CHOP OFF VIDEO: NMFBM vs FFBM vs Himalayan Imports 18" AK

Discussion in 'Himalayan Imports' started by Ankerson, Feb 17, 2010.

  1. Ankerson

    Ankerson Knife and Computer Geek Gold Member

    Nov 2, 2002
    This is a chop off between the Busse NMFBM, FFBM and Himalayan Imports 18” AK, I took my largest 3 choppers that I use and put them against each other to see which one would come out on top. All 3 knives did very well as you will see when you watch the videos.

    Specs are as Follows:

    NMFBM:
    11.5” Blade
    17.5” OAL
    .25” Thick
    31.5 ounces

    FFBM
    10” Blade
    16” OAL
    .3125” Thick
    32 Ounces

    18” AK
    12.25” Blade
    18” OAL
    .500” Thick
    About 40 Ounces, Not sure exactly, but it’s heavy.


    Part 1
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    Part 2
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    Part 3, Wrap up
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  2. killa_concept

    killa_concept

    May 19, 2009
    No offense and purely as constructive criticism, but I noted a couple of things about your kukri technique:
    1) You seemed to be using the area behind the sweet spot for a number of your swings... watching the video closely, those times tend to correspond with getting only small chips out of the log.
    2) you also were using a very typical "squeeze-the-sucker-tight" grip on the khuk - this works great for most straight and ergonomically designed knives, but on khuks, it tends to: tire you out more quickly (noted in your heavy breathing and having to switch hands), transfer a lot of the impact energy to your palm, cause the handle to twist in your hand and the blade to glance on impact (also noted a time or two) and to produce a fairly weak "bite". The best technique is a "two-finger-wrist-flick" where you essentially start by holding the kuk with only your thumb and pointer/middle fingers. The back of the kuk should form a 45 degree angle (or so) with your forearm... then as you swing it forward with your arm, you flick the khukri forward with your wrist, grip it with all fingers (though not tightly) causing added leverage, and upon impact, the spine of the khuk should be at about 135 degrees with your forearm.


    The way I explain it might seem a kind of complicated, but it's just the dynamics behind the kukri design - it takes a certain technique that isn't instinctive. Yes, you can argue that the NMFBM is the superior chopper because it requires less specific technique and is tempered all throughout instead of in a specified "sweet spot", but that's like saying that a machete slices better than a katana after simply having used both with no prior experience. Anyways, if you intend to hang on to the AK, give my suggested technique a go and you'll probably see improved results :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2010
  3. alexs

    alexs

    516
    Nov 26, 2009
    Much appreciated videos, thank you.
    Alex
     
  4. Ankerson

    Ankerson Knife and Computer Geek Gold Member

    Nov 2, 2002
    That works fine on green wood or wood that isn't as hard as this stuff I was chopping is, it's like chopping a rock. It wouldn't have gone though the outer layer, trust me, it would have just bounced off. ;) That's the reason I was swinging all the knives as hard as I was. ;)

    I have been using Khurkies for a long time now.

    I will be glad when I am done with that tree I can tell you.
     
  5. killa_concept

    killa_concept

    May 19, 2009
    What kind of wood is that by the way? It has a fairly nice color...

    And truth be told, the technique works just as well on very hard trees as it does on lesser vegetation... during winter break, I was up in Canada and used my 18" Vojpure to hack down a couple of dead, standing, 8" thick pines... they were frozen solid and practically stone pillars (There was a foot of snow and it was -15C at the time... and oddly enough, that was actually one of the warmer days in that area).

    The technique I mentioned is fairly straight forward physics if you give it some thought - by adding your wrist into the equation, you're adding another fulcrum point with which the kukri gains added momentum and force while also putting less strain on your forearm and shoulder. The slightly looser grip also DOES take away from the amount of shock transferred to your hand and - so long as your angle is right - will make handle twisting issues and glancing blows a bit less frequent. Like I said - give it a go. Most people who have more experience handling khuks will attest to the method :)
     
  6. Ankerson

    Ankerson Knife and Computer Geek Gold Member

    Nov 2, 2002

    Cedar I think, it's been dead for over 18 years, was still standing until 3 years ago when it fell over. On the ends it's really a lot softer and the method you mentioned works fine, I have been chopping on it off and on for awhile, but toward the middle that method doesn't work. It's just way too hard of wood, it's like it's petrified or something. IF you don't lets say force the blade through the wood it just bounces off.... And that's any blade I tried on that log.

