Considering an ambitious project.

Fletch Helical

Fletch Helical

Joined
Sep 29, 2009
Messages
1,614
Howdy folks, still lurking around here and still a maker at heart. However in the last year I bought a house and have been dedicating most of my free time to working on it. However the bug to make knives is gnawing at my soul and I think it's about time to get geared up to let some sparks fly. I work with a gal who is an awesome individual and we've become good friends and she's helped me out quite a bit. She's not the type to ask anyone for anything and she is a good soul who could use a little sunshine in her life. As a token of my appreciation I'm going to attempt to make a knife as a birthday present for her which (thankfully) is about 6 months away. So my plan is to get something that resembles a shop set up in my garage the next is making a knife. Now she is more of a "guys gal" and not your typical "froo froo" girl. I know she has an appreciation for knives so in conversation I asked her if she had a favorite type of knife. As it turns out it's a Bowie:eek:. Now bear in mind I don't have a ton of knives under my belt and it's been quite a while since I even ground some steel. The ones I have made have been all full tang and stock removal. So I have a few hurdles here:

1. I know it's possible to make a full tang bowie. I'm not sure if I try and go that route or make matters worse on myself and toss a hidden tang into the fray also.

2. Next is the issue of the guard...Never made one let alone try and fit one. Most of my designs have had a guard built into the blade shape/design itself

3. Steel and size. I know most people shun a stainless Bowie but chances are it's never going to get used for anything other than a display so I was thinking going that route. I'm not opposed to a HC steel but regardless what width stock should I be considering?

4. It's a Bowie

Those appear to be the biggest hurdles I think, aside from the "I haven't made a knife in about 2 years" minor thing. :p

What I DO have going for me is time and patience. I'm in no rush to get this thing done and even for a slacker like me 6 months or so should be enough time to get this thing done and if anyone remembers my you might remember I'm incredibly anal about getting things right even if I have to ditch the power tools and do it all by hand.



Now also in the grand scheme of things I'm sure if I made any knife and gave it to her she'd be ecstatic. My other issue is do I go big on this one (Bowie) or just make something I'm comfortable with. I already have the ideas for the handle and sheath. She originally said she'd like a Bowie with a stag handle, but I asked how she would feel about something like a dyed blue Box Elder or other dyed blue burl as blue is her favorite color. She never even considered that and thought that would be awesome too. (mind you I've never done any stag handles either :D) And I'm planning on doing the sheath with a blue stingray skin inlay in it. If I can pull this project out of any orifice on my body it would be amazing. So what say ye? Push the envelope on this (and if so what's the best way to go about it). Or take the easy way out and stay in my comfort zone.
 
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First make one in your comfort zone,just to get back in the groove,Then reach deep in to that orifice and get the bowie:D,if it goes south you still have one ready for her BD.
Stan
 
A friendly piece of advice... don't give in to your fears. Want to try a Bowie, go for the real deal, not something you made several compromises on that you wouldn't be proud to give to a friend.

Making and fitting guards is relatively simple. Don't let that scare you off. Through tangs are challenging, but not as bad as most full tang makers fear. You need to learn how to handle things like hidden tangs and through tangs anyway. Look at each knife as an opportunity to try something you never tried before. Sometimes it works, sometimes not so well. But even if it doesn't work so well, you said it yourself... you have six months to get it right.

So put your fears aside and make this special lady a special knife. You'll be glad you conquered your fears and did it Right.
 
SBuzek said:
First make one in your comfort zone,just to get back in the groove,Then reach deep in to that orifice and get the bowie:D,if it goes south you still have one ready for her BD.
Stan
Click to expand...

From only knowing you and your skills based on this immediate post, my personal opinion is you should have this dialog in front of a mirror;) Having said that, I was 'nudged' NOT to take on 'TOO' much in my first attempt at making knives. Since my personality doesn't do well with that, I let trial and error (and lots of advice from the pros here) be my guide. Plunge in I say! and when you get stuck...ask.

Ed
 
Good to see you here and great to hear you have a knife project lined up.

The house project can be imposing at times.

Post pics of what your working on, Fred
 
Fred.Rowe said:
Good to see you here and great to hear you have a knife project lined up.

The house project can be imposing at times.

