Brand loyalty, or blindness? AKA, Ford vs. Chevy

Ah, thanks. That's been my impression as well; that there aren't very many quality manufacturers unless you're willing to spend hundreds of dollars.

From what I have read IM Corona are great, but again it is upwards of a hundred or so.

I have two, a Dupont XTend I got new from ebay for about $90 a while back, and a Dunhill Rollagas that I got a good deal from an authorised dealer who is also the largest US dealer for Dunhill pipes, no desire to get any more as I don't really smoke, just like the mechanics and history behind the lighter.
 
People do it for validation. They want to talk up what they have, and most of all they want you to want what they have. The thing is that whether it is a car, knife, gun, or just about any piece of equipment. 99.5% of the owners will never come anywhere near the limits of their gear. We are fortunate in the US at least that any vehicle or gear we buy will more than likely be over kill for our uses.
 
I have brand loyalty. i own no knives that are not made by KAI. i have 5 kershaws and one ZT. 4 of them are blems. i do not have a local knife store, and i have never picked up and used a knife before i bought it. the kershaws all work great, except my BLEM spec bump, and that is minor. if i ever need parts, i send them an e-mail, and 4 days later i have the parts to fix it. i am loyal to my brand, because they have treated me right.
 
Reminds me of a buddy that thinks no one makes better power tools than DeWalt.

As an odd side point, I wasn't a huge fan of DeWalt's past products, quality wise, until recently I picked up one of their new 12v line in the hardware store... my mind was immediately changed, and that is as it should be.

The only time it is different, is when a company has repeatedly shown itself to produce absolute garbage. Then I feel a brand bias is justified. Even so, if they redeem themselves at some point down the road, they definitely deserve a shot.

In computers, for example, it used to be that I wouldn't touch an MSI motherboard with a ten foot pole, and now they are one of my favorite manufacturers. They really turned their entire line around in a very short time.


Odd. None my friends think that way. Perhaps the trouble is you are counting the wrong folks as "friends".

I'd hang around here a spell before assuming that the majority of folks here think this way.

Not actually a friend, I just used that term so that he couldn't easily identify himself as the target of my discussion, if by some strange chance he were to mosey on by here.

On the second point, I never assumed so, and did not intend to imply anything about the usership of this forum with this thread. I've been here for many years, but only recently have registered and become active, as I've found it's time for me to find a new hobby, and new forum to reside in.

I'm only bringing this up as an interesting point, but making judgements on registration date or post count is a very similar trap to making judgements based upon a companies past, or potential future products or business decisions. Many times your judgements can be accurate, but often they are way off base, even though the original assumption was arguably justifiable.

Strangely enough, internet forums have taught me a lot about other aspects of life.
 
I pretty much just buy what I want to. Sometimes I buy brand x because I like it. Sometimes I buy brand y because I can afford it.
I don't live in an area that allows me to run downtown and handle too many knives, so a lot of times I am ordering based off specs, what I have already, and what I think the knife will be like.
I have some knives that feel better in hand than others but I could also butcher a deer with anyone of my knives if I needed to. I don't need a knife molded to my hand for me to use it.
I have my favorite brands just like everyone else but I also realize that most of it is preference. I do not hold one brand above them all and I am sick of the people that do.
 
Isn't that the truth... screw the looks, screw the price. Hell, it doesn't even have to cut anything, as long as the name of the steel sounds interesting.
That's true for some. For me though, I'm starting to get a grip on the specific properties of the steel I'm after. If the steel itself has proven to be exactly what I wanted in the past and is also hard to come by, is it so wrong for me to snatch up the first knife in that steel?
 
I think that that type of behavior is inherent on any type of enthusiast forum. In my case whether it be archery, hunting, or knives, you will see people that constantly exhibit the fanboy "bash all of the others" type behavior. Just by the nature of the type of people a dedicated forum would attract, the propensity for that behavior becomes much higher. There are internet cowboys on every forum - guys that have "over 20 knives" but can't produce a pic, to guys that can shoot a running deer at 80 yards with a longbow.

You just have to sort it out and skip over it. Everyone has different reasons for joining a forum, some want information to learn, some need to validate themselves, some need to feel better about their excessive spending habits (not every enthusiast is in this category, many have the means and their habits are not excessive).

You just have to realize that if enough people like a brand, there is probably a pretty good reason for it - and on the flip side, if a consumer has a bad experience with a brand (poor QC, bad Customer service, etc.) they will likely not buy the brand again or publicly bash them.

