Chinook II or Emerson CWQ for SD?

J

jinuineasn

Joined
Aug 16, 2005
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44
I'm deciding between a chinook II or emerson cqc 11 or cqc 12.
1.) Anybody that owns either one or all three?
2.) Which knife would you rather have strictly for SD purposes?
3.) Any other knife that is better for SD than the chinook or CQC series?
4.) What are the opening methods for the chinook II and Emerson CQC if i don't plan to clip the CQC to my pocket and using the wave feature?
I handled my friend's endura and it seemed hard to open the endura using the hole. I was wondering if this is the same case for the chinook. I want to be able to wrist flick or thumb flick my knives. Thanks.
 
Hey...

If you are looking for a Wave feature,, go with the Spyderco Waved Endura...

The Wave works much better than the Emerson, and won't eat your pockets as badly..

If your looking for another carry method for the WE4 try a Speed Dialer in a Mercharness

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ttyle

Eric
O/ST
 
where can I find the mercharness and speed dialer? :thumbup: That kinda reminds me of the emerson rapid deployment sheath/shoulder rig. :thumbup:
 
I won't buy liner locks for hard use and especially for self defense, so for me the Emerson is out. The Emerson is well-designed but the liner lock kills it for me (you may differ). The Chinook II is a brilliant SD design, very well done.
 
I own a couple 12s. They are frame locks. I like design of the 12 and Chinook. Both have pointy blades and large finger/hand guards.

Vu
 
I used to have a Chinook III, flat grind version of the Chinook II, and it was a stellar folder. It had a secure grip both regular and reverse, a great slicing blade and a rock solid lock. I don't you can wrong with a Chinook.

JMHO.
 
I would not stay away from liner locks for a SD knife. Although people on this forum talk smack about them, I have never had one on a well made knife break. Bob Terzuolas' ATCF is hands down one of the best folders you can get and come in liner lock. You will not find one person who will write back telling me there ATCF broke under anytihng but horrendous missuse. On top of all this stabbing a person or slicing them will not break even a cheap knife (dont kid yourslef to think your going to chop through there bone or anything).
That said I would take the Emerson oevr the chinook for pure SD but the chinook is probably a better all around blade to carry. If i was going to get an Emerson I would wait for the CQC-15 wich has a nice tanto point combined with a great cutting blade shape. Over any of these I would take an R.J. Martin but the prices are several hundred more. I would take a fixed blade into danger before any folder, if you are allowed to carry one. R.J. Martins Rampage is one of my favorite tactical fighters. All that said get a gun and keep a good knife as your backup.

Also I think that the chinook is a lockback, you cannot flick any lockback (that is still locking up tight). Flicking your knife is bad for it and a horrible practice for SD. It does not open it all the way all the time and if you are scared and sweaty may just launch your knife 10 to 20 feet away from you. Also flicking a knife to the point of failure may result in a negating your warranty.
 
If you want an SD knife emerson is the way to go. I own a cqc7 super and a commander and they have yet to fail me. What I don't get is the antagonism towards linerlocks. They're tough and reliable, lockbacks from spyderco are the one you should be careful with as the lockback from the Manix was reported to have defects.
 
waved spyderco endura is a cheap and good and razor sharp SD-oriented blade.

for purely SD, I have a Civillian.
 
Given your criteria, I don't think I'd go with EITHER the Chinook II OR the EKI. I own a CQC7, and I'd have to say that for SD you can't go wrong with using the wave. If you're not planning on having the CQC clipped, then that rules that out. I also think the blade on the Chinook is too heavy to be thumb or wrist flicked open. You would also have to break in the EKI- or loosen up the pivot- to get it to flick open. The disk on the EKI is NOT that big. Lest anyone get me wrong, I am a big fan of Emerson knives, and I've owned the Chinook (albeit the I instead of the II). Unless they changed the Chinook significantly, I can't see wrist flicking that thing open. Great knife too!

To be honest, if you are looking for a knife that will work for strictly SD, why not go with an Axis BM or an assisted opener from Kershaw (whether Kershaw directly or the Zero Tolerance line)? You can pull back on the Axis bar and flick open one of those VERY easily, and assisted opening makes it even easier.
 
I'm gonna recommend against any knife that you don't feel has a "super" strong lock. For me, this leaves axis, most frame, a few lockback (such as the chinook), and some semi/custom linerlocks. When I grip a linerlock tightly (hammer grip), sometimes there's a little click that I hear from the lock. When this happens, the blade has developed slight play. I've used linerlocks more than any other lock and have never had one close on me. But, I wouldn't go reverse-grip stab one into a tree as hard as I can.
A framelock like the cqc-12 I would (and have) stab into a tree without hesitation. The chinook I've also had, and felt it was the strongest lockback I've ever owned. Never put it through too much though. -Of these too, I would suggest the chinook only because it's cheaper. Also, I was able to flick mine openned. However, I would encounter trouble with this if I put too much pinch on the handle. -I always flick my knives open (hundreds of times each) and never encountered anything worse than a loose pivot. Probably not a great idea for sd though. While I do like the 12, alot, at the price, the chinook 2 or 3 is one of the best knives around. If it's gonna be a user, the 3 should work pretty well for a little of anything. Got a little more to spend, check out the 12. Try to hold them both if you can first. -Just my 6 cents.
I've heard it said that the chinook 2 and 3 are significantly looser than the 1. The 2 that I had was one of the smoothest lockback I've held. -No blade play.
 
