Can someone tell me about this?

6

68strat

Joined
May 8, 2016
Messages
7
I was looking at this sword:

http://www.ryansword.com/full-funct...dead-sword-michonnes-sword-ryan847-p-670.html

It is over $600...probably because of the folded steel/high carbon blade.

I was wondering if this blade construction is decent? Does anyone have experience with this sword or a similar build?

$600 doesn't seem too bad if the components are quality and put together right.

I don't want a simple wall hanger...this sword would be cool to use...and have a bit of walking dead memorabilia.
 
"Skallagrim" is an "up and comer" on Youtube, and is as knowledgeable as I have seen, so far. I think he has a list (or knows of a site) of recommended swords, daggers, as well. Interesting channel. He has a little of everything medieval, and modern.

He is not a big katana guy, but he does know most of the "reputable" sword companies. I'd be real careful with higher priced items. There should be something legitimately decent for that price.
 
as far as build this looks good 1095 is a good steel, it ls all about heat treat, ryan sword has good heat treat process and it is clay tempered, i have seen a 9260 version of the michone sword for a little cheaper, i would rather go with 9260 to be honest, sometimes 1095 can be to hard for a sword steel
 
Last edited:
Highlander 20026 said:
as far as build this looks good 1095 is a good steel, it ls all about heat treat, ryan sword has good heat treat process and it is lay tempered, i have seen a 9260 version of the michone sword for a little cheaper, i would rather go with 9260 to be honest, sometimes 1095 can be to hard for a sword steel
Click to expand...

I noticed that just the blade is 1095...and other components include folded steel and a more pliable iron core. I did a little research, and by combining various steel types they are attempting to make it strong and flexible while keeping a sharp edge with good cutting ability.

Sounds good in theory...I wonder how it is in reality.
 
68strat said:
I noticed that just the blade is 1095...and other components include folded steel and a more pliable iron core. I did a little research, and by combining various steel types they are attempting to make it strong and flexible while keeping a sharp edge with good cutting ability.

Sounds good in theory...I wonder how it is in reality.
Click to expand...

that is the premise behind san mai construction wedging a hard steel between layers of soft steel, it has been done for 1000 years, so i guess it has tried and proven to work, however there are drawbacks about that type of construction they can take a set easier sometimes than a through hardened spring steel, so you kind of get a trade off
 
As a fencer in the '60s I found the blades were 9260 ! It's a spring steel that has often been used for automobile springs. Similar HT and properties to 5160.
The layered , damascus , or San Mai blades require 2 or more different steels .
 
A layered steel sword at that price is very cheap. Find reviews of that maker before you spend that kind of money, looks legit, specifications are a little vague. Best would be to find a cutting video and review by a serious cutter. In that price range you may be able to purchase a real, actual historical antique sword.
 
I have been involved in the martial arts for years, and have studied the samurai culture and the philosophy behind sword making. A $600 samurai sword might be good as a wall hanger, but I would not trust it as a real worker. You may be able to "play" with it and cut mats and such, but a truly good samurai sword will cost into the thousands of dollars. They are very similar to a 1911 pistol. you can buy a good 1911 for $800-$1000 dollars. It will function properly and shoot well, but a superior 1911 will cost 3-5 thousand dollars, depending on what you want.
 
i kind of disagree, it isnt price it is maker, tamahagane is an inferior steel to modern mono steels, when you pay thousands you pay for authenticity not a stronger blade, a mono steel in 1060, 5160, 9260, 1095 is far superior than tamahagane folded steel as far as constancy of carbon, and heat treat in some cases, not all
 
Highlander 20026 said:
i kind of disagree, it isnt price it is maker, tamahagane is an inferior steel to modern mono steels, when you pay thousands you pay for authenticity not a stronger blade, a mono steel in 1060, 5160, 9260, 1095 is far superior than tamahagane folded steel as far as constancy of carbon, and heat treat in some cases, not all
Click to expand...

The sword in question isn't a monosteel blade, it's "1095 carbon steel+folded steel+iron" that may be decent quality but is ultimately mystery steel, and I'd bet the none of the fellows who made it are named "Ryan." Who knows.

It's plenty easy to make a crappy monosteel blade, you know. The construction methods have a lot to do with it! :)
 
Mecha said:
The sword in question isn't a monosteel blade, it's "1095 carbon steel+folded steel+iron" that may be decent quality but is ultimately mystery steel, and I'd bet the none of the fellows who made it are named "Ryan." Who knows.

It's plenty easy to make a crappy monosteel blade, you know. The construction methods have a lot to do with it! :)
Click to expand...

ryan sword are known for decent heat treat, i dont see a problem with it myself, however there are cheaper versions of the michone katana in 9260 i would choose
 
Highlander 20026 said:
ryan sword are known for decent heat treat, i dont see a problem with it myself, however there are cheaper versions of the michone katana in 9260 i would choose
Click to expand...

Just out of curiosity, do you actually know something(with training from someone who knows something) or are you another self-taught keyboard commando?

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Kohai999 said:
Just out of curiosity, do you actually know something(with training from someone who knows something) or are you another self-taught keyboard commando?

