Can I have a satin finish of sorts on my khukuri

T

Tetsusaiga

Joined
Aug 21, 2006
Messages
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Hi guys, This is my very first thread here on the HI forum.

I just ordered my very FIRST khukuri, a 12 in 15 oz Villager Pen Knife!! YAHOOO!!!!! (Thanks to Sarge's suggestion on emailing Yangdu directly after I missed out on one on the DOTD)

Can't wait to get my paws on it..:D

Was thinking about something.. the blade looks awfully shiny and nice. is there a way to have a satin sort of finish on the blade, like maybe using scotchbrite or steel wool or something. Sorry if what I'm suggesting sounds like suicide for the blade.. am really a greenhorn about knives and such.

The reason I'm thinking of doing this is just to dull the finish on the blade so that I would not have such a heartache every time I need to use it.. yah, I know.. sounds contradictory.. I wanna "scratch" the whole blade so that I won't agonise over the occasional scratch from using it.. sounds strange to me too, but I suppose you guys know what I'm driving at.

I know that the blade is not stainless steel and thus the shiny finish might be one way to prevent rust or corrosion, so will a satin finish have the opposite effect of exposing the blade to increased risk of rust and corrosion? Is that the reason why almost all of HI's khukuris are all highly polished?

Hope you guys can help me out here. Thanks in advance...
 
Many folks here at HI prefer a satin finish. Go for it!:D If it makes it more how you like it, that is what counts. You are on the right track..
BTW WELCOME to the forum!!;)
 
Many of ours end up with a nice even Scotchbrite finish...tree sap builds up pretty quick.

They all need to be kept oiled.
 
If you ordered a villager khuk, it will not come highly polished; they come with a rougher finish. Many people (myself included) prefer them as they tend to be sharper than their polished bretheren. As Nasty said, keep your blade cleaned and oiled.

Welcome to the forum.
 
Welcome:)

Dulling the finish is pretty common around here. I have dozens of khuks and they are all satin to some degree because of after-work clean up like Nasty suggested.
The nice thing about a satin khuk is that it tends to get a natural patina a little faster than the polished version. Basically, the more you use it on acid stuff (plants fruits veggies etc) the more it will etch in the temper line. This does two things to some degree. 1) It helps keep minor rust at bay 2) it looks really cool.
You're gonna love that little pen knife. It really is a great all around packable hiking/camping/hatchet/knife/spatula/thing:)

Once again, Welcome!

Jake
 
I like the look of the satin finished villagers better myself. I've satin finished several of my non-villagers with scotchbrite pads. The handles too. I like to scotchbrite the shine off the horn for better grip, and appearance.

Many of us mod our knives, and enjoy doing it. Make yourself at home, take as much liberty as you want with your stuff, and don't worry too much, because you'll be buying more. They're that good!
 
Thanks for the warm welcome guys!! There are a couple of things that I need your help on.

1. I keep reading about etching in the temper lines or etching in general. What exactly does this involve and what does etching do to the blade?

2. What's a temper line?

3. Do I use the common green colour scotchbrite pad to do it or steel wool?

4. Do I go in a circular motion or in one general lateral direction when I scotchbrite the blade? Will very fine grit sandpaper do as well?

Please pardon the flurry of questions as these are all very new stuff to me. I've always been fascinated by Khukuris ever since reading in a comic (more than 20 years ago) about how a person was able to prevent himself from falling off a cliff by driving it into a tree trunk and hanging on to it. And I thought to myself, definite artistic license there. No knife can be that strong. Ever since discovering HI, I'm beginning to think that the writer of that comic must have done his homework on Khukuris!! Cos the ones by HI does appear as though they could be used in that manner!!

Ever since then, have been dying to get my hands on a Khuk and since I'm situated in one of the remaining few places where there's an active gurkha contingent, I see them every now and then and I always turn to look admiringly at the Khuk that attaches so proudly behind their back. Never thought that I would be able to get my hands on a real, Nepal-made, original Khuk that can actually be used! Please pardon the excitement.

Anyway, Daniel Koster, whom I bought a karambit from (the Dankura actually), mentioned that I could use mineral oil on his Dankura. Would that work on the Khukuri as well. And I understand that the HI sheaths, unlike modern sheaths, actually help to protect the blade pretty well and thus the Khuk should be oiled and then sheathed for storage? Have I understood this correctly?

One of my earlier questions was not actually answered yet, which is, does doing a satin finish actually promote rusting cos it actually gives greater and rougher surface area to the blade right?

