"BOSS Knives"

BladeSource

BladeSource

Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
8
Rob
I am new here. Had to sign up when I found your little corner of the forum.
I am a collector and an avid admirer of your work.
I ran across a web site that is taking orders for a new knife manufacture “BOSS Knives”
They are offering a Rob Siminoch Parasite Combo for $50.00. I assume this is a collaboration. Can you tell me any thing about the quality of this knife. And just who is “BOSS”
BS
 
Boss is a new line of knives from a Company that has been producing knives for a wile in CHina. Mike Turber (BF Founder) is basically the marketing director for this "new" company. He has convinced them to kill all their "knock off" style knives and to launch all new modles, with CRKT as the Target quality.

Rob is one of the Custom Designers that has contributed to this company, i have not herard too much about the folders but RW Clark and Trace Rinaldi have said that the fixed blades are top notch.

The full launch of the company is going to be at the SHOT show.
 
Thanks for the info. I am a part time knife dealer. I am going to contact them and see if I can get some of their product. I will let you know what I find out.
BS
 
At the price point, I do not think you will find a better knife. Heck even at a slightly higher price point.
 
Yeah Rob, Ron was there with me in Ontario Ca. at the facility after Blade Show... We were VERY impressed with the high level of fit and finish, on a knife that is so reasonably priced... The Parasite was really done well, and I was rather suprised!! Mike has something here.. I think knife buyers might as well know our names from the ground up!! I have something in the works for Mike myself..;)
 
Yep, sure did see it. Mighty nice. I am going to buy one. Probably the only way I will be able to afford a Simonich!

All thier prototypes were winners. Next year is going to be interesting to say the least.
 
I got to play around with one of the Lile #7 knives in the recent passaround and if the parasite has the same level of fit and finish that that little knife did it's gonna be a great knife to have. I dont know how Mike got that level of worksmanship out of china but I hope others follow his example.
 
I had the opportunity to speak with the President of “BOSS” Kevin Xie. Seems like a real class guy. They are totally committed to offering the highest quality possible at this price point. I got a half dozen of the Lile #7 for resale and one Tom Anderson “Wolf Pup” to stick in my pocket. The quality is excellent on both. The Rob Simonich “Parasite” is a month or two away. I have my order in for a dozen as well as the Lile “Sly II”.
I think that CRKT had better brace themselves for some real competition.

Rob; Any plans for future collaborations with these guys?
BS
 
And as some of you know, I seldom make 'Very Serious Posts'...so, please bear with me here...

I have a few pointed questions, but before I ask them, let me say this...

I've met Rob, Trace, and Ron. I like them, but more importantly, I like their knives. I intend to purchase some of their knives in the next year. But, I don't see any of their knives as 'collectibles'... I see them as 'user knives', through and through.

And, I've been really down on Mike Turber here, and on other forums. My rational was that I was of the impression that Mike was 'ripping off' designs, and making cheap knock-off's using cheap labor.

I didn't, (and still don't) see how this could be advantageous to anyone other than Mike. But, apparently, I was somewhat wrong in my assumtion, and it would appear that Mike does indeed have at least some support for his efforts.

Now, not knowing, or needing to know, what profit a maker will see on mass production of one of his/her designs; it would seem that at the $50-$75 price point it won't be much more than $5 per knife...again, not my business, nor my concern.

Which brings me to my question(s)...

If I, as a 'user', can buy a Rob/Trace/Ron designed (quality) 'user' knife for $50-$75, what reason would I have for spending $400 on a semi-custom/handmade/limited production knife from the 'maker', or even spending $200 for a 'mid-tech' knife?

And...What (positive) impact, if any, will Mike's knives have on other knife makers here in the US that don't/won't sign up to be on his 'team'?

I'm concerned guys...concerned that a little 'short term' gain, a little profit in your pockets, is going to screw up so many other makers livelyhood here.

Your thoughts? And remember, I'm being 'Very Serious' here...no BS responses please.

Mel
 
Well in a discussion I had in and e-mail with Trace he felt that it would bring his name into wider recognition. You must remember that collaberations have been done before I didnt know about guys like Emerson and Hammond and Ed Halligan until Benchmade and CRKT started making copies of thier work, then you've got the makers that sometimes cant keep up with demand Trace made a deal with TOP's to make armageddon's cause he has a wait of like a year or more, I'm sure Rob has the same problem thats why he came up with the mid-tech line. Another thing is theres diffrent levels of users, I would like to be able to buy an armageddon from Trace and a nordooh from Rob but I cant afford them and to be honest I'm not sure I ever will but I love the designs. Somebody might not want an armageddon that only had 1095 and wants to order the real deal, I might get the Boss parasite and decide that I want to get a real Simonich parasite knife and start saving for it. Last but not least Mike is at least paying them for the designs and giving them credit, I was looking threw my smoky mountain catalog and saw that frost had ripped off almost every single Strider design there is and many other ripoffs as well with no mention of the originaters.
 