    If you goto my channel on Youtube and watch some of the other videos you will see how hard that log really is. You will see blades bouncing off instead of going through. ;)
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2010
  7. Cpl Punishment

    Cpl Punishment

    Jan 28, 2006
    Couple things:

    1.) My sound card is dead, so I couldn't hear the commentary, so if you covered these things, I didn't hear it.
    2.) Through hardening isn't really an advantage when chopping, since the sweet spot for a BM type knife is just before the edge sweeps up to the point, so you're really only using a very small section of the blade to chop with. IOW, I don't think it makes a difference in this experiment.
    3.) The whip motion works just as well for straight blades as it does for kukri, and at the end of the whip motion, you wrist should be at near full extension, and you should have the grip just locked in before impact. This always works better (I know, I've done the experiments on wood around my yard that full size axes bounce off, but I could chop with a knife or kukri (sloooooowy). Oh, the whip technique also works for tomahawks, much to my surprise. (Kukris have revolutionized my chopping with almost all my tools.)
    4.) It's no surprise how much better the FFBM and NMFBM did

    Now, if you just had a MOAB to put up against this :eek: :eek: :
    [​IMG]
     
  8. Ankerson

    Ankerson Knife and Computer Geek Gold Member

    Nov 2, 2002

    If I just had the money to buy a MOAB.... :eek:

    Really I never wanted a MOAB, it's just one of those knives that really never turned me on personally. :confused:

    I have had that happen to me too, Axes bouncing off logs, that's never fun. :eek:
     
  9. C.S. Graves

    C.S. Graves

    Jun 13, 2006
    Seems like the penetration you spoke of with the NMFBM likely gave it an edge in the chop-off. I'd wager the AK had a thicker edge geometry... less bite can make for more glancing and fewer flying woodchips... in spite of the greater weight. Cool comparison! :thumbup:

    P.S.: watching you chop is tiring! :D
     
  10. Ankerson

    Ankerson Knife and Computer Geek Gold Member

    Nov 2, 2002
    Yes, the NMFBM has a very thin edge with a convex primary grind, that does give it a huge advantage. :)
     
  11. HighDesertWalker

    HighDesertWalker

    Mar 11, 2008
    Excellent test Ankerson. I have all three blades you used but have only tested the AK and a GB Wildlife hatchet; performance was excellent on an 8" blow-down with both blades. It took about 5 minutes too chop all the way through. In addition, I just purchased a BWBM. Many claim that the BW should be the best chopper due to its thinner (3/16 in) blade. I don't know myself, but it will fun doing some more tests when the snow lets up. :D
     
  12. Ankerson

    Ankerson Knife and Computer Geek Gold Member

    Nov 2, 2002
    Thanks man. :)

    You will see what the BWM will do once you get it. ;)

    It's a nice blade, but not a heavy chopper, at 3/16" blade is too thin as it cuts down the weight too much to really bite. :)

    It's a good blade for lighter stuff though, but an FFBM or CGFBM it's not. ;)
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2010
  13. greenwoods

    greenwoods

    Sep 2, 2006
    Thanks for the hard chopping work, Ankerson.
    I will say though, that for the long work days I have always preferred my 17 3/4" WW II.

    Almost time for a new log:)

    Take care,
    Mark
     
  14. Ankerson

    Ankerson Knife and Computer Geek Gold Member

    Nov 2, 2002
    Thanks. :)

    I need to find one that isn't like a concrete column. :eek:
     
  15. greenwoods

    greenwoods

    Sep 2, 2006
    Yeah, I can imagine that. I sure as heck know the difference between Pine, Spruce and Rock Maple:eek: logs.

    I have no experience with the busse blades and I only mentioned my ww 2 khuk as I have worked long hours with my cak as well and found that my arm is so much happier with the lighter blade:)

    thanks and be safe,
    mark
     
  16. C.S. Graves

    C.S. Graves

    Jun 13, 2006
    Ain't that the truth! That's why there's a sub-culture here of Bonecutter fans, given its slimmer edge geometry than other many other khuk patterns.

    I have a non HI khuk that has always had a really FAT convex edge... chopping with it was a real workout! Lovely khuk still, and I ought to do some further reprofiling on it. I think it was meant more as a combat design, rather than wood chopping though,
     
  17. Ankerson

    Ankerson Knife and Computer Geek Gold Member

    Nov 2, 2002
    If you really thin out the blade profile that will make a difference. :)
     
  18. JUSTRIGHT

    JUSTRIGHT

    819
    Aug 10, 2001
    nice, chuk-up on that khuk.......it will be easier.
     
  19. C.S. Graves

    C.S. Graves

    Jun 13, 2006
    It's proven to be quite a challenge with the stuff available to me... it's seen a few hours on the belt grinder... this one is seriously FAT. I've considered taking a rotary tool to it as a last resort.
     
  20. pittsteele

    pittsteele

    Aug 24, 2001
    hey, what is this model??? :confused:

    :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
     

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