, that's pretty extreme. If true, how much do the other, more "mainstream" companies sell - like Spyderco, Kershaw, Gerber, Schrade, Buck?

 

[anthony cheeseboro]

If Benchmade is following the Emerson model, I will probably end up buying as many Benchmades as I do Emersons!

Hint: I have no Emersons.

 

[jac_solar]

By the way, Production Knives seems to be having a Benchmade sale:

http://production-knives.com/index.php?app=ecom&ns=catshow&ref=benchmade-knives

 

[skyhorse]

Benchmade Pardue 530-901 Benchmade Pardue 530-901 Regularly: $130.00 On Sale: $0.00 Best price out there. ( Not a B/F dealer )