Well here is the plan.

Right now the BOSS line is completly ran by me and I pretty much control the marketing direction and new products. My thoughts are that one way to reduce the cheap knock offs is to show the Chinese how business can be doen and that there is profit in the higher quality knives. We are actually succeeding in this arena and I have now got 3 factories to completely change their focus.

Let me answer you questions more specifically and not sound like a BS political leader here.

If I, as a 'user', can buy a Rob/Trace/Ron designed (quality) 'user' knife for $50-$75, what reason would I have for spending $400 on a semi-custom/handmade/limited production knife from the 'maker', or even spending $200 for a 'mid-tech' knife?
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This is no replacement for the real thing. Since Rob has been on board with Camillus I would venture a guess that he has received MORE business and interest in his knives than what you are suggesting. The more times someone sees a makers name out there the more he is likely to get a sale on his "REAL" stuff. Basically a person looking for a $50 Parasite is not going to be looking for a $400 real thing and vice versa. But I would bet good money that a person who buys a Parasite may later want the "Real" thing and not so much the other way around. Rob can correct me here but I have been selling knives for 20 years and this has been the pattern I have seen.

And...What (positive) impact, if any, will Mike's knives have on other knife makers here in the US that don't/won't sign up to be on his 'team'?
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The more people see custom knife makers names and the more we can educate them the better the entire industry looks. Collaborations are here to stay and they have been a HUGE success with only minor exceptions.

I am not sure where you got the impression that I was ripping off designs at all. Each maker we have is on board at their on call and can pull away whenver they want. I am trying to turn an entire industry around in China and as far as I know I am the only one doing it. Bet your ass their will be more when they see how successful we become over the next year. Also keep in mind many of the companies you now THINK are making their stuff here are IN FACT making their knives there, in China right next to mine. No ****!
 
As I was reading Mel’s post I was trying to formulate a response. Then I read Mike’s post.

Mike You said it all. I can’t add a word, except “Hear Hear”
BS
 
Melvin, I could write a book on this subject, but it would bore the piss out of you so i will make it as short and sweet as I can as I type really really slow. First

I didn't, (and still don't) see how this could be advantageous to anyone other than Mike.
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Melvin, you havent been around as long as a lot of us have either here in the forums or the Industry as a whole. I have been making knives for 20 years, selling knives I have made for 18 years. There are guys around like Kit Carson that have been doing it much much longer and there is one thing we all can agree on. Knifeforums, then Bladeforums were both founded by Mike Turber, (and Spark in Bladeforums case IIRC) There are many makers that have done a very brisk business because of Bladeforums, myself included. If I never ever see a dime from this project it will be ok with me as I feel that Bladeforums and Mike Turber and Spark have helped me out immensely and have never asked for a pat on the back or one penny from me. My measely $30 membership is beans compared to the free advertizing I have gotten here. However all that aside, the biggest benefit I see is that Mike is working hard and succeding in cuutting back the knockoffs that are comming out of Mainland China.


And...What (positive) impact, if any, will Mike's knives have on other knife makers here in the US that don't/won't sign up to be on his 'team'?
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Perhaps it will stop some knockoffs of their designs. Perhaps it will introduce many people to custom knives that have never heard of them before.

All the other questions have been answered quite nicely.
 
Melvin you ask some good questions, and the answers have been very interesting.

I have been a knife freak since I got my first "widdlin'" knife when I was probably 6 or 7 years old, and a gun freak since my grandpa's 30-06 bit my shoulder a couple years after that. In the years between then and now I have owned some really good stuff, and some pure junk. Some of the junk cost more than some of the good stuff, odd as it sounds.

Lots of folks have lazy minds and greedy hearts, and watch for products they can produce [or get produced] some place else for less money...problem is, they never pay the original working man or woman a nickel for the years they struggled to make the product something worth ripping off, or something that people in the buying public wanted to own. I was raised to believe these people get theirs in the end, and have seen to it a few times myself...with great joy :) Often times, this happens with an American product, ripped and taken to be mass produced by someone overseas...because the costs are far cheaper there. I won't buy that **** no matter how cheaply priced it is.

On the other hand, there are times when someone will open new markets to the original thinkers, and frankly, if the folks who had the idea first are with them in the project, it is all good. That is a product I will buy.

If Mike can swing some of the factories in China around to see that working in unison with the original makes them more money...and that is what turns the world...then maybe he will have succeeded in guiding some folks to the high road as opposed to the low. I hope Mike finds great success in doing that. If he does, everyone wins, original maker, Mike, buying public...again, it will all be good.

