Buying a small compact car, what would you choose?

[Bob W]

Some of those Lincolns are also dang nice vehicles, but I don't want a $30,000 car that gets 15 miles per gallon.

My 16-year-old Mark VIII gets 30-32 mpg highway. That's a 280 horsepower V-8 with dual overhead cams. And with an 18-gallon tank, I can easily travel 6 or 7 hours without stopping.

Naturally though, the Lincoln doesn't do well in town. That's where the small cars really make sense, for commuting and errands. Many of those small 'economy' cars don't get very good mileage when traveling though. And with tiny gastanks, you're always at the pump anyway.

Compare to the '86 Cougar I used to drive. 30mpg highway and a 20-gallon tank. I could ride all day on a single fillup! Those were the days...

-Bob

 

[Carl64]

My 16-year-old Mark VIII gets 30-32 mpg highway. That's a 280 horsepower V-8 with dual overhead cams. And with an 18-gallon tank, I can easily travel 6 or 7 hours without stopping.

I have to take that back on the Lincoln. I see the latest LS with a nice big engine is rated at 24/18 for hwy/city. Not too bad for the size, but still double the price and not like a Mazda (35/28) or Toyota (41/32!) to show how small cars are doing these days. Definitely good for a big car.

 

[Bob W]

Yep, those small cars have excellent ratings. However, I've read some reviews indicating that under actual travelling conditions (80 mph, hills, loaded with luggage, wind) those economy cars fall far short of the listed mileage estimates.

And I've also noticed how some cars actually do much better than the estimates - my Lincoln was never supposed to get 30 mpg, but from reading the Mark VIII forums, it seems many/most do.

You just have to research each vehicle individually I guess.

The fuel grade is another factor. Those high-eco compacts mostly use regular unleaded; my Lincoln 'requires' Premium.

Best Wishes,
Bob

 

[Ryan8]

Yep, those small cars have excellent ratings. However, I've read some reviews indicating that under actual travelling conditions (80 mph, hills, loaded with luggage, wind) those economy cars fall far short of the listed mileage estimates.

Yes, EPA estimates don't really reflect real-world usage. They're pretty simple and don't take a lot of things in to account. There has been some demand for the EPA to change them because of this.

 

[Bob W]

The primary factor that kills the mileage of those mini-cars is the tiny engines. Under any sort of load, the engines must work incredibly hard at very high r.p.m. to maintain highway speed, using loads of gasoline. Those car's small sizes and light weight are exactly the same factor that allow them to achieve incredibly good mileage in town and traffic - it takes very little power to start and stop. And in-town speed limits do not tax even the smallest engines.

Exactly the opposite of my Lincoln. Running 75 - 80 mph on the interstate, she's turning just over 2,000 rpms, very smooth and efficient. At 65 mph, she's actually turning less than 2,000. And her aerodynamics help considerably. But it does take considerably more power to get her going from a stoplight, more power to stop, and aerodynamics are irrelevent at low speeds.

Gearing is another factor. Cars get the best mileage when in high gear; the rpms are lower. My Lincoln can run many long and steep hills, even at interstate speed and high elevation, at full speed without downshifting. Casually driving over Raton Pass at 65 mph (the speed limit) and she actually stays in Overdrive. A weaker engine, and the car would have to shift to lower gears to maintain power.

Best Wishes,
Bob

 

[Danbo]

Bob W., I hear what you're saying, but I think you just happened to get a great one. The rest of us, if we buy and drive a big V8 engined vehicle, would probably not get anywere near 30 mpg.

 

[Bob W]

Agree absolutely. The difference is weight and style. There are very few lightweight aerodynamic cars with V-8 engines.

Additionally many V-8 engines lack the modern design features and technolgy that are incorporated into smaller engines, particularly imports.

My '86 V-8 5.0L Cougar got 30 mpg, but my '94 4.6L V-8 Cougar only managed 28mpg. Even though the 4.6L engine was ~supposed~ to be more efficiently designed, Mercury made the new Cougars much heavier. At the same time, they shrank the gastanks.

