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Blade play? on Delica

donnord

Gold Member
Joined
Dec 22, 2007
Messages
451
I used my Superblue Delica to prepare peppers, tomatoes, onions, and meat for chili. While slicing the peppers I could feel slight blade or lock play in the vertical direction. Is this normal for Delicas. My Chaparral has the same locking system and zero vertical play.
 
Not unusual for Delica/most backlocks. Chap has an internal stop pin on the blade for added stability and locks up extremely secure compared to the average backlock.
 
A tiny amount is typical for Spyderco.

Nothing to worry about.
 
There are two Delicas in my quiver and as of today with the most recent Chaparral that was on sale there are four Chaparrals in my possession. Like yours the Delicas both have some rock when locked and under cutting pressure. All the Chaparrals have zero play in any direction and lock up like a bank vault. The precision and genius build of the Chaparral, not to mention the thin and extremely slicey blade, makes it my most used pocket knife and finds a place in my pocket or pack more than any other. And Delicas ain’t bad. The Chaparral is a masterpiece and with a little break in has the feel of a custom.
 
I am understanding that this is a not uncommon issue and will not affect the safety or functionality of the knife. I like the super blue steel and I'm having fun putting a patina on it using it as a food prep blade. So I'll keep on using it.
 
Yes my latest Delica Burgandy PD#1 has a little .
Not long ago I bought two Man Bugs and they clunked pretty good when I cut against something .
If you are a natural mechanical genius you can get in there and file the lock bar a bit . Both of mine were no big deal . I haven't taken the time for my latest Delica yet .
 
Any advice on which area to file?
Bottom line added in here above all my BS further down that was my original replay :

OK I just finished doing my PD#1 Delica .
For most folks this won't be worth doing and I will get into why momentarily . Unless your lock up is unusually bad like my Man Bugs were then I would not bother filing your knife and even then maybe just send it in / send it back and get one that has very little slop and figure that is as good as it gets .

A tip : if you take your knife apart ; it is easier to disassemble if you take out the lock bar pivot post and the screw and remove the lock bar then disassemble the knife.

(remove the screw, push in on the lock bar at the pivot and push the pivot out with a blunt object that you can push in there )

It is easier to reassemble the knife if you leave the lock bar out and put the knife back together then push the lock bar into place against the spring with the blade open then insert the lock bar pivot post and then put the screw for that in. It is a good idea to have the end of the spring pushed all the way into the rectangular tunnel that captures the tail end of the spring .

I went a little nuts with this one and filed PAST THE NOTCH . Didn't make any real difference good or bad.
There is only so much that can be gained with filing this area .

I say for most folks this isn't worth doing because if you are like me you like a free pivot action , maybe even a drop shut action.
I found with this free / drop adjustment , part of the slop in the lock was from slop in the pivot . When I adjusted the pivot to have mostly zero play and so that I had to close the knife against my leg or use two hands then the slop in the lock was almost zero .
but
as soon as I relaxed the pivot for an easy wrist flick , like you see Eric do in new product videos , to partly swing the blade closed then there was a little noticeable lock rock when pressing down hard on a cutting board and once I adjusted it for drop shut ( just a degree or two counter clockwise on the pivot screw ) then I had more lock rock. Maybe less than I would have had before I filed it but no big woop .

Best blade pivot adjustment for minimal lock rock is to tighten the pivot firmly , close the blade almost all the way with the tip still out of the handle , loosen the pivot until the spring force over comes the pivot friction and the blade pops into the handle.

Another area of lock rock is if the lock bar pivot screw is not tightened down . Experiment with this also ..

OLD REPLY TO STILL SHOT BEFORE i OVERHAULED MY PD#1 DELICA :
I didn't say because I was afraid someone with more chutzpah than good judgement might file the wrong area .
On the lock bar , on the end that locks into the blade notch there is a tooth hanging down. Imagine this is a molar. The area where food would get masticated is where to file the tooth . On that surface there is a subtle kind of stepped area , at least there was on the last two I worked on. It is as if they did this intentionally to say to their workers file this area but don't go past the step or something bad might happen .

THAT IS A GUESS at why there is a step there .

I filed the step trying and fitting until the slop was just eliminated and no more .
Good luck.

Ope , senior moment see below after you read this .

PS : this is also the surface that runs on the rounded end of the blade tang while opening and closing the knife .
PPS : I just tested the last two I filed and there is still the slightest trace of play but at least not clunking while pressing down cutting against a cutting board.
I think from there it might take peaning / drawing out the metal there so if fills the notch in the blade more closely . Might make the area peened a bit brittle . Then you got to aneal it a bit . . . .
fun right ? ! ? !

My first thought is just hire people who can design stuff and manufacture stuff and quality control stuff .
In this day and age easier said than done .
I know they fired the main production / CADCAM guy years ago who ran off a thousand Sirens and they all had this problem . (I heard that straight from Sal in the forum)
My THREE Sirens are ALL PERFECT so maybe Sal or Eric stops in to manufacture those . . . don''t know .
 
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I MISSPOKE :
THE STEPPED AREA IS AT THE BOTTOM OF THE NOTCH IN THE BLADE
.
Same diff . File the blade . I used a square diamond file that fit down in there.
I just took my PD#1 Delica apart and noticed my messed up description .
 