As for who will buy a $50 parasite vs. the real deal at a multiple in cost? I will buy both if I can swing it. Why? Because I think Rob is one of the good dudes out there, and his stuff is strong in design and manufacture. Some place along the line, he figured out what should be in a knife and followed it. It works. If he has one and I can buy it, we both walk with what we came for. On the lower priced ones, hey, the next generation knife-nut [little daughter in my case] needs to cut teeth on something, right? She can tote the $50 model and be tickled to have one like dad's. And, if life goes as history shows it will, when I lose my nice expensive one...I can borrow hers. :)

Good luck Mike, and continued success Rob, Trace, and all the good dudes busting ass so we have good tools and toys.
 
And thanks for the positive responses so far...still waiting for Trace and Ron to wade in though... ;)

Mike, I'm of the (new found) impression that your intentions are honorable; but the road to hell is paved with good intentions, etc...And, you still haven't convinced me that your efforts are going to be successful...

To wit; that you can single handedly convince the Chinese to 'make right' by American knife makers, is in my opinion, a delusional fallacy. And, as a knife 'user', I for one, am not going to buy a maker's knife if I can get a similar knife at a lower cost...as an example, I'm perfectly happy with my Benchmade versions of the Emerson CQC-7, and seriously doubt that I'll ever buy a 'real' Emerson.

Personally, I think the Chinese are going to cut you out of the picture just as soon as they can; and, I also think you're attempting to throw back the proverbial 'tide' with a pitchfork...talk with Ann Mar and/or Mike Stewart about predatorial business practices in the Orient for more info, just make sure you mention 'Sakai' if ya want to see sparks...

Rob, you're certainly right, we've only been 'into' knives for going on 3 years now...But, for 10 years I built serious small block Chevy's ('69 Chevelle SS, '68 Camaro RS/SS, and '69 Nova SS) that would 'wheelie in 2nd, chirp 4th, and hit 140MPH at the 1/2 mile mark...with 3.73/3.90 rear gears they'd run that speed all night across the Southern California desert, and they did.

During the following 10 years I collected 'Black' rifles, (AR/AK/H&K/FAL/Galil types)...and an obsession isn't really an obsession to a person with an obsessive personality disorder, to a person like myself...so, I fail to see your point, clearly.

As you can see from the pictures that I've posted here recently, 40 some-odd Randall's, a few dozen Al Mar SERE's and Applegate/Fairbairn daggers, along with the auto's and Horn's; knife collecting is my newest 'obsession'...lol

That said; quality is felt, when touched, by a person that recognizes quality...and 'time in the field' has very little to do with that recognition, IMNSHO.

That you care not as to whether or not you ever "make a dime out of this project" seems rather odd to me, as does the implication that you doing this as a 'returned favor' to Mike and/or Kevin too...but that's your business, as is your relationship with them, and isn't my concern.

So, my unanswered question remains, "And...what (positive) impact, if any, will Mike's knives have on other knife makers here in the US that don't/won't sign up to be on his 'team'?" (I'm afraid I don't agree with your premise Rob, so I'm asking the same question, again) ;)

Anyone else? I'm trying really, really hard here to 'get it', but alas, I'm kinda 'slow', and so I still don't get it...

Again, thanks for the civility guys, you've been great so far.

Mel

--edited fo' clarity--
 
Ditto what the others have said.

I would also like to add that Mike has taken alot of heat for having these made in China. From one stand point I can understand that feeling. However, Mike (at least from my conversation with him) is very concerned with improving the way things are done over there. There will be increased safety measures and better working standards. You will not see any children being worked to death and then thrown out on the street when they are to sick or injured to perform.

Anyone who knows me, knows that I am against government aid to these areas. However, I fully support private industry improving the lives of people who have very little control over what happens to them. If BOSS Knives can improve the well being of one factory of workers, it is worth standing behind.
 
Mel, we were typing at the same time so I missed your follow up.

First I want to say that I speak only for myself. My statements are not meant as a reflection on BOSS or any makers working with BOSS.

You know the likelyhood of Mike making any "BIG" changes are slim to none. But at least an effort is being made. It beats the heck out of sitting on the sidelines and complaining about calls.

As to how it will help makers who do not sign up? Who cares? Why should anyone be concerned about folks not involved? This is not Socialism. We do not take from the workers and give to the sitters. I believe that this will make money for all involved. But if your not involved.....all bets are off.

As to why someone would buy the custom knife when they can get the production knife.

The quality is good. But not to the level of the "real thing". You will also not be getting the same top grade steels as you would with the custom. This is to get folks feet wet. No one starts out with a Simonich or Anderson custom. They start out with a low end production knife. But now instead of getting a box with a knife. They will be getting a box with a knife and info on the maker who designed the knife. The makers contact info, web info etc. That is a big step up if you ask me.
 
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