Combo-edge or plain edge for self-defense?

C

chaya

Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
167
Hey guys,

For a knife, primarily for self-defense, which type of blade would be better? The combo-edge would be useful in other situations for the serrated half of the blade (wood/rope cutting, etc.), but if that isn't as good for the self-defense effect of the knife I wouldn't want it instead of the plain edge.

So to sum it up, does the serrated half-blade (or full serrated, for that matter) have an effect on the self-defense aspect of the knife?

Thanks,
chaya
 
One reason for a serrated blade for self-defense: they cut through jackets better. I doubt a combo blade has enough serrations to make a difference unless it's long enough to have three inches or more of serrations.
 
For SD, I recommend plain, but if this thread gets any longer, you will see just as many people recommending serrated. Bottom line for me. Knives for stabbing I choose plain. But for knives with hawkbill blades that are used for slicing I would recommend serrated.
 
For self defense I recommend the Emerson Combat Karambit, its a 2.6 inch karambit folder... Its curved like a claw. However, I use serrated for self defense since I don't yet own a Combat Karambit. I will in a few weeks.

For my self defense weapon either stabbing or slashing I use a combo edge. Reason why is damage, the serrations tear more flesh.
 
DeathByCactus said:
For self defense I recommend the Emerson Combat Karambit, its a 2.6 inch karambit folder... Its curved like a claw. However, I use serrated for self defense since I don't yet own a Combat Karambit. I will in a few weeks.

For my self defense weapon either stabbing or slashing I use a combo edge. Reason why is damage, the serrations tear more flesh.
Click to expand...
You for got to add "if you have Karambit training.".
 
I strongly prefer straight (plain) edges. Serrated edges tend to grab and snag instead of cut, which means unless your attacker is naked, they will be thwarted far more easily. Serrations come into their own on materials that are fixed firmly in place and stretched under tension. Baggy clothing will simply get caught in the scallops and move/slide along with the knife, effectively rendering the edge useless.
 
If I was carrying a knife strictly for SD, it would probably be at least partially serrated. In a defensive situation, I think stabbing moves would work better though for the most part, so I guess a sharp and strong point would be key. But since I use a knife for so many utility purposes, I like plain edge. It slices better and is easier to sharpen. I think it's just personal preference.
 
At one point, my job pretty much consisted of cutting manila rope. Serrations snagged a lot and were a pain in the ass - the only things I like em on were hardwood and plastics...

For SD, your objective ought to be to cause massive trauma via penetration. To this end, the nature of the edge is secondary. However, serrations are more likely to snag on heavy clothing.

Except for specific utility purposes, stick to a plain edge.
 
For self defense I would carry a knife that was Plain edge and as sharp as I could get. Here is a thread from a little while back in which the second post by Jackknife says he tested both serrated and plain edged knives against leftover meat wrapped in denim. He said that the serration cut through the clothes faster but not much into the meat, while the plain edge had a harder time on the denim but went a lot deeper into the meet that the serrated.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=390949&highlight=ham
 
Cold Steel serrations cut through clothing very well. But then, they're a fine cut. Larger serrations I have no use for. But it's all personal preference.
 
Thanks a lot, guys! This is very helpful. Nice link, Lurp, that whole topic is very informative.

It seems that the plain edge would be the way to go from what people have said, unless maybe you have a huge serrated monster, but that might not be very practical. :P

And no, I don't have karambit training, but thanks for the input. :)

- chaya
 
That's a combo-edge, yeah. Nice-looking knife. A bit expensive for some, though. I imagine a combo-edge Endura would be a less-expensive but good choice as well.

- chaya
 
All the people I have trained under recommeded plain edged, v-e-e-e-e-r-y sharp knives if you were going to carry a blade with SD in mind.

Now that doesn't mean there aren't people who feel - and train - the other way, but MY preference is plain.

If you're actually serious about carrying a blade for SD, and think you are even vaguely likely to ever need it, I'd highly recommend that you get some training from a qualified intructor - ANY good instructor of ANY style is immensely superior to no training - and see what knife works well with what you are taught.