BigJimSlade said:
I would not stay away from liner locks for a SD knife. Although people on this forum talk smack about them, I have never had one on a well made knife break. Bob Terzuolas' ATCF is hands down one of the best folders you can get and come in liner lock. You will not find one person who will write back telling me there ATCF broke under anytihng but horrendous missuse.
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Big Jim (love that movie),

Okay that you haven't seen a well made liner lock accidently release (not break, we're talking about accidental releases), becuase plenty of other people have. Case in point, I have an ATCF, and if I grip it tightly, my hand touches and partially unlocks the liner lock, after which it's not hard to get an accidental release. Some years back there was a discussion about this among ATCF owners, I'm pretty sure Bob even saw it and changed the way he does those locks. The fact that Bob Terzuola, one of the best knifemakers ever, had his own problems with unreliable liner locks pretty much says it all about the format. It is difficult to make consistently reliable, IMO, and therefore unsuitable to defensive use. To repeat, it is strong, but not reliable, in my opinion.

On top of all this stabbing a person or slicing them will not break even a cheap knife (dont kid yourslef to think your going to chop through there bone or anything).
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No one is talking about strength problems (breaking) with liner locks. The issue is reliability problems, which is a completely different issue, and has been seen too often to ignore. Not just with ATCFs, but with Emersons too.

Just wanted to clarify that!
 
ive never heard of lock probs with the '12 its a frame lock.

ive had a chinook and have handled a '12, i of the 2 i like the '12 better, its a little thinner/easier to carry, i like frame locks vs lock backs, not that the chinnok is bad i do like them but i like the '12.

also i like the manix better than the chinook.
 
CQC-12 looks great. Haven't handled one, but I'm good with framelocks. Looks like a tough choice between that and the Chinook. I like opening holes better than disks, but both are great, and the addition of the wave on the 12 is a real advantage.

If I were looking at the Chinook, I'd be looking much more at the Chinook 3.
 
Side-by-side if you compare, the Chinook II is a WAY better built folder in every way.

In fact, it's hard to find a tougher SD factory folder than the Chinook II.

.
 
fulloflead said:
Side-by-side if you compare, the Chinook II is a WAY better built folder in every way.
.
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Im not a huge Emerson fan as I think alot of what he says on his site (about knife design, not about knife fighting. He knows more about knife fighting than I hope I ever have to.) is snakeoil to sell knives. However I have always been happy with the build quality of Emerson knives. Im just wondering why you think its "WAY" better?
 
BigJimSlade said:
Im not a huge Emerson fan as I think alot of what he says on his site (about knife design, not about knife fighting. He knows more about knife fighting than I hope I ever have to.) is snakeoil to sell knives. However I have always been happy with the build quality of Emerson knives. Im just wondering why you think its "WAY" better?
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Open one and bend it and see which one flexed the most. The Spyderco is stronger built.

The S.C. has thicker liners and a thicker blade.

But mostly, S.C. engineers each of it's knives independantly. Emerson basically has one design which is a rather outdated 'operating system' and they're all basically all the SAME THING, only cut out in different shapes.

In contrast, Spydercos are more purpose-built and each knife is designed as a product on it's own.

I've owned plenty of both, and while I appreciate Emerson's old, simple, and original design that they've managed to stretch out over time and continue to market well, I think that Spyderco's method of designing (almost) every knife anew has evolved a better knife product while Emerson has, with a few exceptions, stood still while trying to repurpose, again and again, their original design.

In THIS case, the Chinook II, in fact, IS a better design over many other folder designs. Lock improvements. Opening is better than any other lockback that came before it... Tip-up/tip-down carry.

.
 
i can buy that arguement with a few EKIs but the '12 is the only framelock, the '12 & '13 are the only bowie looking blades, its quite a bit different than all the other EKIs imho.

as far as locks aint nothing wrong w/a frame lock, i've never been just nutz about lock backs, not that they are bad, just not my fav lock by far.

the chinook is a good one though, but i like the manix better and the Ti ATR a LOT better.

also hey a lot of spydies evolve from one model to another also, i mean knives have been made for thousands of yrs i'm not sure there is a lot of really new innovative stuff.
 
IMHO if you are serious about using one folder for SD then you can not go wrong with the Spyderco Endura for the price and availability of the trainer. As far as I can see the Chinook GEN II is the GEN I with persian blade. I do love my GEN I. For martial purposes I think you stand a lot better chance of having any folder close on you when you it fails to lock open then you do haveing a liner lock fail. That is why I will take a small fixed blade over a larger folder for people problems. Again nice this about the folder is that until you pop the blade out it is Kubaton / Pocket stick.
 
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