Boy Scout Knives

The BSA training program for woods tools is called Totin' Chip.



Originally posted by Kampfjaeger
I remember being a Boy Scout in Virginia in the early '80s. My father had gotten me a sheath knife for my birthday and I chose to take it with me for one of our Scout camping trips. I had my Tote and Chip card and everything and the scoutmaster still was inclined to refuse to let me take it with me. My parents stated that it was ok with them, so he relented. All that weekend I felt a bit under the microscope. For cryin' out loud, a hatchet was part of our normal loadout. You would think that a sturdy sheath knife for going into the woods would be eminently reasonable.

Considering the popular trend these days, I highly doubt that I will encourage my sons to join (should I ever have any.)
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Originally posted by Rick1955
My first Boy Scout knife was a Sabre brand utility pocketknife.
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Me too! I still have it. These stag-like handle slabs are slowly giving out, and the blades are blackening, but she's still going strong.

My dad bought it for me when I became a scout, and confiscated it when I left after a few years. Once I grew some courage, I managed to steal it back from atop his bureau. And his bureau was almost taller than he was.

I knew I would be "get it" royally if discovered, but he either never noticed it was gone or decided to wait and see if I chopped my arm off or something. Some years later I used it in front of him without thinking, and he didn't say anything. Whew!
 
As a scoutmaster, knife nut, and generally pacifist quaker, I have a conflicted viewpoint here. I try to teach my scouts (and their parents!) that knives are mankind's oldest and most useful tool, and no one should be without one. I also teach safety and respect.

The official Guide to Safe Scouting states something to the effect that "Large Sheath Knives should be avoided" (full text of GtSS is
available from my troop site: www.folsoms.net/troop172/forms.htm This is stated, by the way, in the format that makes it an advisory, rather than a hard and fast rule. I teach safety with sheath knives, and allow my more mature (not necessarily older) scouts to carry them, with prior approval. Our camp, on the other hand, has a hard and fast rule against them. I think the big problem is goofy kids who can't resist trying to throw them. A hatchet is indeed available, but isn't carried on the belt of each scout :eek:

For some pictures of a Tote'n Chip class we ran, see www.folsoms.net/troop172/photos3.htm You become REAL cautious when you've got 30+ kids, who aren't your own, and you really don't know what they're like with sharp objects!

I have a pretty popular site with information on knot tying, and my most recent addition was a page on knives for knots, where I do suggest at least considering fixed blades. See www.folsoms.net/knots
 
Memories, memories!!!
Made it to Life Scout, way too close to Eagle, many regrets and a very looong story.
I started out in cubs with an Imperial Boy Scout utility (still have it!
Went on to a Schrade lockback LB7. A Western sheath knife. A Victorinox boy Scout utility. And recently I recieved a Buck Scoutlite lockback, I have yet to see another one. Does anyone know if they are very rare? I would appreciate any opinions.
Thanks,
Dwayne
 
I too an a adult Scouter, currently and Assistant Scoutmaster of a Boy Scout Troop and an Associate Advisor of a Venturing Crew. I also serve on our District Health and Safety Committee. I have been a Scoutmaster. I too am a knife knut, but not a pacifist. I believe that everyone should have the right to possess, carry and use a knive, at least a pocketknife.

At least in the Boy Scouts of America, we have a training program for knives and other woods tools. Called Totin' Chip this training requirement for a Boy Scout to earn the 2nd Class Rank (although many Scouts earn it much earlier). Basic requirments are to know and understand tools and associated safety rules, demonstrate the proper handling, care and use of a knife, axe, and saw; use those as tools and not playthings and obvserve safety rules when using them; respect property and subscribe to the Outdoor Code. Most units have their own training programs established along those lines. When I teach Totin' Chip, I give a lecture, demostration, conduct practical work with each tool, and then each person has to demonstrate the proper handling, care, and use of each tool and take a short written exam. Upon successful completion, they are given a card inidcating that the know all of that. I also actually read the state law about legal and illegal knives to the Scouts and Scouters - as knowing what is legal and illegal is a requirement. Some units do no allow Scouts, and in some cases, anyone from carrying or using knives and other woods tools until they have completed Totin' Chip. One District I was in - that was a District policy - everyone Scouts and adult Scouters had to have their Totin' Chip to carry or use a knife, axe or saw.

Personally, I would like to see the Totin' Chip program more formalized, requiring a lecture, demonstration, practical work, hands on demonstration and written exam for everyone to earn the Totin' Chip. I have seen some pretty weak Totin' Chip training over the years.

But again, at least the BSA has a training program.

It is correct that the BSA Health and Safety Guide does indicate that large sheath knives are to be "avoided" - which I think in most circumstances is a wise policy. And many Scout camps outright ban them. Some camps actually ban locking blade knives which is interesting because even some "official" BSA knives have locking blades. Seems to me a locking blade is "safer". I think in some cases that ban comes from Scouts who carry LARGE locking folders that when locked open are about the same as a large sheath knife.