Apologise about the verbal diarrhoea, as you can see, I'm really thrilled and eagerly waiting for it to arrive.
 
Firstly, your enthusiasm is ........ AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!! You're going to love it here. That khuk you picked is widely considered on of the best designs. Kinda untraditional, but MEGA useful.

-More surface area to oxidize = easier to rust, so a satin finish would technically rust easier, but in reality, with minimal care, rust ins't a big worry

-Yep, store the blade in the scabbard. Its wood in there, not leather, so its a good environment for the blade.

-A temper line is the line that shows up when you etch where the blade has been hardened. Etching is the process of applying an acid which darkens the hardened metal differently than the non-hardened metal. Steve Ferguson has some instructions for etching, and they are great!!! If you etch, your blade will be darkened!

_Ace hardware carries a wide variety of Scotchbrite pads. Maroon is the roughest, then green, then grey, then white. How 'villager' (satin) you want your blade is totaly personal preference. Steel wool will work too. Again, preference. I like Scotchbrite pads on my knives and their handles. As to what motion, again, preference.

_Mineral oil is great for wood and horn handles. Get a stadium cup (big plastic cup from football games) fill it 3/4 with mineral oil, and stand the khuk handle down in the oil. Leave it there for 24 hours, then take out and drain till the surface looks stickey. It isn't really stickey, and can be buffed to a really beautiful lustre. Dave Rishar does a great handle maintenance tutorial you can find by searching.

_I'm not sure about 'driving' the khuk into a tree. If it was a stabbing motion then I'd say he took great liscence. If it was a chopping motion, maybe, who knows....

_And lastly, always take my words with a grain of salt. There are many here that know WAY more than me. Steve Ferguson, Dan Koster, Sylvrfalcn, Bri-in-Chi to name just a few. There are many others.

Dig around a little. There are some great project threads, with pictures, etc. Stories, and lots of Uncle Bill content that is just a must read. The FAQ section will answer many of the questions you have too.

And... hit the safety thread real good too!

_
 
Hi Andy, thanks for your reply and very kind comments. If I remember correctly, it was a chopping motion..:D

mm.. etching sounds like the way to go for me.. darkblade...mm... *scurries off to open the seach engine*

I have read the many stories about Uncle Bill and the ones he told as well.. heehee.. I've been snooping around here... and i have come away with the impression that this is a really nice place to be..

I must say that Dan has been most helpful. I think he kinda regretted selling the Dankura to me :D cos I really bombarded him with loads of questions, not always related to his Dankura, but Dan was most obliging to answer all of them.. Thanks Dan.. and sorry for being a bother!

Safety thread.. check... one of my first reads...

Oh.. my 12 in Pen is actually 15 oz.. that's kinda heavy for a 12 in Pen?? Does it have anything to do with horn handle versus wood? Is horn handle more durable than wood?? Curious... and the horn is from bufflao, not unicorn right?!?!?!

By the way, I was searching around for it, but can't seem to find out if the Pen is full tang??
 
I would suggest soaking the inside of the scabbard with whatever you are protecting the blade with. Ballistol. mineral oil whatever.
Terry
 
Dave Rishar posted some excellent instructions on etching here:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=415325&highlight=etch

You can't go wrong with what he says. Welcome!

Steve

Edited:
Just for kicks, here's the method I use to etch.
Please understand that there are as many methods to etch blades as there are people that do it. Do a search on etching and read what others have to say.

If the blade is highly polished, I've found it's good to "open the pores" of the metal by sanding with some very fine wet-or-dry sandpaper, at least 1000 grit. You can also use a fine schtchbrite pad.

1. Use acetone or denatured alcohol to degrease the blade. Both are flammable, so use good ventilation and follow the safety instructions on the can.
2. Mix one part Ferric Chloride, available in the US from Radio Shack as Printed circuit board etchant, with 3 or 4 parts distilled water.
3. Using rubber gloves saturate a rag or paper towel with the solution and rub it onto the blade. Put it on with a fully saturated rag, and wipe it on evenly. Do one side then the other, doing your best to cover the full side of the blade in one pass. Don’t let the solution run down into the grip. I use a plastic trough that is used to wet wallpaper that I bought at the local home improvements store to catch the drips.
4. When satisfied with the pattern, rinse with cold water.
5. Rub the blade with a rag or paper towel saturated with vinegar. I’ve read that this helps to stop the ferric chloride reaction.
6. Rinse with cold water.
7 Neutralize the acid by rubbing the blade with a thick mixture of baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) and water, or with ammonia, or window cleaner containing ammonia.
8. Rinse with cold water.
9 Dry the blade thoroughly, and oil it well with mineral oil, or whatever you currently use to prevent rust.
 
