cold weather steel?

A

adfprpusn

Joined
Oct 27, 2005
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19
Hey guy's/ gals
I've had limited cumputer access the last few years, I sure have missed you. I'll get to the point.

I was thinking of buying or making a knife for use in sub-zero temps. This knife will be subjected to impact and light prying. Does anyone have any suggestions on blade materials and/or temporing. Ideally I would like the steel to be soft enough to sharpen on river rock in a survival situation.

The pommel on my Ka-Bar Next Gen (440-A) recently popped off with light pounding in such conditions. The tang snapped like a twig. I don't know if I just got a bad one, but it blew my confidence in this product. I want a knife I can count on, espesially when its that cold!

The steel on my ice axe (mountaineering "pick") seems like what I'm looking for.

Any insite or opinion welcome,
 
GET a Mission Knife!! Go to their web-page and read about Titanium. My 2nd choice would be a Busse. Post what you get. Good luck.
 
If you want it inexpensive, any of the good old tough carbon steels will do fine, and have done so for a lot of long years.
 
Busse, Fehrman, Fallkniven, a fixed blade from any of these companies should be able to do what you are looking for.
Busse would be the best, though the most expensive and hardest to find. They rotate which model is produced for a month or two at a time, so getting the one you want can involve a bit of luck and patience.
http://www.bussecombat.com/

Fehrman knives are almost as good as Busse, but are available on demand rather than waiting years for the shop to put out the model you want.
http://www.fehrmanknives.com/

Fallkniven knives should be almost as tough as the other two, and they use stainless steel. If that is important then I would choose one of those.
http://www.newgraham.com/SearchResult.aspx?CategoryID=151

I know I shouldn't recommend knives that aren't out yet, but these will be worth the wait. My last recommendation is the Benchmade 158 CSK II.
The CSK II is made of 1095, which should be extremely durable, and easy to resharpen. Plus being a Benchmade you know it's good quality.
Should be about $60.00 when they are released.
 
a good carbon steel that is kept at a decent Rc should work, Titanium is very tough and should work real well. Busse knives are all deep cryo'd down to -300 degrees, so the tempering process at all useable temperatures is complete. Cryo allows almost complete transformation to martensite and it refines the grain structure. Of course there are those that do not believe in cryo, so there you go.
 
In sub-zero weather, steel can snap like a tooth pick! Titanium will flex and will NOT break. Mission Knives.
 
We chopped many holes in the ice for fishing and out of boredom when we were kids. Our knives took extra abuse in the winter because everything was frozen. Our fixed blades were the old standard 440C steel. They dulled quickly from the ice but never broke. We never thought twice about using them. We also used many Old Hickory knives for the same purpose. They were probably 1085 or 1095 and never failed. Lowest temps. we had in that area were only around -5 or -10 so perhaps colder weather would have a different result.
 
Lycosa said:
In sub-zero weather, steel can snap like a tooth pick! Titanium will flex and will NOT break. Mission Knives.
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Not if it's properly treated steel, not in any normal use. Basic carbon steels have survived all necessary work in the arctic since steel was discovered. Titanium is nice and fancy, but in no way is it needed for sub-zero weather. My carbon steel knives and axes do just fine in -40 degrees Fahrenheit.
 
Also, with Titanium, there will be no rusting to worry about. They all work. You pick!
 
Lycosa said:
Also, with Titanium, there will be no rusting to worry about. They all work. You pick!
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Titanium knife technology is not to the point where it will hold a good edge like most other production steels. Even the Beta Ti will not do so. True it will not rust, but then again there are other very tough high edge holding steels that will not rust. Titanium blades have their niche uses but do not make a good general use knife IMHO.
 
Lycosa said:
In sub-zero weather, steel can snap like a tooth pick! Titanium will flex and will NOT break. Mission Knives.
Click to expand...

What? Where did this misinformation come from? Most small-carbide carbon steels are flexible as a spring (literally, since many are spring steels). Traditional carbon steels have been used for hundreds of years in Scandinavia, where I believe their winters are not exactly mild.

Stainless steels, especially premium high-wear-resistance ones, can be more fragile, but they are so even under room temperature.

Yes, steels will fracture easier under low temperatures, along with all other metals. But if you handled a knife that "snapped like a tooth pick", then it tells more about the heat-treat on the knife and how you are using it than the supposed inferiority of steel.

Lycosa said:
Also, with Titanium, there will be no rusting to worry about. They all work. You pick!
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H1 steel, for example, is even more resistant to corrosion than titanium.

Lycosa said:
Did you ever use a Mission knife?
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I'm sure they're great, but "OMG steels will snap like a toothpick! Buy titanium now!" seems to be a little overboard.
 
Cobalt , cryo does NOT refine grain structure ! The grains are already formed at much higher temperatures during initial quench.
 
Lycosa said:
In sub-zero weather, steel can snap like a tooth pick! Titanium will flex and will NOT break. Mission Knives.
Click to expand...

Titanium isn't known for its edge holding ability, whether made by Mission or anyone else. Fallknivens were designed with extremely cold temperatures in mind and I haven't experienced any inexpensive knife rusting or "snapping like a toothpick" in the cold let alone a higher performance steel like VG-10 or INFI. Some basic maintenance and common sense go a long ways towards preventing things like that from happening. When I was growing up in northern BC my inexpensive 440-series folders and fixed blades always held up just fine with temperatures dropping to -35C to -40C.

adfprpusn: Busse or Fallkniven are both worth consideration
 
Lycosa said:
Torm---Have you ever used a Mission knife?
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When did you become the Mission Knife shill? RC below 50? You would be better off with Talonite, H1 or X15 at a much lower price. I have used them(MPK Ti) and they do not hold a good edge. Talonite does not either but it holds a cutting edge with the carbides that works best when drawing it through material. H1 holds a razor edge that hardens with work. X15 also holds a good edge with use. Perhaps my general use is more than others.
 
As long as we are suggesting knives Chris Reeve makes fixed blades in A2 tool steel and in S30V stainless.

Strider makes a number of fixed blades in S30V.
 
Jared Stenoien said:
Would you be willing to describe the mechanism by which the cold breaks up the grains? Or at least provide a credible link to a technical article that does.
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The info is so common knowledge that you can find it if you search long enough in the right sources or talk to the right people.

Mete, I am actually very surprised at your response, since you have been here long enough and in enough discussions about this stuff that I cannot believe you came out and contradicted, but since you have been here a while I will let you explain after some research why in your opinion there is or there is not.

maybe you can resurrect Cliff to explain it.:D
 
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