Another factor, if economy is important when buying, the price of vehicles. Whoever bought my Lincoln new in '95 paid $40,000, or more due to some non-standard accessories. You can pour a bunch of gas down the drain for that.

I should also mention that there is no current Lincoln vehicle comparable to mine. All of the current Lincoln models are giant box-shaped boats.

The future is hybrids, I think. The technolgy is there, introductory models are here, and consumers are buying. Not a car I would buy at their current level of readiness, but someday perhaps. Horsepower ratings need a huge boost, the vehicles need better styling, and they need to achieve minimal standards of comfort/luxury. Simply, they have the same weaknesses as budget gasoline cars, but cost much more.

Best Wishes,
Bob

 

[Bob W]

I'd also like to comment on this:

No Ford Focus. It must be domestic.

The Chevy Aveo sold in the US is made in Korea.
The Chevy Optra is a Suzuki vehicle, made in Korea. Or made in Thailand. I'm confused about that.

-Bob

 

[Bob W]

One more post, then I gotta scram-

Just don't get hit in that Neon. You have a 35% chance of a life threating injury at a speed of 35 MPH !!
Neons have a well earned rep for being a very unsafe car, yet parents keep getting them for their kids.....

I witnessed a Dodge Neon rear-end a mini-Ford, a Fiesta or something. Probably 10 - 15 mph. Both cars were slowing to turn into a grocery. The plastic Ford bumper had to be popped back out, and probably repainted later. The Dodge was ****ed up. The front end was caved in to the point the fan blade was hitting the hood and front fender. Probably totalled.

-Bob

 

[aaronrkelly]

I'd also like to comment on this:

The Chevy Aveo sold in the US is made in Korea.
The Chevy Optra is a Suzuki vehicle, made in Korea. Or made in Thailand. I'm confused about that.

-Bob

Exactly - I looked at a Chevy Aveo then discovered its merely a Daewoo product with a bowtie on it. If Im going to buy foreign I might as well get all the advantage that the FOREIGN companies give over Chevrolet.

Chevrolet Aveo - 3yr/36K mile warranty
Kia Rio - 10yr/100K mile warranty

Both are made in Korea......might as well buy the Korean car from the Koreans - at least they have a better warranty then the Korean car you buy from the Americans.

 

[Carl64]

Exactly - I looked at a Chevy Aveo then discovered its merely a Daewoo product with a bowtie on it. If Im going to buy foreign I might as well get all the advantage that the FOREIGN companies give over Chevrolet.

I kind of hate the concept in general. Why is making a half-decent compact car (and seriously, a Daewoo is only half decent, but at least cheap) such a mystery to GM that they had to do this thing with Daewoo?

I really don't understand why the situation is like this. GM shouldn't need a Korean company to help them compete with the Japanese. American manufacturers have the benefit of import tarrifs and customers who would rather buy American products, especially back in the 1970's when Japanese cares were infiltrating. The only thing I can figure is Ford and GM must just be idiots. After all, there are a lot of companies in America and around the world that suck, and we don't blame it on healthcare and exchange rates and imports. We just say "Wow, those people suck."

 

[brewthunda]

I've heard that the Chrysler 300C is built using the last Mercedes E model chassis and is assembled in Canada. The Pontiac Crossfire is built on the last Mercedes SLK chassis. Chrysler is a German Company. Hondas are built in the US. There's no such thing as a domestic car anymore.

That said, I rented an economy car for business on Friday and they gave me a Toyota Prius hybrid. I wasn't too jazzed by the plastic interior of Prius, but I'm sold on the hybrid technology. I went through 2.5 gallons of gas driving 105 miles. Electric motors have 100% of their torque available at 0 RPM, so these things are a LOT faster off the line than their numbers would suggest. I wouldn't mind a hybrid if they could make it rear wheel drive and make the suspension handle like a BMW.

 

[Bob W]

I've heard that the Chrysler 300C ...

That's what wife wants. But I think it's a big ugly boat, suitable only for gangster-rappers and grandmas. I'm vibin' for the Crossfire.

-Bob

p.s. I used to own a Dodge. The only way I'd buy another is if it's a Mercedes underneath.