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
Click to expand...

lol i am not a keyboard commando, i know ryan sword has swindlded people out of alot of money in the past for faking san mai swords, but that being said their heat treat is ok on what they do make, would i recommend them? no i would go with a better company for sure
 
tamahagane is an inferior steel to modern mono steels
Click to expand...

The word is more a process than a type of steel. In Japan, the bloom is broken apart, with bits and pieces being graded. To claim the process is inferior to modern steels kind of overlooks the process itself, with pigeonholing a word without elaboration of such a statement...

Cheers

GC
 
horseclover said:
The word is more a process than a type of steel. In Japan, the bloom is broken apart, with bits and pieces being graded. To claim the process is inferior to modern steels kind of overlooks the process itself, with pigeonholing a word without elaboration of such a statement...

Cheers

GC
Click to expand...

it is inferior i stand behind what i say, with tahamagane when you fold it you cannot guarantee the carbon content it is completely inconsistent, it is not like a modern mono steel where the carbon content is known on every blade, when they make them they give their best guess about what carbon is lost and what is in it, to me that makes an inferior blade
 
Highlander 20026 said:
it is inferior i stand behind what i say, with tahamagane when you fold it you cannot guarantee the carbon content it is completely inconsistent, it is not like a modern mono steel where the carbon content is known on every blade, when they make them they give their best guess about what carbon is lost and what is in it, to me that makes an inferior blade
Click to expand...

Seems to have gone right over your head. The bloom from tamahagane is broken apart and graded. While less specific than production of modern steels, the perception of inferiority appears to be rather subjective. A traditionally made Japanese sword is no less capable for its construction, if paralleled with a similarly made composite construction of modern steels. A monosteel blade is not what most traditional katana consist of. Hence, it is kind of silly to compare the two types of blades.

It doesn't necessarily make one better or worse, it it an entirely subjective matter.

that is the premise behind san mai construction wedging a hard steel between layers of soft steel, it has been done for 1000 years, so i guess it has tried and proven to work, however there are drawbacks about that type of construction they can take a set easier sometimes than a through hardened spring steel, so you kind of get a trade off
Click to expand...

Again, a statement with little depth

2dgsz74.jpg


I imagine you are drawing on the simplicity of what one might expect in Chinese production runs but some of the sweeping commentary doesn't lend to beginners learning very much, or encouraging what tamahagane via a tatara is, the components and types of construction of a traditional katana.

Which Chitana is "best" is conversation almost fully devoted to sites such as the Sword Buyers Guide and I can appreciate the disciples of such reviews sweeping the net but fast food service can become a disservice in promoting further study.

Cheers

GC
 
Last edited:
horseclover said:
Seems to have gone right over your head. The bloom from tamahagane is broken apart and graded. While less specific than production of modern steels, the perception of inferiority appears to be rather subjective. A traditionally made Japanese sword is no less capable for its construction, if paralleled with a similarly made composite construction of modern steels. A monosteel blade is not what most traditional katana consist of. Hence, it is kind of silly to compare the two types of blades.

It doesn't necessarily make one better or worse, it it an entirely subjective matter.



Again, a statement with little depth

2dgsz74.jpg


I imagine you are drawing on the simplicity of what one might expect in Chinese production runs but some of the sweeping commentary doesn't lend to beginners learning very much, or encouraging what tamahagane via a tatara is, the components and types of construction of a traditional katana.

Which Chitana is "best" is conversation almost fully devoted to sites such as the Sword Buyers Guide and I can appreciate the disciples of such reviews sweeping the net but fast food service can become a disservice in promoting further study.

Cheers

GC
Click to expand...

no it is not over my head i know all about it, the color of the bloom of the tahamagane when it comes out of the furnace is judged by the smith what is better, the rest goes to lower end makers for knives and silverware and what not, that still does not change what i said, once the homogenization process starts carbon is leached out of the steel, even though it is purifying it it still leaches out leaving inconsistent carbon content through out the blade, it cannot compare to modern steels
 
Highlander 20026 said:
even though it is purifying it it still leaches out leaving inconsistent carbon content through out the blade, it cannot compare to modern steels
Click to expand...

It doesn't need to compare to modern steels. That doesn't make it inferior. The Japanese swordsmiths KNOW what they are working with....the proof is in the cutting/performance.

Let me put it this way.

Bill Burke, ABS MS, is well versed in the heat treat of 5160 and 52100, multiple quench cycles and all that. He is also the sole source of Takefu laminated steels in the US. He LEADS smelts of tamehagane in the US. If it was actually inferior, he wouldn't waste his time, nor would the other smiths involved. They are busy, this is a full time endeavor for them, and if it didn't make a superior blade and be sellable, they just wouldn't do it.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Highlander 20026 said:
no it is not over my head i know all about it, the color of the bloom of the tahamagane when it comes out of the furnace is judged by the smith what is better, the rest goes to lower end makers for knives and silverware and what not, that still does not change what i said, once the homogenization process starts carbon is leached out of the steel, even though it is purifying it it still leaches out leaving inconsistent carbon content through out the blade, it cannot compare to modern steels
Click to expand...

Wrong again
http://www.nihontomessageboard.com/...Japanese_sword_the_science_and_technology.pdf

Cheers

GC
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top