Buying with Paypal in a trade for buyer protection?

uyotg

uyotg

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There are a lot of unfulfilled trade threads lately. I was wondering if there were any ways people have tried to keep themselves from getting scammed, and the thought of both parties buying the other's items for the same amount through PayPal came up.

Has that suggestion ever come up? (You can imagine it's inconclusive to search for "paypal" and "trade" here.) Instead of directly trading items, both parties could pay the other an agreed upon equal amount, and buyer protection would be afforded for both parties with PayPal fees. It'd help screen out scammers and it at least provides actionable steps toward a resolution in unfulfilled deals that can return property or money.

Is there anything against this in the rules anywhere? Any flaws to this idea? Or any other suggestions?
 
Not everyone has cash on hand to do this. That's why some trade. No cash needed. And who's to say the other guy won't pay you.
 
if they are going to rip some one off they will find away to do it. a charge back on there paypal account. if you dont trush the person then just dont trade with them.
 
When I first read the post it seemed like a decent idea, until I thought about it a little more.

Say I want to rip you off, I enter into an agreement with you. I have you PP me first, and then I use that money you sent to send it back to you or use a dedicated credit card to pay you. After you provide tracking, I empty my PP and do a charge back on my credit card.

I have successfully taken your knife and your money. Now this is unlikely considering it will jeopardize their PP account, but a thief in need will slump to unknown levels
 
uyotg said:
There are a lot of unfulfilled trade threads lately. I was wondering if there were any ways people have tried to keep themselves from getting scammed, and the thought of both parties buying the other's items for the same amount through PayPal came up.

Has that suggestion ever come up? (You can imagine it's inconclusive to search for "paypal" and "trade" here.) Instead of directly trading items, both parties could pay the other an agreed upon equal amount, and buyer protection would be afforded for both parties with PayPal fees. It'd help screen out scammers and it at least provides actionable steps toward a resolution in unfulfilled deals that can return property or money.

Is there anything against this in the rules anywhere? Any flaws to this idea? Or any other suggestions?
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Gary,

Yes there has been a lot of less than satisfactory trade threads being brought up. Is it that more people are welching on deals in general or is it that more people are now comfortable and have been speaking up? Hard to say if it is one over the other.

I don't understand why or how using paypal for a trade would be useful given the way the rules are written and ultimately enforced. You are trading an item for another item, you aren't trading an item for cash. As soon as that happens you are no longer trading, you are buying and selling and that requires a paid membership of Gold or better.

As a member here, I don't feel that more rules would benefit the community, especially when it involves using paypal and trades. As a moderator here, it would increase the amount of work we are already undertaking. At this point, it's like comming up with a specific problem to match a potential solution. The only rule I would like to see added is that new members must wait 6 months (at least) before trading or selling.

The best advice I can give folks regarding trading behavior has already been written in one of my blog entries. It might be in need of some refinement and updating to cover buying and selling as well. Do research on your trade partner, read their threads and posts. Get a feel for who they are as a person. How long have they been around? Do they contribute to the community in some meaningful way, or are they simply sharks that live in the Exchange and don't contribute to any discussion other than sales threads? Does the person give any feedback, or are they only collecting? Some people have the distinct impression that Bladeforums is a flea market of some kind, and they treat it as such.
 
RevDevil said:
Gary,

Yes there has been a lot of less than satisfactory trade threads...... only rule I would like to see added is that new members must wait 6 months (at least) before trading or selling....
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I think this is an excellent idea and I would like to see 1 year. And some minimum amount of meaningful contribution in the forums. I belong to one forum that does not even let you remain a member if you are not active in the forums let alone sell or trade. Guess what, they have practically zero issues.
 
Yeah, I suppose there's always a way if someone really wants to scam someone.

I think a more succinct way to have stated my whole post, though less specific, is that I suggest some sort of moderator between trades. I thought maybe PayPal could play that role--no need for BFC mods to get involved. I can see how doing that could technically be buying an item, but I'm not pushing for more rules on the forum (sort of disinterested, really). This is just a good community and it saddens me sometimes to read what people have gotten into, and I always wish there were something more actionable or some sort of insurance, especially in trades, where honesty between the parties is more important.
 
I think there's a lot of merit to the idea of having a minimum amount of time as a member prior to being allowed to sell or trade.

