Choil Purpose

D

drift draft

Joined
May 12, 2007
Messages
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Can someone tell me the purpose of a choil. I notice there are different sizes and even shapes and usually fall in the plunge line.
I realize the most larger ones are used for choking up on the blade, but is there a structural purpose? Thanks in advance.
 
Nothing for structure, as far as I know. I use them for choking up and for sharpening; so nothing "gets in the way" when you sharpen your edge.
 
Yup, so you can get the entire edge to the stone.
 
Personally I can't stand the things, but they're pretty popular. To each his own, more than one way to skin a cat, etc.
 
Its a place of transition. A place to change direction and project a new line.
 
I think it looks good and it definately helps honing. I have heard that every time someone says the word choil Robert Loveless shed's a tear.
 
Anybody catch the article on choils in a past issue of blade mag? That explained it all.The explanation was like mentioned earlier so you can sharpen the full length of the edge, and if it is big enough you can put your fingers in it. They showed examples of a choil on a slippie all the way to a camp knife of sorts to put it into perspective.
 
I have no problem sharpening the full length of a blade without a choil, and personally am not a fan of choils because I find that stuff I am cutting sometimes hangs up in them. But on the bright side, 20 or 30 sharpenings into the life of a blade, a small choil will be gone.
 
Since I'm playing devil's advocate, I'll explain why I hate the things. I'm not trying to start a fight, just offering the other side of the story. It's just my $.02, and worth every penny you paid for it. Gosh, I love that line...

For the sake of argument, I'll presume we're talking about hunter/utility size knives.

Choke up on the blade... I much prefer a knife with an unobtrusive guard (if any) and a short ricasso, to make the most of every inch of blade. From peeling apples to skinning a mouse, I've not had a problem getting close to my work that way. Nor have I ever had a problem gripping the spine between thumb and fingers for close work, while still keeping my tender digits away from the "ouch" part. I have never understood the concept of putting my finger directly against the edge.

Ease of sharpening... so instead of a millimeter or two of plunge that's not sharp, I now have a big ol' divot behind the edge for things to catch on? Nice. And oh yeah, now I can put my finger right there and, well, see above.

I made a couple knives with small, 1/4" radius choils intended to be used to scrape sparks off a ferro-rod. But I came to the conclusion that they interfere with smooth cutting, and sparks can be made just as easily with a nice square spine.

Design factor... I often wonder if big choils are just an excuse to use the Dremel or Foredom tool and make the knife look "cool". No offense to anyone who makes them or uses them. It's just not my preference.

Structurally... I doubt it hurts any unless it's really extreme. It's not like a sharp inside corner that would be a stress-riser. But it sure doesn't help to remove steel unnecessarily in the area that's going to receive the most stress if someone batons the blade through wood or a sternum. (yeah, I'm probably over-paranoid about that kind of thing, I admit it openly.)

Thanks for letting me rant. :o
 
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I made a big bowie blade with about a 1" choil and after I decided to take it out to the bush and actually try to cut with the thing. I found that the choil area really affected the cutting ability when it came to getting in close to peel bark off a branch or cut small sticks (leverage-wise). To get the most out of a blade, I like being able to use the edge closest to the guard or handle to cut effectively. The choil, in my opinion, just gets in the way. I really like the way Raymond Richard does his blades where the otherwise would-be-choil area is rather a radius that nicely curves inward to the guard.
 
James, as far as hindering cutting by hanging on things, it's not our fault you yanks can't ever get your blade control down! :eek::eek::p

J/K, James. Those are good points. I like choils, personally, and I've made knives with and without. To me they're pleasing to the eye as far as lines go, and do tend to set apart the blade. But I'm not doing much skinning, so I'm not too worried about hanging the choil on something.

--nathan
 
silver_pilate said:
James, as far as hindering cutting by hanging on things, it's not our fault you yanks can't ever get your blade control down! :eek::eek::p

J/K, James. Those are good points. I like choils, personally, and I've made knives with and without. To me they're pleasing to the eye as far as lines go, and do tend to set apart the blade. But I'm not doing much skinning, so I'm not too worried about hanging the choil on something.

--nathan
Click to expand...

Point taken, my suthren friend. It's a matter of preference. Choose the blade you like, I say. :)
 
Wade, it may be you I stole the line from. I know I saw it somewhere around here but I can't recall who it was... :o

As for me being a Yankee, my biological father was from Tennessee. Y'all are just jealous you don't get to walk on the lake 6 months of the year. I just consider myself American. :)
 
James_Terrio said:
Since I'm playing devil's advocate, I'll explain why I hate the things. I'm not trying to start a fight, just offering the other side of the story. It's just my $.02, and worth every penny you paid for it. Gosh, I love that line...

For the sake of argument, I'll presume we're talking about hunter/utility size knives.

Choke up on the blade... I much prefer a knife with an unobtrusive guard (if any) and a short ricasso, to make the most of every inch of blade. From peeling apples to skinning a mouse, I've not had a problem getting close to my work that way. Nor have I ever had a problem gripping the spine between thumb and fingers for close work, while still keeping my tender digits away from the "ouch" part. I have never understood the concept of putting my finger directly against the edge.

Ease of sharpening... so instead of a millimeter or two of plunge that's not sharp, I now have a big ol' divot behind the edge for things to catch on? Nice. And oh yeah, now I can put my finger right there and, well, see above.

I made a couple knives with small, 1/4" radius choils intended to be used to scrape sparks off a ferro-rod. But I came to the conclusion that they interfere with smooth cutting, and sparks can be made just as easily with a nice square spine.

Design factor... I often wonder if big choils are just an excuse to use the Dremel or Foredom tool and make the knife look "cool". No offense to anyone who makes them or uses them. It's just not my preference.

Structurally... I doubt it hurts any unless it's really extreme. It's not like a sharp inside corner that would be a stress-riser. But it sure doesn't help to remove steel unnecessarily in the area that's going to receive the most stress if someone batons the blade through wood or a sternum. (yeah, I'm probably over-paranoid about that kind of thing, I admit it openly.)

Thanks for letting me rant. :o
Click to expand...

James, do you make it a habit of skinning small critters (cats and mice and such)?

:)
 
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daveinvegas said:
James, do you make it a habit of skinning small critters (cats and mice and such)? :)
Click to expand...

Nope! But I did gut and skin a mouse once just to see if I could. "Man's gotta eat" indeed... if I ever get really lost and/or hungry, I know I can get a teaspoon or so of fresh meat off a mouse if I'm lucky enough to catch one. :) Frogs are easier to clean, BTW. Just lop off the legs and feet, peel the skin off and cook 'em up. :D

My point (ho ho) was that I didn't find a choil necessary to get close-up and personal when doing it, that's all. The knife I used was a good ol' Buck 110 and it worked just fine. I mostly held the blade between my thumb and index finger. I would have preferred if it had less ricasso.
 
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On big Bowies or broad blades, whether forged or stock removal, I recon a narrower choil allows for a better transition or flow into the handle. If we are talking forging specifically it is a by product of forging the edge out. I think there's room for both and choose what ever looks best on the knife I am designing at the time.

that will be two pennies please

Peter
 
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