There are a few knife brands that I have always liked for one reason or another. I always had a bias against Spyderco - the only one I had ever held was a Delica. I didn't really like the way they looked, and I didn't like the plasticky handle of the Delica I tried. I never bashed on them, just chose not to buy any. I recently have purchased a couple (Gayle Bradley and a Manix 2) and I am really impressed with their fit and finish - just great knives that need to be held to appreciate. In my case it was one bad impression of a Delica that soured me on the entire brand. I don't have very many dealers close, so many of my purchases are internet based. The key is to educate yourself with an open mind. I am now a Spyderco fan, (along with Benchmade, Buck, Emerson, etc.).

Knives, guns, archery equipment, etc. are very personal items. Everyone's hand is different, arms are long, short, etc. and everyone's intended use is different.
 
In computers, for example, it used to be that I wouldn't touch an MSI motherboard with a ten foot pole, and now they are one of my favorite manufacturers. They really turned their entire line around in a very short time.

Nice to see some computer guys around here. :thumbup:
 
Personal opinion, You are running into a person (your friend) or people that are - Opinionated. They may be seemingly well educated, smart, intelligent BUT they are opinionated.
Not an admirable trait.
Doesn't make them bad people but it does make them difficult to have a relationship with.
They will argue totally indefensible points like; What is the best color OR the best food.
Arguments not worth having and if you disagree with them or God forbid ask them to justify their dogmatic opinion they will often times raise their voice become agitated and get personal.
- This is the best knife.
- Really-
-Yes
-Why is that
- You're Fat
Good luck! Bottom line, be secure in your choices and why you make them.
Let the Opinionated suffer in their own Hell because trust me, that is where they are.
 
I think a lot of it is advertising, hearsay and just general BS Hype.

There are people out there who think anything they buy is the best and everyone else should buy what they do and they will bash anything else.

There is a lot of keeping up with the Joneses in the world or people trying to one up the next person.

People are also sheep, they see some actor wearing something and they gotta have it, then their friends, coworkers etc wear it and they really gotta have it.

It's like flip flops and cargo shorts, I wouldn't be caught dead wearing either of them on my worst day ever, but we see people wearing them.

But then I am not into hero worship either, but that's another thread.... ;)

Absolutely right:thumbup:

When you think of the dozens of monstrously crap cars(many costly)that have been marketed successfully or endorsed by somebody in the public eye over the years, it really shows that people can be induced to buy almost anything and believe in it:barf: This is why I have contempt for the militant fanboy, it's just a form of brainwashing and consumer indoctrination. The kind of figure that if you say you've encountered poor service or shoddy quality from his pet brand, he'll take huge offence-personally-accuse you of lying or stirring up trouble etc. I like certain products,styles,brands of course but I treat each purchase on an individual basis, if it proves itself, excellent. If it doesn not then why pretend and why try to force your choice on others? That's not expertise, it's ignorance:D
 
So, I've been rather frustrated lately by certain interactions with people regarding knives. I'm going to leave brand names out of my post, because IMO it will just muddy the water.

How is it that some people are so entranced with brand name(s), that they are completely unable to make an objective assesment of quality versus value, and in some cases even willing to overlook horrible ergonomics and aesthetics to maintain brand loyalty?
Maybe he has different opinions/biases on what is "good" ergonomics and aesthetics
For example, I think the Tom Brown knife is REALLY ugly :eek:
tom_brown_tracker_1.jpg

