Buffers wow

H

hellgap

Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
1,189
well i went to the garage got my grinder and put a 6 inch buffing wheel on it i used some green polishing grit on the wheel and buffed my blade and sharpened the edge. I bought the fabric type and doesnt seem that dangerous yet LOL but im sure you shouldnt blink. I know you all warned me about how dangerous and stuff but hell i work on the rail road and have for 25 years all the tools there are dangerous and cutting off angle bolts with a 3 horse gas cut off abrasion saw freehand makes useing a buffer look pretty safe.It also helps to be trained in the use of all these tools too. So i buffed 3 knives to shine like SHAM WOW and i have no hair left on my right arm and right leg LOL I am left handed. Tommorrow ill buy another 6 inch for the other side of the grinder and a green stick and a white stick of polish for finishing. I am really impressed.T hanks for the warnings but i had to try after i went to a guys house to see his set up. kellyw
 
I have a buffer attachment at my belt grinder's drive wheel. I buff at really low speeds, at the lowest speed of my grinder (300-400 RPM). It takes long to buff the steel I know but to sharpen and to finish handles it is just fine. Also it is quite safe. I wouldn't dare to buff at high speeds no matter if I have enough experience. But I understand your satisfaction, I was speechless after I buffed my first knife and sharpened with a paper buffer. After I managed to throw a knife to the wall and it dived to the brick about 1/2 inch I never run my buffer at high speeds.
 
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The mind set that "it doesn't seem that dangerous" is not going to make it safer. An unloaded gun doesn't seem that dangerous, but we treat it as loaded for a reason.
 
Nitro glycerin isn't dangerous either until you get careless or something goes wrong. Take the often mentioned precautions, pay attention and everything will be fine. It only lakes a split second for the piece your shining to become a deadly projectile!
 
That angle grinder is indeed dangerous, but there is no tool as dangerous as a buffer imo. Just don't get complacant, and you should be ok.
 
hellgap said:
hell i work on the rail road and have for 25 years all the tools there are dangerous and cutting off angle bolts with a 3 horse gas cut off abrasion saw freehand makes useing a buffer look pretty safe.
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Using an angle grinder "feels" dangerous in comparison to the silent whirr of a buffer, but this is a VERY dangerous attitude to have. All those sparks and noise give the apperance of danger on the grinder....

The buffer is silent and soft and cuddly until you lose your concentration for a millisecond and it rips that blade out of your hands, spins it around the wheel and drives it through your chest before you even know it isnt in your hands anymore.

I messed up once and had my buffer catch an edge on a blade, and it drove that tinky 3" blade almost all the way through the top of my bench. If it had released it towards me, i might be posting from my coffin right now. I am so overly paranoid now that when I buff blades, I actually put a screw through one of the handle holes and screw it to a much larger board which I hold.
 
When I was at my last job I had machined a spacer block out of aluminum. It was 1" x 1", I had machined 0.092" off the heighth and then put a little slot in it to accept another part of an antenna. I had deburred the part and was just buffing it before finishing the task and moving on. THe buffer grabbed that little piece of aluminum, sucked it into the machine, blew it through a plywood shield I had made to protect myself, and slammed it into my belly just below my sternum. The force of the block when it hit me knocked me backward onto my back, knocked the wind out of me. I don't think I've ever been hit harder in my life. I had plywood (the shield was 1/2" C-D plywood) splinter in my face surrounding my goggles. I had a perfectly square bruize there for weeks.

Watcherass. Buffers kill.
 
my father was a buffer for a jeweler for years . His one moment of inattention caused the buff to grab a bracelet . It ended up twisting with his thumb in it until it cut his thumb off . That bracelet is hanging over my buffing station as a reminder of how dangerous it is no matter how much you think you know .
On your other post you thought you were good enough to beat a 3 min. epoxy , what happened there? Heed the warnings of experience .
 
