• The BladeForums.com 2024 Traditional Knife is ready to order! See this thread for details: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/bladeforums-2024-traditional-knife.2003187/
    Price is $300 $250 ea (shipped within CONUS). If you live outside the US, I will contact you after your order for extra shipping charges.
    Order here: https://www.bladeforums.com/help/2024-traditional/ - Order as many as you like, we have plenty.

  • Today marks the 24th anniversary of 9/11. I pray that this nation does not forget the loss of lives from this horrible event. Yesterday conservative commentator Charlie Kirk was murdered, and I worry about what is to come. Please love one another and your family in these trying times - Spark

Carbide platen...?

There are many different sorts of TiN coatings. Try scraping it off a carbide insert for a turning tool, not happening.


One thing that comes to mind is that a carbide platten will definitely wear out overtime, and be much more expensive to replace. I use a piece of carbide (lathe inserts I don't have holders for) instead of something like a file to force a belt over the edge of the platten to cut plunges. Even a 400 grit AO belt will cut it.
And no it isn't some sort of cheese grade carbide, the inserts are Sandvik or Iscar

No doubt it'll last longer. It's a matter of if it's enough longer to be worth the cost
 
Geoff Flato said:
There are many different sorts of TiN coatings. Try scraping it off a carbide insert for a turning tool, not happening.


One thing that comes to mind is that a carbide platten will definitely wear out overtime, and be much more expensive to replace. I use a piece of carbide (lathe inserts I don't have holders for) instead of something like a file to force a belt over the edge of the platten to cut plunges. Even a 400 grit AO belt will cut it.
And no it isn't some sort of cheese grade carbide, the inserts are Sandvik or Iscar

No doubt it'll last longer. It's a matter of if it's enough longer to be worth the cost
Click to expand...

I have drawn the same conclusion. Tungsten is some hard stuff, sure. (Though not as hard as SOME think...numbers don't lie!) But it can be cut & wear out, like anything else. Compared to using glass, maybe M4, or even REX121, I don't think it's going to be cost effective. At least for me.


I'm also looking at Boron Carbide. Now THAT is some seriously hard stuff. The material itself is cheaper, but the only form I have been able to find is curved body armor plate. Based on the price of a Boron Carbide chest plate, a 1/4"x2"x8" plate would "seem" to be fairly inexpensive.
 
Really sorry that you're otherwise excellent thread has devolved into a train wreck Matt. Please let me know what you find out about the CARBIDE platens.
 
DavidHoback said:
The other thing, DUH! Tungsten carbide is measured on the Rockwell HRA scale w/ 60kg load. Not the HRC scale w/ 150kg load that most of us are familiar with. Look at the conversion of the A to C scale and get back to us.
Click to expand...
The "A" scale is used on tungsten carbide because the lower indenting force of 60 KGs is less likely to damage the diamond than the 150 KGs force used on the "C" scale.

This becomes a bit funny . I don t understand what you try to prove ? Tungsten carbide falls between 8.5 and 9.0 on Moh's hardness scale, making it almost as hard as diamond. As I already wrote , try to scratch that thing with anything except diamond and come back to us .I have plenty of that stuff and I can t scratch that thing with anything I have ??? I use them to align grinding stone and to save cutting disk for big angle grinder when piece break close to edge ........END of story for me !
 
Darrin Sanders said:
Really sorry that you're otherwise excellent thread has devolved into a train wreck Matt. Please let me know what you find out about the CARBIDE platens.
Click to expand...
It will work for sure ! Silicon carbide plate is even better solution because coefficient of friction is lower and silicon carbide has excellent thermal conductivity to dissipate localized hot spots . .. . .
 
The boron carbide idea would be worth looking into. Ask anyone who's used a Norbide dresser stick, and they'll tell you it makes tungsten carbide look like cheese.
I don't want to get into the how hard are things debate, but I've used both ceramic and Silicon carbide belts to shape tungsten carbide. It's hard stuff but definitely not immune to belt grinders
 
Geoff Flato said:
The boron carbide idea would be worth looking into. Ask anyone who's used a Norbide dresser stick, and they'll tell you it makes tungsten carbide look like cheese.
I don't want to get into the how hard are things debate, but I've used both ceramic and Silicon carbide belts to shape tungsten carbide. It's hard stuff but definitely not immune to belt grinders
Click to expand...