I advise Scouts and Scouters a like to carry a pocketknife of their choice (as long as it is legal in the jurisdiction where they are located). And I think that if it is legal, a prepare person will carry a pocketknife. I read a saying somewhere that "a man without a knife cannot really be called a man" - maybe a good saying.

Very often at Scout activities, the subject of pocketknives comes up and before you know it, all the participants are pulling out their "carryin' knife" and showing it around. Pockeknives can provide a synergy. Personally, at Scouting activities, I carry a Camillus Official Deluxe Boy Scout Utility Pocketknife in a handmade beltpouch. A knife a a tool - nothing more or less - and a very valuable tool.

While there are times I and others have need and carry a sheath knife, for most Scouting activities, sheath knives are not needed. Same with axes. But we teach the Scouts how to use them. I grew up swinging an axe and I sometime cannot believe how difficult it is for some people to effectively and safely use and axe.

Scouting actually got me started with knives and I have carried and used one since I was 7. We should all push to keep our carryin' rights.

Amazing how many current and former Scouts there are on here!!!


Originally posted by folsom
As a scoutmaster, knife nut, and generally pacifist quaker, I have a conflicted viewpoint here. I try to teach my scouts (and their parents!) that knives are mankind's oldest and most useful tool, and no one should be without one. I also teach safety and respect.

The official Guide to Safe Scouting states something to the effect that "Large Sheath Knives should be avoided" (full text of GtSS is
available from my troop site: www.folsoms.net/troop172/forms.htm This is stated, by the way, in the format that makes it an advisory, rather than a hard and fast rule. I teach safety with sheath knives, and allow my more mature (not necessarily older) scouts to carry them, with prior approval. Our camp, on the other hand, has a hard and fast rule against them. I think the big problem is goofy kids who can't resist trying to throw them. A hatchet is indeed available, but isn't carried on the belt of each scout :eek:

For some pictures of a Tote'n Chip class we ran, see www.folsoms.net/troop172/photos3.htm You become REAL cautious when you've got 30+ kids, who aren't your own, and you really don't know what they're like with sharp objects!

I have a pretty popular site with information on knot tying, and my most recent addition was a page on knives for knots, where I do suggest at least considering fixed blades. See www.folsoms.net/knots
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I have never seen a Buck brand "official" Scout knife. Interesting.

All of my official Scout knifes are Camillus, Ulster, or Imperial.


Originally posted by Dwayne Puckett
Memories, memories!!!
Made it to Life Scout, way too close to Eagle, many regrets and a very looong story.
I started out in cubs with an Imperial Boy Scout utility (still have it!
Went on to a Schrade lockback LB7. A Western sheath knife. A Victorinox boy Scout utility. And recently I recieved a Buck Scoutlite lockback, I have yet to see another one. Does anyone know if they are very rare? I would appreciate any opinions.
Thanks,
Dwayne
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Hello again,
Concerning that Buck ScoutLite:
I have the box, it has the official scout sign and says official knife/ Boy Scouts of America. It is a Model 412. Has a nylon sheath with velcro closure. The knife itself has red plastic (material??) sides and a clip point blade.
Pretty nifty knife overall.
I will try different lists to post this on, if anyone wants to know if I find anything out!!
Dwayne
 
It was a Ulster Boy Scout Knife that I thought was the best knife in the world.
 
Actually, official Boy Scout knives are pretty good knives. Especially true of the Camillus, Ulster, etc.

Originally posted by RattlerXX
It was a Ulster Boy Scout Knife that I thought was the best knife in the world.
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Another Eagle Scout here. While I had an official Ulster Boy Scout knife, I preferred my Case penknife. It did not chafe my thigh will in my pocket. Later I carried a Gerber Folding Hunter II on my belt. The way things are now, it's hard to believe I flew to Scandinavia and back for a World Jamboree with that Gerber.
 
Dwayne, Ed Holbrook's "Official Scout blades" has this information about the Buck 412; blade length 3", closed length 4 1/4", BSA # 1381, made 1985-1988. He also lists the Buck 414, blade length 2 3/4",closed length 3 3/4", BSA #1884, made 1986-1988.
I hope this helps.
John.
 
Thanks so much John, that helps a lot!
Even more interesting to know that there is more than one Buck Scout knife. Now I have to find that folder!!! the obsession for knives never ends does it?!! Its no wonder my normal moniker is Poorman. The wife never knows what to expect from me! One time a crkt companion, the next time a Busse Steele Heart!!!!!! Poor woman never lets her guard down!!
A good woman is hard to find! I really got lucky!
 
Where can Ed Holbrook's Official Scout Blades be found?

Thanks.

Originally posted by JohnF
Dwayne, Ed Holbrook's "Official Scout blades" has this information about the Buck 412; blade length 3", closed length 4 1/4", BSA # 1381, made 1985-1988. He also lists the Buck 414, blade length 2 3/4",closed length 3 3/4", BSA #1884, made 1986-1988.
I hope this helps.
John.
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Rick, I got my copy of "Official Scout Knives" from Knife World. It is spiral bound and self published by the author. It lists all kinds of Scout knives including folders, sheath knives, chow knives and axes. All models are dated and the photos are reasonably clear. I highly recommend it!
The phone number for Knife World is1-800-828-7751.
John.
 