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well said jack. when a more experienced person tells you not to do something, its a good idea to listen. and never try to make something if there is a product already on the market when it comes to buffing or polishing. what little money you might think you are saving could cost you more than money in the long run. here is the link to a shop safety sticky on buffers. http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=614065
 
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Reminds me of my last trip to Yellowstone, lots of signs in various languages warning people not to bother the buffalo. Some lady from Germany thought that the buffalo were cute and nice and decided to pet a calf. Guess who wasn't so cute and nice? Momma buffalo.

Just this weekend a friend on mine's father seriously hurt himself and possibly losing use of his thumbs due to a cut. He's a taxidermist and was caping a head, since he only had to do this one thing he didn't put on his kevlar gloves. While caping around the base of an antler, the knife slipped and basically filleted the palm of his hand and and thumb up to the pad. :barf: Luckily one of his sons was there to apply pressure and get him to a hospital.

Accidents happen all the time, that's why they're accidents. I've spent a lot of time around stuff that will hurt or kill you too, I'm sure a lot of us have, the reason we're not hurt or dead is a respectful attitude.
 
I was buffing a piece on a 7.5 horse buffer and a tiny slip of leather from the tip of the finger on my glove was just right to get caught on the threads of the nut holding on the wheel. All I felt was a little twitch, the piece was gone out of my hands and there's a whap whap whapping coming from the machine.

Once I realised the I wasn't holding the piece anymore, I shut down the machine and then I saw that the whap whap whapping was the glove from my right hand. I didn't even realize it had been pulled off my hand it happend so fast.

If anybody uses the big airway buffs, I've seen them come apart too, only once, out of hundreds of wheels but it goes to show that even the most careful person can be hornswaggled by machinery or equipment.

P.S.

As a side note, I just realized how lucky I was that the glove wasn't snug fitting and that the machine didn't just start twisting up my hand/arm like a pretzel.
 
From a similar thread the other day:

Buffing and polishing knives is like sex..........
Most people start out doing it by hand.
You are warned about the risks.....and somehow that made it more desirable.
Millions of people (in the case of knife buffing, maybe thousands) do it all the time with no problems.
You hear lots of stories ( usually uncorroborated ) from people about how great they are at it.....as well as how big and powerful their equipment is.
Both are taken up by totally inexperienced people who usually have no idea what they are doing. They are often get advise from people with little or no experience. They rarely heed the warnings of older and more experienced people.
Both become easier and more comfortable with practice. There-in may be the danger of becoming lax in preparation and protection.
The results are usually pleasing, but failure to use protection and planning can result in bad experiences....and yes, people have died from those mistakes.
The results were not usually as great as everyone led you to believe they would be.
As you get older and more experienced, you take it for granted.
As you get older and more experienced ,it take you a lot less time.
As you get older and more experienced, it is less exciting.
As you get older and more experienced you realize you have more control when you do it by hand.
All the above probably won't stop one person from trying either sex of buffing.

Stacy
 
any advice from the experts on how to use a buffer safely instead of just sharing horror stories?......ryan
 
ryan9977 said:
any advice from the experts on how to use a buffer safely instead of just sharing horror stories?......ryan
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I personally won't use one anymore. I used to use a buffer all the time and have never had a problem. But I've seen others end up with injuries and need medical treatment when I used to work in our bearing plants and steel mills.

Not using one, is my advice.
 
The best way to use a buffer..... Avoid it. I do the greater majority of my work by hand. I did the buffer route and had a few close calls. Now my buffer, though very large and powerful, it is also 3 phase and I run it very slow. Like has been pointed out in previous posts, pay close attention, wear proper safety equipment, and pay close attention. Then when you feel your mind wandering put down the piece and come back when you can pay attention.
 
A C Richards said:
Dag Nab It Scott, Beat me to it again.
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Sorry. The late bird gets the .........hmmmmmmmmm....something...:jerkit:

I also do all of my finish work by hand. I'm usually etching damascus or putting a mustard patina on. I even take those down to a 1200 grit finish by hand before etching or applying the mustard. It's amazing how the tiniest scratches will show up in an etched or patina'd finish.
 
ryan9977 said:
any advice from the experts on how to use a buffer safely instead of just sharing horror stories?......ryan
Click to expand...

