Budget Steels Your Good & Bad

Chris "Anagarika" said:
I heard some refer N690 as VG10 equivalents, which should be above BD1 in edge retention, assuming all by Spyderco standard HT. BD1 having slightly lower Carbon than the other two, but higher than AUS8. I like it (BD1) too.

Can steel experts confirm this?
Click to expand...

VG10 and N690 are almost identical in their composition; with the main differences are n690 having tighter tolerances and consistency, with a significantly higher chromium content, and VG10 having a wider tolerance in the alloying elements due large in part to the manufacturing processes.

Rather then a B = amount, it's a "between A and C"
This leaves room for more variance in vg10 from batch to batch, depending on what marks they hit within the thresholds.
Assuming proper heat treatment for both, a vg10 knife that hit all the high marks of carbon, chromium, vanadium, and molybednum would theoretically outperform an identical vg10 knife that was made hitting all the low marks. Not that it would be a "bad" steel all of a sudden, provided a proper HT it would still be good, but it would be "not quite as good" as another knife with the "same" steel but a more ideal composition

Keep in mind, small differences can make noticeable changes when alloying metals, so -0.1% carbon, -1% chromium, -0.2% vanadium, molybednum, and cobalt, in essence is a different alloy then one having all of those elements present in the higher amounts, even though both are within the vg10 threshold. It's not uncommon, the same issues apply for many alloyed steels, especially those which aren't using modern particle vacuum technologies; aus, cr-mov, 440, d2, etc... billet steel is just not as exact of a science when compared to particle steels which are more precise and consitent, though some top makers are still really good at keeping tight tolerances.

BD1 is also "similar", with tight tolerances it has slightly less carbon then low end vg10, slightly more chromium, 1/3 the moly, and no cobalt added, but a vaccuum melted steel creates a clean even distrubution...
 
Good: AUS-8 (Ontario), 8Cr13MoV (Spyderco), 420HC (Kershaw, Leatherman, Gerber), Sandvik 12C27Mod (Opinel), 9Cr18MoV (Schrade).

Bad: 8Cr14MoV (Kershaw, Real Steel), anything Gerber uses in their overseas-manufactured blades.

Maybe: X55CrMo14 (Victorinox - mixed results with this one), Sandvik 14C28N (despite Real Steel's 14C28N performing well for others, it isn't doing so well on my Real Steel T101 Thor. I'll experiment with it further. Recently put a damn near mirror polish on it, will see how it performs. Even VG-10 kind of sucked until I put a polished edge on it).
 
Very interesting discussion. I wouldn’t place some of the steels mentioned in the “budget“ category. Remember that we all have different budgets, so a millionaire may place a custom Tom Mayo folder in the budget category, while a blue collar middle class guy like myself thinks the Sebenza is a high dollar knife.
Anyway, we have a tendency to put steels in the budget category because the knives themselves are low cost. In some cases companies will use the same blade steel in an upgraded handle and charge a premium price for the knife. Companies like Sog, Casexx, Buck, and many others do this. Or you’ll see a “budget” steel being used in lower cost knives by one manufacturer, then another company will use the same steel and charge premium prices for their products. One example, Kershaw uses 14c28n Sandvik steel in several of their knives that fall under the 70 dollar price range. Then take a look at Southern Grinds Bad Monkey lineup, you will find 14c28n blade steel being used in 250 dollar knives.
IMO, a budget steel is one that is used exclusively in low cost low quality cutlery such as AUS 4, or 420j. However, I don’t know why a steel would fall into the budget category because it can be found in lower cost knives, when it can also be found in knives with premium prices.
 
Barman1 said:
Do not avoid the current Pattada!
Not a heavy duty piece, just an awesome slicer as designed.
And Italian made Spydercos might be my favorite...or maybe tied for first place in my lineup.
Click to expand...
The other reservation I have had is it is what I would call "thick" at the spine (3.5mm) but OH THAT HANDLE and OH THAT BLADE SHAPE ! ! !
I must have one . . . one day !
I just learned here today, or relearned because I forgot, duhhh . . . N690 is German steel ! I tend to like German alloys even the inexpensive stuff (Krupp 4116).
 
eugenechia1989 said:
Even VG-10 kind of sucked until I put a polished edge on it).
Click to expand...
OH YEAH BABY !
It just happens to be on my Grail. Works great for me. Not that I would turn down M4 if old Brad Zinker decided to make and send me an Urban Trapper in M4. But I am very pleased with my VG-10 with an Edge Pro Polished edge.
Before :
IMG_4179.JPG

And after :
(after all, one has to be able to hang onto that wild cat)
IMG_4233.JPG
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top