Thanks. I'll check it out.

Bernard Levine has a nice section on Scout Knives in his book to, which I have to editions of.

You might want to check out the Virtual History of Totin' Chip I mentioned in a previous message. Very well done. Very interesting.
They have both the cards and the patched.

Thanks.

Originally posted by JohnF
Rick, I got my copy of "Official Scout Knives" from Knife World. It is spiral bound and self published by the author. It lists all kinds of Scout knives including folders, sheath knives, chow knives and axes. All models are dated and the photos are reasonably clear. I highly recommend it!
The phone number for Knife World is1-800-828-7751.
John.
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Many of you who are here, are familiar with the Boy Scouts and that they have a training program for woods tools, including knives, called Totin' Chip.Most units require Scouts to have their Totin' Chip before they are permitted to carry or use knives. Called their Totin' rights - the right to carry a knife in Scout activities.

Usually what the training involves is instruction in the proper handling, use and care of knives and other woods tools and then they must demonstrate that they can do those things. Then they are awarded a wallet card indicating that they are trained and agree to act accordingly.

Totin' Chip is an excellent means to instruct Scouts and Scouters in the proper handling, use, and care of knives.

When a Scout is observed violating the rules and what is taught in Totin' Chip, some have a corner cut from their Totin' Chip card - when all four corners are cut off, the card is taken and the Scout must be retrained before being given a new card. Some consider this harassment. I don't "cut corners". When I see a violation, I take the whole card and confiscate the knife or other tool. If it is one of my Scouts - he is required to be retrained before he gets his Totin' rights back - if it is another Scout, I take the card and knife to his Scouter and leave it to him to decide on the appropriate course of action.Usually, it only takes one time for this to happen and there is not another violation. Most boys, and all Scouts I know of really want to carry a pocketknife - so they generally behave with them.

I wish everyone carrying a knife had some type of training. There would be fewer problems.
 
Hey guys, good postings here. It appears lots of us in Blade Forums were or are Scouts. Lots of you cruise other areas of Blade Forums - if you find someone who was or is a Scout - please tell them about this posting area and get them to come on over and tell us about their Scouting experience - as related to knives.

As for me, I have been involved in Scouting for over 30 years. I was a Cub Scout, a Boy Scout, and Explorer Scout, and I have been an adult Scouter for many years.

I got my first pocketknife at age 7 in the Cub Scouts - so that I could carve my Pinewood Derby Car. It was a Sabre Brand 4 blade Scout type utilty knife. Not and official Scout knife but one that was similar. I still have that knife.

I got my Totin' Chip at age 11 in the Boy Scouts - still have it too. Had to take Totin' Chip training again as an adult as the District I was in required all Scouts and Scouters to be trained in their Totin' Chip program prior to handling, carrying, or using a knife and any of their Scout function. While I thought it was a little redundant - I did learn contact axemanship! I still have that card too. And a real nice Totin' Chip shirt pocket flap patch that I still wear on my uniform to this day.

I carry an official Deluxe Boy Scout Utility Pocketknife made by Camillus in a handmade leather belt pouch at Scout activities. I have several others including a standard Boy Scout Utility, a whittler, and a leaders knife and some others.

Seems like every time there is a Scout outing, discussions of knives begin, and knives are shown, opinions shared. It is good.
 
I carry a Camillus Deluxe Utility Style 4 Bladed pocketknife for Scout activies - in a handmade leather belt pouch. But I almost always have a "pocketknife" in my pocket too. Uusually a Schrade Old Timer Middleman Stockman or of late a two blade official Camillus Scout Leaders knife.

I usually don't carry much else - sometimes a Leatherman PST II or a BuckLite.

I am concerned about all of our carrying rights. In some jurisdictions, even Scout knives are illegal. Some units meet in schools where no one can carry a knife.

I am worried.

Originally posted by Colin Thompson
Another Eagle Scout here. While I had an official Ulster Boy Scout knife, I preferred my Case penknife. It did not chafe my thigh will in my pocket. Later I carried a Gerber Folding Hunter II on my belt. The way things are now, it's hard to believe I flew to Scandinavia and back for a World Jamboree with that Gerber.
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After reading and even writing some messages on Blade Forums about supporting our right to carry knives - Totin' Rights - especially for pocketknives, it occurred to me that perhaps those of us in Scouting would be a good group to voice our need to maintain our Totin' Rights.

Scouting has always been keen for pocketknives and many of our elected representatives, law enforcement, etc, are keen supporters of Scouting. Can we see Scouting without knives?

So I would like to suggest that those of us in Scouting make our voices heard about knife carry. Write to your elected representatives, talk to them if you happen to meet them. Tell them how important knives, especially pocketknives are as tools, not only in Scouting but in life in general.

Preserve our Totin' Rights!
 
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