Isn't a guarantee but at least it allows you to see if the individual is an active contributing member of the forums and doesn't just see BFC as another ebay or signed up and headed right for the exchange to start trading. Those seem to be the types more likely when there is a problem that care less about reputation or good communication and prompt shipping as they can walk away more easily because they never cared much in the first place. Also, it makes it harder for the outright scammers. Forces them to put some effort into it and not such "easy picking's".

Plus as mentioned it would allow you to check someone's posts and get a feel for them as a person. I really believe that's the best you will ever be able to do as far a gauging if this is someone you want to trust and risk doing business with.

But as stated, there is no 100% guarantee anyway you cut it.

Just my thoughts on the subject.
 
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I agree on the thought of requiring a waiting period for new members, perhaps a minimum post count as well. I have seen a few trade threads that were the posters first post. I am a bit leary and haven't traded with anyone having that low a post count.
 
I have also noticed a lot of people posting in the exchange within their first few posts. Although I am leery, I also like to give people a chance. I have always been a trusting person until you prove me otherwise. However, I do not see a problem with trading with these new members as long as they ship first.

If you are on the up and up, you should have no problem shipping first. I think that would be a great rule to try to enforce, or at least try to make it well known to other members that you really need to ask those people to ship first. A lot of people already do this, but when I first started out, I never had to ship first. So there are people that do not ask for it.

Also, when they do ship first, and the deal is completed, it is always good to leave them positive feedback so they do not have to keep going through that process.
 
I am a pretty new member so far only buying on the exchange but I think communication is the key. Not the best at this myself and things can and do come up. But letting everyone know what's up as soon as possible is always best. So far only bought from people who post in the forums I read so no worries. Every deal has been more than satisfactory for me and hopefully for them as well.
 
I'm actually a very new member. I've been lurking the blade forums for a few months, but that's just where google takes me when I have knife questions. It didn't dawn on me till when I actually joined that I should join. I'm grateful that people are willing to trade and sell to me. I understand that scamming could happen, and even I was cautious when dealing with people with the same status as me. I'm perfectly fine with the rule where the people with low feedbacks should ship first. We all have to start off somewhere. It'll just be nice if more members would actually remember to give feedbacks...

I like the ship first rule more than the 6 months rule. If I was under that restriction, I wouldn't even be able to expand my collection from basic Kershaws and Cold Steels to CRKs and Spydercos. Being able to purchase/trade and handle higher end knives is really eye opening. Until I bought my Spyderco Southard Flipper at a very low price from a forum member, I never thought that one of my favorite knives would be from Taiwan. I remember I would look at Taiwanese knives and laugh. Until I purchased and handled my first CRK, I thought that CRK owners were crazy.
 
Hairlesstwinkie said:
I'm actually a very new member. I've been lurking the blade forums for a few months, but that's just where google takes me when I have knife questions. It didn't dawn on me till when I actually joined that I should join. I'm grateful that people are willing to trade and sell to me. I understand that scamming could happen, and even I was cautious when dealing with people with the same status as me. I'm perfectly fine with the rule where the people with low feedbacks should ship first. We all have to start off somewhere. It'll just be nice if more members would actually remember to give feedbacks...

I like the ship first rule more than the 6 months rule. If I was under that restriction, I wouldn't even be able to expand my collection from basic Kershaws and Cold Steels to CRKs and Spydercos. Being able to purchase/trade and handle higher end knives is really eye opening. Until I bought my Spyderco Southard Flipper at a very low price from a forum member, I never thought that one of my favorite knives would be from Taiwan. I remember I would look at Taiwanese knives and laugh. Until I purchased and handled my first CRK, I thought that CRK owners were crazy.
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I would trade with you Yi. Your communication has alway's been excellent with me. And, I really appreciate that. Communication is the most important I think. With me good communication eases some of the concern I may have with a new member.
 
mley1 said:
I would trade with you Yi. Your communication has alway's been excellent with me. And, I really appreciate that. Communication is the most important I think. With me good communication eases some of the concern I may have with a new member.
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Thank you so much! I hope all is well on your end. You're definitely right about the communication. One of my trades, the guy had huge gaps between emails and his emails were very brief. It was a nervous trade, but thankfully the guy was just busy and the trade turned out well.
 
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