Post pics of what your working on, Fred
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Hi Fred! I've come to the conclusion the house project is just going to be a never ending project so all work and no play makes Matt a dull boy.... Time to play a bit

There is a fairly good chance that if I DO undertake the Bowie project off the bat (which is what my personality will probably dictate) there is a pretty good chance I'll do it as a WIP. I've found it to be about the closest thing I can get to having the big guns on this forum looking over my shoulder as I work.
 
Fletch Helical said:
Hi Fred! I've come to the conclusion the house project is just going to be a never ending project so all work and no play makes Matt a dull boy.... Time to play a bit

There is a fairly good chance that if I DO undertake the Bowie project off the bat (which is what my personality will probably dictate) there is a pretty good chance I'll do it as a WIP. I've found it to be about the closest thing I can get to having the big guns on this forum looking over my shoulder as I work.
Click to expand...

Looking forward to it. I've been working on my house for 15 years and came to your conclusion long ago. Enjoy.
 
Make her a Muso-Bowie with a pink handle. Maybe scale the blade down to say 75%
 
Hengelo_77 said:
Make her a Muso-Bowie with a pink handle. Maybe scale the blade down to say 75%
Click to expand...

She hates pink. If I can find a nice blue box elder burl that would be the handle. Like I said I have an idea for the handle and the sheath. I just need to figure out the OAL and width of it and get my hands on some steel that is the correct width to make it happen.
 
I say make a knife style you are comfortable with to get back "in the groove" and then plunge in! A bowie is big enough that if you really screw it up you can still salvage it into a smaller knife.(most of the time:p) For the steel, I say go with 1084, 1095, 5160, or something similar. As for the tang, I think that if you think that you can't do a hidden tang, then you should definitely try to do one. Who knows? You might surprise yourself.
 
Everyone here has offered superb advice. The only thing that I can offer is this:

Build to your vision, if you don't you'll never know what you're truly capable of, nor will you learn anything, and you will never get better.

My .02, make a quickie or 2 to get your mojo back, then break out the bigguns!
 
I think there is some great advice here. I see that you have made knives, but you also have to get a shop together. What tools are you working with?
 
I read this post a few more times. I'm going against the grain here with a few exceptions. There is no easy way out for you. Your hurdles (to me) are that you:

1. Have a perfectionist streak.
2. Want to deliver (in spades) for this lady.
3. Are considering several attributes that you are not entirely comfortable with or need to learn.
4. Need to refine your skill set.
5. Need to set up shop.
6. Are comfortable at a particular level, but for good reasons, desire another.
7. Are concerned with her dream knife today, but you can achieve that at a later date.
8. 6 months goes by fast when trying to achieve the new knife you truly want.

Stan has it right. Make the best knife you can make first. If that knife is the only knife you make her, she will love it. And, if she is as you describe her, she will use it. I feel that the knife you give her is as important to you as it will be to her, and you want it to be good. After that knife is made, all pressure is off, and you can make her dream knife. I just moved into a new house and had to set up a new shop and it has taken months. Time fly's, brother. Get one in the bag and then go for broke. You probably know a whole lot more than me about making knives. But, I have read your words and I think you would prefer to gift her your best work (today) over what could become an insurmountable challenge, considering the deadline and other issues you shared.

I like the mirror analogy. Trust your gut. Read your initial post. I'm a firm believer that people generally know what is right for themselves. This post is not so much about how to do something, but what to do. When you decide how to proceed, does it make you feel anxious or confident? I can't imagine any gift of this nature would be received with anything less than true gratitude and appreciation.

Best of luck, I'm sure with your determination you will achieve success.
 
Hey, Matt, welcome back.

I'm with Erik. Make a simple drop point hunter like your last knife to get your hands and head working together. Then plan out a bowie.

I'm sending you an email.
 
ERIK KNIVES said:
I think there is some great advice here. I see that you have made knives, but you also have to get a shop together. What tools are you working with?
Click to expand...

Erik, my shop is a simple one basically what I have is this:

A HF 4x6 metal cutting bandsaw
Variable speed drill press
Craftsman 2x42 belt grinder with a glass platen
knife vice
Bench grinder
files and sandpaper

It's not so much that I have a ton of stuff to set up. More like I have a ton of crap I need to arrange in my garage to have some space to actually work on a knife.