.
Not unusual for Delica/most backlocks. Chap has an internal stop pin on the blade for added stability and locks up extremely secure compared to the average backlock.
I totally agree now after knocking myself out on this PD#1.
It's a shame .
 
I tightened up the lock bar and blade pivots a little, it did help a bit but play is still there on my wife's pink delica. I think she might kill me if I try to modify it but she's not a heavy user. If it was mine I might give it a go. I suppose I could always pick up an all black vg10 one and swap the scales but then she'd be losing her nicer s30v blade.
 
I tightened up the lock bar and blade pivots a little, it did help a bit but play is still there on my wife's pink delica. I think she might kill me if I try to modify it but she's not a heavy user. If it was mine I might give it a go. I suppose I could always pick up an all black vg10 one and swap the scales but then she'd be losing her nicer s30v blade.
haha my twisted brain read : I think she might kill me if I try to modify it but she's not too heavy so I think I can take her .
sorry , sorry .
Back to reality .
How "handy" are you ? Do you have and use high quality prick punches and center punches for precision layout and drilling that sort of thing ?
if so . . .
I hesitate to say it because I have not done this to a Delica . . . yet . . .
you know . . .
if one were to first prick punch just behind the flat area at the notch in the blade right near the jimping , then using that prick punch mark to locate a center punch and whamp it enough to move a micro amount of the metal toward the notch in the blade . . . and . . . do this on both sides of the blade (fairly the same on both sides) . . .
then
dare I say
do the same on the tooth of the lock bar up near the spine of the bar . . . on both sides . . .
That might move enough metal to make a difference and still not requre anealing . From filing this last blade notch bottom I found that the tang was , perhaps , not as hard as the blade (had been annealed there) . . .
meaning easier to punch and move metal and not so hard that punching would create an overly brittle zone .

I may try this on mine today and report back .
Eating a big bowl of fruit and yogurt and croissant with a gallon of coffee at the moment (and checking up on all the other posts today) so could be a while until I can make it down to the shop.
 
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NO !
GO BACK !
this way only lies monsters , madness and doom !

so anyway . . .
Don't do the peen peen (upsetting of the metal in the lock bar) .
This is complete folly .

On the positive side I did learn that the blade tang is so hard that it can completly blunt a best quality Starrett prick punch !
Flattened that nice , precise point right out.
The blade ?
The black coating on the blade tang hardly noticed it . Kind of "oh , I thought I felt something . . . hmmmm must have been a mustache hair that bounced off me . Oh well . "

"fortunately" I had already completed the punching on the lock bar; which is quite workable ; easily punched , easily upset to move metal , easily filed . . .
over and over and over and over testing the action all the way . Fortunately the end of the lock bar where I upset it was accessable with the blade moslty closed and I didn't have to take the knife apart each time I filed.

I set the pivot so there was quite a bit of friction but the spring could still close the blade . I could still flick it open with my thumb readily enough .
After each time I filed and tested the action I dyed the end of the bar with layout die , flicked it hard a few times , tested the action and file again then dyed again.

This is not the way to solve the problem with this pivot system / bolt / tolerances .

I now believe that any play we feel is an oscillation where the lock bar and spring pushes the slop in the pivot one way and then when we push down to cut something the pivot slops the other way .

Bottom line to fix this slop is a pivot machined to exactly fit in the handle / handle liners with zero play . Probably a light press fit as they call it.

Look on the bright side this is the "reason" you have been looking for to buy a mini lathe and a mini mill .

as they say : I'm out .
 
The Chaparral doesn’t use Triad lock geometry. It has a standard lock back design with an internal stop pin(in blade) that uses the liners.The variants use different style cutouts to achieve the desired lock up.
1750948020983.jpeg
1750948378408.jpeg
 
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In DA 170'S photo see the nice fit up between the tooth on the lock bar and the notch in the blade ?
In the Delica the faces are more angular , but not in a "logical" way ; kind of : this corner hits here and that corner hits there with some gap at the rest of the face fit ups.
I kept hoping that from filing at the bottom of the notch in the blade the "wedge" on the lock bar would drop further into the notch and take up the play (as it pretty much looks like would happen on the Chap in the photo above ((taking into account that's not exactly what happens with the stop pin in this mix) .

[ PS : on the Delica the bottom of the tooth actually hits the blade at the bottom of the notch . In the photo of the Chap by DA 170 there is a spacious gap between tooth and bottom of notch in blade ]

On the Delica as the tooth moved further down into the notch the corners just hit in a different place but there was no actual wedge in notch fit up face to face . . . just corner to face . Kind of weird . In the same breath I suppose that keeps the "wedge" on the Delica from suddenly popping (squirting) out of the notch .

It seems the ultimate lock up is the pin in the Chap against the face of one component and one face of the lock bar against the blade tang .

OH WELL , I carried my PD #1 Delica all week with a little friction in the pivot but flickable with thumb to open AND AM PERFECTLY HAPPY WITH IT .

only get into slop when I start trying to get into the realm of drop shut ; not that important at all .

DA 170 : THANK YOU FOR THE PHOTOS
 
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