15 oz isn't heavy for a khuk. I'm not completely sure about the Pen Knife specifically though. Thats one of the ones I still need to get at.

Most of HI's khuks are full tang. Meaning that the tang runs all the way through the handle and is peened over a keeper on the pommel. Some of them are "Chiruwa" style, or made with scales where you can see the tang all the way around. This, some say, transmits more shock to the user. The Pen Knife has a big honking rat tail tang that is peened. You'll never need to worry about that because its a super strong way to do it. Even the ones with partial tangs are reported to be very strong. (And transmit the least shock.)

Dan's a good guy. I'm sure he was tickled rather than annoyed. I know I've pestered him a lot, and he's never snapped at me even once. Well, not loud enough for me to hear, anyway.

I see Ferguson is reading this thread now, so I bet he'll post his etching instructions. You wait and see.

Listen to Terry. Balistol good too. I use it on everything, leather, wood, horn, metal, etc.

Horn is hard, and beautiful. Definitely one of my favorite handle materials. Its just so exotic. Keep it mineral oiled. Natural materials will move and crack over time and with env cond. This is normal for horn and wood too, and there are procedures to prevent (mineral oil) and to repair also.
 
you guys know me...a mean ole snapper!!

snapper_on_stick.jpg




:D
:foot:


The Pen knife is hidden tang.

Either a red or green scotchbrite pad works great.



Steve - the vinegar does stop the FeCl from etching...but it does it's own etching as well.


Etching knives to get a hamon line has been a personal quest of mine and honestly, this is the best process I know of so far that is fool-proof and guaranteed to provide a durable etched finish.


  • Prep the blade by sanding with 600 grit paper lengthwise until the entire blade is satin-finished. Use WD-40 as a lubricant - helps the paper cut better and last longer.
  • Clean the blade with Windex window cleaner (may require several cleanings)
  • Dunk the blade in warm vinegar (heated in the microwave (alternate: wrap paper towels soaked in vinegar around the blade)
  • Leave sit for 30 minutes minimum
  • Pull out and clean with Windex. Should be able to see etch lines already, etc.
  • Dunk in Ferric Chloride etchant for 2-3 minutes
  • Pull out and clean with Baking Soda - sprinkle on the blade and then scrub it with wet fingers. Do this thoroughly until you can see an even finish on the blade.
  • Rinse in water
  • Lightly polish with "Nevr Dull" (or similar) metal polishing compound
  • (optional) brush lightly with a scotchbrite pad
  • Coat with Briwax, WD-40 or similar rust protectant
  • Done!


Notable differences from other recommended methods:

1 - vinegar before etchant.

Helps "prepare" the steel for the etchant. Don't know why...but I stumbled upon this accidentally and it works. Sometimes I'll think I can get by without it...but almost always end up coming back and doing it.


2 - cleaning with baking soda.

Stops all acid etching and "grays" the blade. Also helps get rid of most of the oxides that form on the surface.


3 - finish with Nevr Dull.

The combination of using baking soda and a metal polishing compound leaves the blade with a finish that is very easily restored. I've had to learn this one the hard way. I'll etch a blade and it will look great...and then I use it and tarnish it a little, only to go back and clean it up and in the process remove the nice etch. :mad: I now use Nevr Dull to clean up rust/tarnish/discoloration/etc. instead of steel wool, sandpaper, etc.

That said, one finish I am really coming to like is the scotchbrite-pad-over-an-etch finish. Looks better and just as easy to clean up.


Hope this helps!
 
Woooh guys.. I'm certainly bowled over by the help I'm getting over here. Thanks so much!! Its way way past my bedtime and I'm still here.

Ferguson, thanks for posting that link. I have it saved on my hard-disk for reference.. Think I will go with vinegar, ferric chloride ain't too easy to get around here, am not in US by the way, am in this small tropical island called Singapore. You guys been here for a hoilday???

That's also why a lot of the stuff that you can get easily is a bit trickier to source for on my end. I'm still trying to figure out what the heck is mineral oil, tho' Dan says that any pharmacy will stock it. So I gather that I will have to mineral oil the entire knife, from tip to buttcap and wiping it down, before keeping it?

Wow Andy, from your description, it sure sounds as though the Pen is one tough little knife... from your description of the tang and handle (cos I don't really understand what "peened" means), I assume that the tang goes all the way down to the end of the handle (but the tang is not exposed) and is rounded over to form the buttcap? Or is the buttcap a separate peice? and the horn is fitted over the tang??