Others think it is beautiful

If your are baffled
Take a look at this :)====>
Many of these biases are studied for how they affect belief formation, business decisions, and scientific research.
Anchoring – the common human tendency to rely too heavily, or "anchor," on one trait or piece of information when making decisions.
Attentional Bias – implicit cognitive bias defined as the tendency of emotionally salient stimuli in one's environment to preferentially draw and hold attention.
Bandwagon effect – the tendency to do (or believe) things because many other people do (or believe) the same. Related to groupthink and herd behavior.
Bias blind spot – the tendency to see oneself as less biased than other people.[2]
Choice-supportive bias – the tendency to remember one's choices as better than they actually were.
Confirmation bias – the tendency to search for or interpret information in a way that confirms one's preconceptions.[3]
Congruence bias – the tendency to test hypotheses exclusively through direct testing, in contrast to tests of possible alternative hypotheses.
Contrast effect – the enhancement or diminishing of a weight or other measurement when compared with a recently observed contrasting object.[4]
Denomination effect – the tendency to spend more money when it is denominated in small amounts (e.g. coins) rather than large amounts (e.g. bills).[5]
Distinction bias – the tendency to view two options as more dissimilar when evaluating them simultaneously than when evaluating them separately.[6]
Endowment effect – "the fact that people often demand much more to give up an object than they would be willing to pay to acquire it".[7]
Experimenter's or Expectation bias – the tendency for experimenters to believe, certify, and publish data that agree with their expectations for the outcome of an experiment, and to disbelieve, discard, or downgrade the corresponding weightings for data that appear to conflict with those expectations.[8]
Extraordinarity bias – the tendency to value an object more than others in the same category as a result of an extraordinarity of that object that does not, in itself, change the value.[citation needed]
Focusing effect – the tendency to place too much importance on one aspect of an event; causes error in accurately predicting the utility of a future outcome.[9]
Framing effect – drawing different conclusions from the same information, depending on how that information is presented.
Hostile media effect - the tendency to see a media report as being biased due to one's own strong partisan views.
Hyperbolic discounting – the tendency for people to have a stronger preference for more immediate payoffs relative to later payoffs, where the tendency increases the closer to the present both payoffs are.[10]
Illusion of control – the tendency to overestimate one's degree of influence over other external events.[11]
Impact bias – the tendency to overestimate the length or the intensity of the impact of future feeling states.[12]
Information bias – the tendency to seek information even when it cannot affect action.[13]
Interloper effect – the tendency to value third party consultation as objective, confirming, and without motive. Also consultation paradox, the conclusion that solutions proposed by existing personnel within an organization are less likely to receive support than from those recruited for that purpose.
Irrational escalation – the phenomenon where people justify increased investment in a decision, based on the cumulative prior investment, despite new evidence suggesting that the decision was probably wrong.
Loss aversion – "the disutility of giving up an object is greater than the utility associated with acquiring it".[14] (see also Sunk cost effects and Endowment effect).
Mere exposure effect – the tendency to express undue liking for things merely because of familiarity with them.[15]
Money illusion – the tendency to concentrate on the nominal (face value) of money rather than its value in terms of purchasing power.[16]
Moral credential effect – the tendency of a track record of non-prejudice to increase subsequent prejudice.
Negativity bias – the tendency to pay more attention and give more weight to negative than positive experiences or other kinds of information.
Neglect of probability – the tendency to completely disregard probability when making a decision under uncertainty.[17]
Normalcy bias – the refusal to plan for, or react to, a disaster which has never happened before.
Omission bias – the tendency to judge harmful actions as worse, or less moral, than equally harmful omissions (inactions).[18]
Outcome bias – the tendency to judge a decision by its eventual outcome instead of based on the quality of the decision at the time it was made.
Planning fallacy – the tendency to underestimate task-completion times.[12]
Post-purchase rationalization – the tendency to persuade oneself through rational argument that a purchase was a good value.
Pseudocertainty effect – the tendency to make risk-averse choices if the expected outcome is positive, but make risk-seeking choices to avoid negative outcomes.[19]
Reactance – the urge to do the opposite of what someone wants you to do out of a need to resist a perceived attempt to constrain your freedom of choice.
Restraint bias – the tendency to overestimate one's ability to show restraint in the face of temptation.
Selective perception – the tendency for expectations to affect perception.
Semmelweis reflex – the tendency to reject new evidence that contradicts an established paradigm.[20]
Social comparison bias – the tendency, when making hiring decisions, to favour potential candidates who don't compete with one's own particular strengths.[21]
Status quo bias – the tendency to like things to stay relatively the same (see also loss aversion, endowment effect, and system justification).[22][23]
Unit bias — the tendency to want to finish a given unit of a task or an item. Strong effects on the consumption of food in particular.[24]
Wishful thinking – the formation of beliefs and the making of decisions according to what is pleasing to imagine instead of by appeal to evidence or rationality.[25]
Zero-risk bias – preference for reducing a small risk to zero over a greater reduction in a larger risk.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cognitive_biases

Once a person is branded, they will defend their brand by finding flaws in the alternative choice and pointing out benefits in their own.

There are a number of cognitive biases which converge to create this behavior.
http://learnonethingaday.wordpress.com/2010/06/04/fanboyism-and-brand-loyalty/
Our theory of brand loyalty is summarized in Figure 1. Brand loyalty defined as a positively biased tendency contains three distinct dimensions.

The first dimension is the emotive tendency toward the brand.

The second dimension of brand loyalty is the evaluative tendency toward the brand.

The third dimension of brand loyalty is the behavioral tendency towards the brand.
http://www.acrwebsite.org/volumes/display.asp?id=5729

Confirmation Bias and Brand Loyalty

It's not that your buddy is stupid
It's just that he is biased
We all are in some way or another:o

The link between personal preferences, consumption, and the demand curve is one of the most complex relations in economics
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_choice
 
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