Ryan, there is no guaranteed "safe" way to use a buffer...it is inherently dangerous. It is not a matter of "if" a piece will be yanked out of your hand, but more a matter of "when". It's amazing how quickly your butt can pucker in that split second. :)
That said, many pointers have been posted that help to minimize your hazards:
1) Buff only in the lower quadrant of the buff facing you. meaning, if it's rotating clockwise, from the 3 to 6 o'clock positions.
2) Don't crank down on the nut and tighten the buff to the shaft. Keep it a little loose. This will make it a little less grabby.
3) How you hold the piece to the wheel is important. Don't push edges in that the fabric can grab. In other words, points in the downward direction,
4) Don't push the piece heavily into a spiral or loose buff...let the compound do it's work. Plus, it generates less heat.
5) Something that I have never been able to comprehend is how people can put a buffer on a workbench. It simply begs to have a knife rebound in your face. Buffers work great on stands that are about belt high, where you can put something beneath them to absorb a grabbed piece. Something like a box of shipping peanuts, carpet scraps, or, like Ed Fowler, a mess of used belts.
6) Wear a face shield. Not much help if something bounces off your chest and into your face anyway, but better than nothing.
7) NO DISTRACTIONS. This means turn off the ipod, no one talking to you, etc.
8) A personal habit is that I stand off to the side of my buffer and face the flat side of the wheel when buffing a blade. This means that a flung blade will usually miss me.
9) There are actual "buffing hoods" that are made for industry that help grab flung pieces and act as dust collectors. You might do some googling and find a foto. then you can build yourself a cabinet if you want.

I understand everyone's cautions completely. That buffer wants to hurt you. You will get pieces grabbed. It will scare the bejeezus out of you. But in many cases it's the only way to accomplish the highest polishes. The first couple hundred of my knives were mirror polished. I have a great deal of respect for that scary bastid buffer.
 
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I should also add: when starting off with a buffer, have the sense not to step up to it the first time with a blade to polish. Use something a little less destructive, like a block of hardwood with rounded corners. Practice with how you have to turn the block to polish from many directions to get the best polish. You'll get a feel for how it grabs. then, go to a squared block and feel the big difference in how it grabs square corners at some angles.
This practice might give you a healthy enough respect for the widowmaker to keep your attention focused.
 
Always buff on the bottom 1/2 of the wheel with the top of the buff rotating towards you. That way, if the bottom of the buff grabs the piece and you're lucky, it will just get thrown through whatever you have behind the buffing machine instead of launched into your chest of face. Of course, I've heard of knives making several rotations on the buff before letting go, so you never know where they can head. At this point, I only use the buffer during the sharpening process, and then very carefully with just the edge lightly touching the buffing wheel.

A tip, don't use a buff to grind. In other words, if there are some deeper scratches on the blade that show up with the buffing wheel, don't try and push the blade harder into the buff to remove them. Go back to your prior step and take care of it. The buff should only be used to finish.

I've read a ton of horror stories over the years regarding buffers. I've heard of well known makers getting the bill of the cap they are wearing cut in 1/2 by a mostly finished flying knife, I've heard of knives imbedded in concrete, feet, wood, walls, etc., and I've had knives pulled from my own hand and thankfully tossed off of the back wall and floor of my garage. I really just don't use the thing anymore except to lightly buff certain edges or the occasional ironwood.

Another tip, don't wear gloves around rotating machinery like buffs, lathes, mills, or drill presses. You can probably get away with it at a belt grinder, but don't risk it around the aforementioned. Anyone remember the old American Chopper's episode where one of the fellas got his glove hung in a drill bit, got his arm twisted around in an unnatural position, and got a giant chunk tore out of his hand? Lucky guy, really.

No one's saying that you don't know what you're doing or that you're not being safe. It's just you have to respect the machine (which I'm sure you do). If you walk into a room full of guys, if one of them wants to sucker punch you, you won't be able to stop it unless you're expecting every one of those guys to sucker punch you. Always expect the machine to be looking for a sucker punch and don't let it happen.

--nathan
 
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