You are correct! As I said, Tungsten is some hard stuff....but it's not even in the top 10 hardest materials on Earth. Another thing is people still think diamond is the hardest material known to man. Uhhhh, Nope!


Oh I can hear the Google Search counter ringing off the chart! LOL!
 
DavidHoback said:
You are correct! As I said, Tungsten is some hard stuff....but it's not even in the top 10 hardest materials on Earth. Another thing is people still think diamond is the hardest material known to man. Uhhhh, Nope!


Oh I can hear the Google Search counter ringing off the chart! LOL!
Click to expand...

I think you've gone too far now :thumbsdown: Of course that I use data for hardness of some material from book or reliable source of information from internet ! And I m in Macedonia ....six hours difference with New York :) My I ask you how you know that 3V steel you use for knive have 0.80% Carbon , Chromium 7.50% , Vanadium 2.75% , Molybdenum 1.30% ???????????????????? Maybe you have steel analysis gun :eek: Now , if you look at mine post on this forum you will read that I live half mile from company which make many type of ballistic products .Luckily , owner is my friend , so it's not hard for me to get a variety of materials ...like kevlar , titanium , armor plate steel , advanced ceramics ... SIS or WC plate .You know , they make same test with all this things ...........If WC or SIC is not enough hard to you ....What's up to me you can order diamond plate . .. :D
 
Ok, well to everyone interested....

I just spoke with a supplier. His name is Bill. He asked me for exact size (1/8"x2"x8") & and use. I explained the purpose to him. He is going to work up a price on machine finished(several thousandths oversized) in 10% Cobalt grade. Which will be the least expensive, but give the strength & wear we are looking for. He said there will be quantity discount. So fingers crossed! I'll let everyone know as soon as he gets back to me.
 
DavidHoback said:
Ok, well to everyone interested....

I just spoke with a supplier. His name is Bill. He asked me for exact size (1/8"x2"x8") & and use. I explained the purpose to him. He is going to work up a price on machine finished(several thousandths oversized) in 10% Cobalt grade. Which will be the least expensive, but give the strength & wear we are looking for. He said there will be quantity discount. So fingers crossed! I'll let everyone know as soon as he gets back to me.
Click to expand...

Thanks, too bad I have a 12" platen.
 
Matthew Gregory said:
There's absolutely no reason for this becoming adversarial, guys. Really appreciate it if you could throttle the hostility back and just discuss the topic. No need for vitriol.

Here's my reason for wanting carbide, and it's just this easy...

I use a carbide file guide for cutting in shoulders.

Using ceramic belts.

They don't touch the carbide.

Simple premise, no? Seems like if the front of the belt isn't touching it, I'll go out on a limb and bet that the back of it won't, either. ;)
Click to expand...

Thanks for the thread Matt. I was just asking about this back in January, and didn't get quite the turn out this thread has gotten. I think there were only 2 others that had previously looked into it that commented. JoshRG and JT. I'm sure if there is a market for it the sizes we knifemakers would use someone might be able to offer a somewhat reasonable price.

I'm trying to reach out to a guy I used to work for in the thermal spray industry he says the number one coating being applied right now is tungsten carbide, or nickle chromium. I'm reaching out to him to find out what his take on doing a coating on a precision ground substrate (platen) would be cost wise VS. a carbide plate.
 
DavidHoback said:
Regardless, I'll still provide the info to you. They can make it 2"x12" also. They don't a quantity minimum. They will do ONE piece. Just waiting for price.
Click to expand...

It will be interesting to see what they price at. I just got a text back from my coatings buddy I used to work for. I'm calling tonight to discuss what cost effectiveness would be to HVOF or Plasma spray WCNiCr coating VS a tungsten carbide attached plate.
 
OT. Matt, next time you change pyroceram, include a few dabs of a metal-filled epoxy when you attach it to the base platen. It might help act as a ground.
 
Here's what we have guys. My contact can do these. Size 1/8"x2"x8" platen. It is 10% cobalt grade and what they call "unground", which means several thousandths oversize. Individualy, they are $133.30. 2 would be $93.87, 5 would be $87.02 and if we get 20 or more, they are $83.59. Lead timewould be approx. 2 weeks from time of order.

Not as bad as I thought. What thoughts? I'm still debating for the $133...but if we could get a 20 person group buy together, $83 sounds doable!
 
If we can get at least 20 together guys, I would not mind heading a Group Buy. It would be easy for me, as I'm disabled. So I have the time. And I already have Bill-the contact.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top