Meanwhile if you don't have any training but your heart is set in carrying a blade, I'd look at a good quality hawkbill or SD-oriented wharnciffe, buy one that's sharp as hell, and carry something else to do every day cutting with, like a Swiss Army knife. (So that your SD piece stays scary sharp.)

I'm talking about folders like a Spyderco Harpy or Yojimbo, or a Benchmade Gravitator of you're a linerlock guy, or a fixed blade like a Spydie Ronin, BM Instigator, oe Emerson LaGriffe.
 
Thanks for your reply, Nick. :)

I'm afraid instruction isn't an option right now, but the written wisdom on grips, stances, etc. seems to be plentiful. Everything I learn will be taken with a grain of salt, as the false and bad advice on knife SD is, I'm sure, everywhere.

To my knowledge Spyderco blades made of VG-10 steel can get pretty dang sharp. Right now I wouldn't be able to buy anything as expensive as the folders you mentioned, so if I did select something it would be a smaller-priced, high-quality, highly-recommended blade. I hope that such a blade would be equal to the task of SD even if not specifically made for it if such a living nightmare occured.

And most people have recommended plain-edge. Thanks. :)

- chaya
 
chaya said:
Right now I wouldn't be able to buy anything as expensive as the folders you mentioned, so if I did select something it would be a smaller-priced, high-quality, highly-recommended blade.
Click to expand...

Chaya, the BM Instigator is available for a hair over $30

http://newgraham.com/detail.aspx?ID=4328

The inexpenive (FRN) version of the Harpy, the Merlin, is out of production right now, but you can still find it under $50

http://www.chssecurity.com/merlin--nylon-resin---fiberglass--spyder-edge-4080004.html

and the current spydie FRN hawkblade, the Tasman Salt, goes under $55, in your choice of edges and colors.

http://newgraham.com/SearchResult.aspx?KeyWords=tasman

You step down to a Byrd Pelican or Crossbill, for $20, but - unless the QC gets a little higher - I wouldn't not for SD. They are VERY nice pieces for the price, but I'd spend the extra $10 - $30 on a BM or Spyderco.
 
Thanks for the info, Nick, it is much appreciated. :) I really like the Salt. Or would a fixed-blade neck knife (like the Instigator you mentioned) be good for SD? I think a pocket folder would be easier for me to get at.

- chaya

Nick Hyle said:
Chaya, the BM Instigator is available for a hair over $30

http://newgraham.com/detail.aspx?ID=4328

The inexpenive (FRN) version of the Harpy, the Merlin, is out of production right now, but you can still find it under $50

http://www.chssecurity.com/merlin--nylon-resin---fiberglass--spyder-edge-4080004.html

and the current spydie FRN hawkblade, the Tasman Salt, goes under $55, in your choice of edges and colors.

http://newgraham.com/SearchResult.aspx?KeyWords=tasman

You step down to a Byrd Pelican or Crossbill, for $20, but - unless the QC gets a little higher - I wouldn't not for SD. They are VERY nice pieces for the price, but I'd spend the extra $10 - $30 on a BM or Spyderco.
Click to expand...
 
Chaya, my opinion is that the problem with questions about "good for SD" are so dependent on you, and your training. There is a commonly voiced opinion which I largely agree with that IF someone lacks blade training, a hawkbill or martial wharncliffe is the easiest and most effective blade to use "instinctively". From that point of view, a Merlin or Salt would be better than an Endura, and an Instigator better yet because of teh lack of a lock to potentially fail and the lack of a need to unfold it to deploy.

But we're pretty much at the point where, as a long distance discussion, :) we're really just kicking the ball around - I could give you my opinions and generalities all day, but we're getting pretty close to just discussing my opinions on what MAY work for you rather than getting you any closer to meaningful knowledge.
 
Yes, I agree. I have no training as of yet. Thanks a lot for your advice. :)

- chaya
 
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