Chasing patterns... Imperial Outer's

[El Lobo]

Mike,
You are correct about how Mrs. Goins is listed...I guess I just never noticed.....

I can assure you, my wife feels and says the same things. I guess I would call my collection slightly "rudderless" or "eclectic" (thanks Phil )...she thinks it's repetitive, overloaded, and expensive. It's funny how there are so many words in the English language to describe the same thing.

Bill

 

[redshanks]

Ron,
What struck me as so unusual about this stamping was the detail of the stamp. The facets of the hammer head and the rolled up shirt sleeve on the arm are details I have not seen on the Imperial made Hammer Brand shell knives.

Dale

I haven't cleaned this one up to show all the detail, but under 3X magnification, I can clearly see the facets on the hammer. Do you notice anything odd about this stamp?

 

[El Lobo]

I'll have a go...
On this stamp, the word BRAND starts over the bicep and under the hammer head. On Dale's stamp, it starts behind the bicep and the hammer head, and finishes well outside the word HAM MER.

Bill

 

[relodr36]

Re: Royal Brand.....

I'm a bit of a Johnny Come Lately on this one, sorry.

Royal Brand was a New York City company, founded by Samuel Bernstein in 1914. They had knives imported and made domestically.The company was taken over in 1941 by the National Silver Company...which is one reason why Glenn found references to tableware, as they were famous for silverware.

Hope you can read the stamp...it is ROYAL BRAND...(over)...U.S.A.

According to Goins' book, they sold a lot of knives through F. W. Woolworth.

Bill

Since I had Voyles book out,I checked to see if he had anything about Royal Brand.
His remarks on page 369:
Royal Brand USA**(1914-1954) New York based company taken over by by Rubberoid*****Brand of LaSalle,and also used on some Excelsior boxes.
Note -The stars were used with brands not given a detailed,illustrated pricing section.The more stars after the brand name,the higher the relative value in the General Price Guide.(page 466).You cross referenced the pattern and condition under the appropriate stars table.
:jerkit: :jerkit: :jerkit: :jerkit:

I like Bill's info better.

Ron

 

[Codger_64]

And I am guessing that this was an artifact of the size of the tang space allowed on the fixed vs. folder, not a fake, mistake, or real change of the trademark, though Imperial did have multiple listings of registered mark for their Hammer Brand knives.

#70013498 7/13/1886 Hammerbrand mark
#71049670 04/25/1916 New Hammerbrand mark
#71384896 03/23/1937 New Hammerbrand Mark
#71467889 08/14/1945 New Hammerbrand mark

You can look these up at the USPTO and see what they looked like. It takes a bit of navigation, but the original art can be seen.



Codger

 

[redshanks]

I'll have a go...
On this stamp, the word BRAND starts over the bicep and under the hammer head. On Dale's stamp, it starts behind the bicep and the hammer head, and finishes well outside the word HAM MER.

Bill

That's true enough, but I was alluding to the number of fingers on the hammer handle. The top one has four, the bottom one has three.

 

[orvet]

Codger,
Are the tang stamps you listed the ones that were used by New York Knife Co.? The ones I listed & Redshanks listed are Imperial tang stamps? Or is it possible to date them that closely?

Dale

 

[El Lobo]

Ah Ha...

Good point redshanks. :thumbup: I should have gotten the finger...eek: )
The elbow looks different as well...a little less pointy.

Codger, I won't do very well with those artifacts...I'm not a digital guy, you know?



Interesting thread, for sure.

Bill

 

[lt632ret]

Tang stamps are not written in stone however they are in steel and as such they will have differences. Most of the time a stamp is reviewed in the feminine gender that is the impression upon the blade. Here is another view ( the stamp is backward of course for printing) the pic is a print of this actual stamp. This is an imperial version . LT PS Royal was also made on contract by imperial I also have one of those tang stamps around as well and it came from the same place. PPS I gave my wife credit for her help with my book and she left me. HUMM there is a lot to cover in this thread.

 

[redshanks]

Cool!

 

[orvet]

Thanks LT! :thumbup:
You seem to have answered my questions. I assume the standard disclaimer applies when dealing with Imperial/Schrade.......Nothing is written in stone (only steel).

Dale