Dan. thanks for chiming in as well... your method sounds really idiot proof.. but we all know what they say about things being idiot proof until someone designs a better idiot.. just hope I'm not it.. :D

Dan, will your method work if I follow every step but leave out the ferric chloride cos I frankly doubt that I can get it over here...
 
Ok guys, eyelids not holding out anymore.. gonna dream about my Pen.. thanks for all the response so far.. you guys really know how to make someone feel welcomed!!

THANK YOU!!

Will catch up with this thread again tomorrow...
 
Mineral oil should be easy to find. It's commonly used as a laxative, so the druggist (apothecary?) should have it by one name or another. You'll need a good bit, so tell him you have a constipated elephant at home. I have used olive oil for preserving horn and antler handles for years. Find a tall, narrow container and stand the item upright - let it sit a few days, drain the excess back into the container and cap it for the next time you need it. It lasts for years. Don't bother with extra-virgin, the cheap stuff works fine. I recently topped my jar up with mineral oil, so now I'm using a blend.
I think putting your location into your Public Profile is a good idea. We have folks from all over the world here, and it's nice to know when you're chatting with someone, that they are halfway around the globe.
The Penknife is one of my favorites. A very practical outdoor knife.
BTW, Welcome :)
 
hi tetsusaiga,

If your chemists in singapore are anything like Boots here in the UK, they will look at you funny if you ask for mineral oil laxative, just not available here. unscented baby oil is the same thing (just don't drink it). you can use scented if you like it. i put a few drops of clove oil (from Boots the chemist again) in to scent it. i also have some scented with ylangylang and other flower oils for oiling and honouring my keris and badeks. ballistol is good too, if available there...smells like anise (licorice). traditional scented coconut oil for keris is probably more readily available there & should work, and if you have heard of the rites of keris washing, that is also a method of etching the blade with lime juice and darkening with arsenic to bring out the patterning of the blade (arsenic not recommended for knives to be used for food).

anyway, you'll most likely be planning which method to use on your next kukhri, or the one after. they're like peanuts, you can't just have one.
 
mmm... kronckew... i know exactly what you mean.. i just snagged the balance khukuri offered by Yangdu in another thread.. the one with the montana elk antler handle... and its only my third day or so on this forum!!!

I am so dead.. I believe you guys call it HKIV??

Now I gotta grapple with a more pressing problems of customs clearance... mm.. but I really just want that for display and/or collection purpose.. hopefully there won't be any problems... anyone with any brilliant ideas? By the way, is the HI box very conspicuous, maybe with like a pictures of Khukuris all over the outside?? If so, I'm done for...

back to topic.. so i gather that Johnsons Baby Oil will do just fine in place of mineral oil??
 
HIKV = Himalayan Imports Kukhri Virus :D

Johnsons will probably be OK, check the label to see it is just mineral oil & scent. they may use the latin names which are 'paraffinum liquidum' and 'parfum', i use the cheaper generic brand from sainsbury's or tesco's, or asda-walmart myself, it's about half the price of johnsons.

Mineral oil (paraffinum liquidum) is just a very refined petroleum oil similar to what is used in cars, 3-in-one oil, and other traditional lubricants and clips (cleaner,lubricant,inhibitor,protectant) , it's just had all the nasty chemicals, heavy metals, and other contaminents removed in the refining. large amounts ingested can cause some systemic problems, and breathing the vapors from boiling it can cause lung problems, but ingested in small amounts (a few tablespoons) will just cause an extended and rapid visit to the toilet (bring a book or two) i speak from experience, my grandmother was a great believer in it's regular use, along with prunes. external use is soothing, cleansing and waterproofing for dry skin, as in it's use in babies. mineral oil (unscented) and ballistol are the only ones i am aware of that can be safely used on food handling equipment, the others will be poisonous, or can turn rancid, or add a bad taste....petroleum jelly (vaseline) is a thick grease-like version of mineral oil and can also be used if preferred (except as a laxative).

and if you have any trouble with customs, you can try telling them (with a great deal of honesty & truth) that it is an agricultural impliment, not a weapon.
 
Hmmm.. will tell them that I'm setting it up to be my heirloom... well.. according to forumite lizzardbone, its heirloom class... and well, looking at the pic, I wouldn't argue with him..:D

back to topic... some of you are suggesting that I apply mineral oil to the horn handle as well?? wouldn't that make the handle really oily?? does a horn handle or antler handle since I snagged the Balance Khuk, really need maintenance as well?
 
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