bushings or no bushings

depends. I it's a relatively inexpensive knife, say <$100 it doesn't matter.

It it's a premium >$100knife, then I think it's important.

However it seems a large number of people seem to find joy in monkeying with their pivot tension then using loctite on it. I ain't one of them.
 
Do you have a particular knife in mind?
I think it's a case by case basis. I've only handled two knives that I knew had bushings, and I've had good experience so far, but both companies are pretty good about producing a quality product.
My Sebenza was okay, but could have been a lot smoother. Just kidding.
I own a Timberline Lightfoot pistol grip that has a bushing and it is a lot smoother that other production knives.
 
DaveH said:
However it seems a large number of people seem to find joy in monkeying with their pivot tension then using loctite on it.
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I have never loctited a pivot screw, in fact the only folder I can recall seriously fooling signifiantly with the piviot screw was on a Sebenza out of curiousity.

However adjusting the piviot screw and applying loctite is obviously far less of a "hassle" than regular blade upkeep such as sharpening or care of a carbon steel blade. Or simply adjusting the clip tension or placement.

Paul I don't think anyone would argue against a bushing, just that some people don't think it is worth a significant amount of money and happily use folders without bushings and even without adjustable pivots.

-Cliff
 
I don't see how a bushing increases the performance of a folder, so I would'nt pay even a dollar more for them.
 
If you handle knives like the Viele II folder from Spyderco or any number of other non bushing folders and feel how silky smooth they are when new with no blade play at all it is hard to find a reason for bushings. A couple of nylatron washers or phosphorus bronze washers seem to me to be just as smooth when the pivot tension is set right. The only real benefit to a bushing I guess is that it allows you to tighten the pivot as tight as you want and not mess with the blade smoothness or how it opens.

As for the loctite. I do at times loctite clips, and pivots depending on the circumstance but rarely anything else. I've learned over the years that each knife is unique even when its two of the same model. Some require a bit of loctite to keep the pivot where I want it because they move a bit over time and actually unscrew themselves. I've had two or three Emersons recently that continually loosened up in the pivot after several hundred openings and closings of the blade so the loctite was needed to keep that from happening.

I also have a custom $350 folder that was a royal pain until I finally caved and put some blue #242 loctite in the pivot to keep it where I put it. I guess what I'm saying is that I usually let the knife decide as to whether the loctite is needed or not. Most are good to go as they are and don't require it. At least that has been my experience. I prefer to not use it anywhere on my knives if I can get away with it.

STR
 
Mcusta's (under $100) have a teflon washer which seems to really smooth the action. Does that count?
 
I'm not sure, but I think the advantage of a bushing is that you can have the blade consistantly line up AND be silky smooth because of teflon or nylatron washers.
 
paulwesley said:
i havw a timberline wortac and envoy and they are smooooooooth
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Are you sure those have bushings? The timberline website only mentions for the two Lightfoot folders.
 
STR said:
If you handle knives like the Viele II folder from Spyderco or any number of other non bushing folders and feel how silky smooth they are when new with no blade play at all it is hard to find a reason for bushings.
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Though often cited, it does nothing for smoothness, it simply reduces the ability to jam a lock by overtighening the pivot screw. If I really tighten the screw on my Sebenza the knife will open, but with difficulty. If you do the same to knives without bushings then you can jam them totally. Some have argued that it can be impossible to achieve a balance of ease of opening and elimination of blade play, such has not been my experience.

-Cliff
 
I agree Cliff. There is little need to worry about a tiny bit of blade play anyway even if the argument could be proven. A little lateral play won't stop the knife from performing. Most of mine have very very little to none noticed with the naked eye.

On a Buck 560 I fixed not too long ago it had vertical and lateral blade play and most all of it was because of the bushing from the BUCK custom shop being slightly undersized for the hole in the blade. So to me there was not any real benefit to adding a bushing if it just caused blade play. I ended up taking the play out of the knife by putting a proper sized one in it for the gentleman that mailed me the knife after Buck said it was 'within acceptable tolerances'. I can't say that I was too impressed with the overall quality of that bushing. The tolerances were off thats for sure.
 
Just wondering, does the 705-401 have bushings? I think I see some PB in there, it doesn't move when I open or close the blade.
 
Ok guys, washers aren't bushings, a washer is simply a disk between the tang of the blade and the liners. I can't really explain bushings, but take a look at the Sebenza disassembly thread over at the CRK forum. You can see washers too, a la the BM 705 401
 
STR said:
There is little need to worry about a tiny bit of blade play anyway...
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I have used folders that even have what I would describe as "slop", far beyond play and it has no effect on them. Traditional craftsmens knives such as the Stanley and Olfa heavy duty knives have give to the blades so that they will move up when you go into a cut, especially on the Olfa's, you can wiggle them around a fair bit.

No one complains about it, it isn't as if you hand actually locks the knife in that tight anyway. Plus I find the whole arguement about tightening and "fooling" with the pivot up to having to include loctite as if it is a major hassle just to be exaggerating to the point it is just ridiculus, especially when you consider regular maintaince of knives anyway and when the Sebenza is promoted as a "working" knife.

GarageBoy said:
I can't really explain bushings
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It is just a cylinder which the handle mates against which is free to move and thus reduces jamming, Reeve has an annotated picture of the breakdown labeling all parts on his cite :

http://www.chrisreeve.com/sebenzaclean.htm

-Cliff
 
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