Chain prep for chain saw damascus

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Guy Thomas

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Feb 1, 2000
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Wayne Goddard mentions in his book that he grinds the chrome plating off the teeth before he welds up his chain saw damascus. Does anyone else here do that and if you don't have you had problems getting them to weld?

Guy Thomas
 
Guy, I have never done that, In fact I never even clean it although cleaning is a good idea if there is alot of crusty oil and saw dust still on the chain. I cut it in equal lengths and wire it together with the pins up and the cutter teeth staggered, heat long enough for the oils to burn out and start fluxing right away as there is alot of thin steel that that builds scale very quickly. It welds very nice. Bruce B
 
i did one this weekend i boiled the chain in simple greenand borax to get all the oil out of it i wired 2 chains together without cutting them I just folded them and stacked them on top o each other and pounded the pee out of it then beat it on the edge to close up the voids then floded twice ive got it forge to shape need to get a little thinner so another heat and beat is in orderi think i will take bruce's advice and start cutting my chain that sounds like it would work better i dont think the chains im using have chome on the cuting teeth i will post a picture when i get it finished Russ
 
Do you guy's hammer the billet any before it reaches welding temperature to close up gaps and voids or do you take the wired up billet on up to welding heat before the hammer touches it? Does the wire get welded up with it or do you weld a section loosen some wire, weld that section etc.?

Guy Thomas
 
Silent-

I'm glad you're asking these questions, it's all stuff that's on my mind as well.

I bought Wayne Goddard's two books and video as a set. There's a lot of neat info there! The video is worth a lot more than I paid for it.

Have you tried doing any cable yet? I think I will start with some cable, and then some chain....excited either way!
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I am probably getting ahead of myself. All I've forged so far, is two daggers out of rail-road spikes...and pounded the crud out of a couple files to see the effect of the hammer blows. But having made knives by stock removal for quite some time now, I want to get to the damascus!
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Nick
 
I start shaping with the hammer as soon as it is hot enough to start forming. There are alot of air spaces to work out and the soon er the better. The biggest problem I find is to be sure to keep the flux flowing to cover all the little hidden plates. Keep turning the piece to help it flow. If there is a place that didnt get fluxed scale forms and it will likely not weld. You cant weld scale. It too hard to take the wire off so I leave it on. Ive never been able to find it in the finished blade. Be sure not to stretch the billet if you want the best pattern. If you do stretch it it gets strung out but still looks cool. Just hammer it into a blade sized bar. You only have 5 or 6 seconds of welding time when removed from the fire. (when the lemon yellow color is even with no shadows.) Reflux before putting back in the forge each time after welding. When you are sure its welded and the air is out start wire brushing the flux off and turn temp down. The flux is hell on belts so try to have it all brushed off while forging to shape. If you want to do it all the clean way try the closed container method. Put all your chain as tight as posible into a square steel tube and put a peice of cardboard inside. Weld a cover on both ends with a wirefeed welder. Now forge it at welding temp and forge it to shape. At the high heat the mild steel gets pretty much burned up but the contents are nicely welded. No flux is needed. You guys shouldnt get me started. I can go on and on with damascus. Bruce B
 
Bruce,How thick are the walls of the square tubing that you use to weld with no flux ?
Bruce

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Bruce Evans Handcrafted Knives
The soul of the Knife begins in the Fire!!!!!
Member of,AKTI#A000223 and The American Bladesmith Society
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keep going bruce,your narration are great.wish i could vist you in your shop some day,you have alot of knowege. royboy

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Thanks, I use 1/16-1/8" thick sqaure tubing. I use a hydraulic press but a power hammer works good and it can be done with a hammer and anvil if you have a big right arm. The heat has to be very hot 2300 degrees and can be left in alot longer than a billet that would normally be burnt to a frazzle. The neat part about the encased billet is there is no oxygen to burn it up. The cardboard inside will burn any air trapped inside the container. The mild steel container will be burned and almost gone from the heat but the inside is nice damascus. This is also how mosaic is made. Have you seen the mosaic with the cool pictures? This is the way its done. Bruce B.
 
Allright! We are cooking now. We've got some really good information going here. Thanks!

Guy Thomas
 
One thing you might try is after bringing the future billet up to temp and after fluxing put one end in a vice and twist hell out of it. This will stiffen things up like a double dose of viagra and will make welding a lot easier. one other thing is that the shiny coating on the teeth of chainsaw chain is nickle and not crome. I know this is fact with chain made by Stihl, Sanvik and Oregon.

 
Burke, Welcome to the forums, That would tighten the contents. It wouldnt work if you were making a mosaic because the pattern would get distorted. Mosaics have to be kept sqaure. The nickel in saw steel is a good thing. It makes for some nice contrast and hardens ok. I make mosaics with 1084 and pure nickel. After polishing and hot blueing they have the best contrast possible. Bruce B
 
Bruce,

I you're right of course, about twisting mosaic but I was refering only to chainsaw chain in my post however the same proceedure works with cable.
 
Here's a neck knife I forged from oregon chain, leaving the teeth on. It has a really wild pattern. I forged it in a coal forge wired up with lots of borax. It's my favorite damascus, but then it's the only damascus I've forged successfully so far too
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View
 
Max, I like it. You have it shined up well. I usually etch it deep and cold blue the low spots and 2000 grit the high spots I think its some of the best cutting steel out there and it gets alot of attention at the shows. Ed Fowler uses the big industrial chain but I cant find any to try. Bruce B
 
Bruce B,

You should be able to go to your favorite saw shop and order a spool of oregon 11h chain. This is the big 3/4 pitch stuff and you have to get it from someplace that specializes in saws and stuff like that and it is not cheap. If you can't find any I can get it locally at about 4.50 per foot + shipping and you have to buy a hundred foot roll.



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Bondo
 
Ouch, Thats the high priced spred. I now know whats its called so I can ask them to save me some. There isnt any logging or wood mills running here anymore so all I can get is the small chain. The local Bike Shop saves me Harley chain also. I like the diamond brand because of USA made. I used some imported harley chain one time and found it wouldnt hold an edge. Maybe thats why it wore out and they were throwing it away. Bruce B
 
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