And with regards to your second post when I think about proceeding I feel confident I can do it (because I'm cocky like that :D) But like anything else a new venture always brings a certain amount of nervousness too. Before I made my first knife I felt confident I could pull it off but I was also concerned about screwing it up. Hopefully that makes some sense. Stacy thanks for the welcome, already feels like I'm able to pick up right where I left off with folks helping out and I responded to your email.
 
Fletch Helical said:
Howdy folks, still lurking around here and still a maker at heart. However in the last year I bought a house and have been dedicating most of my free time to working on it. However the bug to make knives is gnawing at my soul and I think it's about time to get geared up to let some sparks fly. I work with a gal who is an awesome individual and we've become good friends and she's helped me out quite a bit. She's not the type to ask anyone for anything and she is a good soul who could use a little sunshine in her life. As a token of my appreciation I'm going to attempt to make a knife as a birthday present for her which (thankfully) is about 6 months away. So my plan is to get something that resembles a shop set up in my garage the next is making a knife. Now she is more of a "guys gal" and not your typical "froo froo" girl. I know she has an appreciation for knives so in conversation I asked her if she had a favorite type of knife. As it turns out it's a Bowie:eek:. Now bear in mind I don't have a ton of knives under my belt and it's been quite a while since I even ground some steel. The ones I have made have been all full tang and stock removal. So I have a few hurdles here:

1. I know it's possible to make a full tang bowie. I'm not sure if I try and go that route or make matters worse on myself and toss a hidden tang into the fray also.

2. Next is the issue of the guard...Never made one let alone try and fit one. Most of my designs have had a guard built into the blade shape/design itself

3. Steel and size. I know most people shun a stainless Bowie but chances are it's never going to get used for anything other than a display so I was thinking going that route. I'm not opposed to a HC steel but regardless what width stock should I be considering?

4. It's a Bowie

Those appear to be the biggest hurdles I think, aside from the "I haven't made a knife in about 2 years" minor thing. :p

What I DO have going for me is time and patience. I'm in no rush to get this thing done and even for a slacker like me 6 months or so should be enough time to get this thing done and if anyone remembers my you might remember I'm incredibly anal about getting things right even if I have to ditch the power tools and do it all by hand.



Now also in the grand scheme of things I'm sure if I made any knife and gave it to her she'd be ecstatic. My other issue is do I go big on this one (Bowie) or just make something I'm comfortable with. I already have the ideas for the handle and sheath. She originally said she'd like a Bowie with a stag handle, but I asked how she would feel about something like a dyed blue Box Elder or other dyed blue burl as blue is her favorite color. She never even considered that and thought that would be awesome too. (mind you I've never done any stag handles either :D) And I'm planning on doing the sheath with a blue stingray skin inlay in it. If I can pull this project out of any orifice on my body it would be amazing. So what say ye? Push the envelope on this (and if so what's the best way to go about it). Or take the easy way out and stay in my comfort zone.
Click to expand...

I am still making knives, but I had to slow down considerably due to my elbow problems. I have been mainly making Bowie/Fighters when I do make a knife so I can give you a bit of a noob perspective on it.

First off making a full tang Bowie isn't that much different than any other full tang knife, the only thing extra you have to do is the guard and pommel. On the couple full tang ones I have made I just made a Loveless style guard that I pinned to the blade. For the pommel I just keyhole a slot at the end of the tang, pressed a piece of threaded rod into it, and mounted the pommel that way. I kept the pommel from twisting by adding a couple of pins to the backside of the pommel and matching holes in the scales.

Stick tangs aren't that hard to make, but getting that handle hollowed out for the tang can be a pain in the butt, and actually it can be nerve wracking if you start to worry about drilling out the side, top, bottom of you handle block:eek: I have only done that once. Thankfully it wasn't a supper nice piece of wood so it didn't hurt too bad, but it did teach me to slow down and watch what I was doing. Now I tend to do a lot of double checking on my set up, making sure I am drilling to the right place, at the right angle, and depth. I then use my homemade broach to clean out the hole so it fits the tang. For the guard I would drill a series of holes and start slowly filing it to fit the tang. My last guard I was able to mill out on my lathe, and it was much easier and faster. I think it only took about 4 hours including test cuts and setup. The actual slot in the guard only took about 30 minutes with me feeding supper slow, much better than the 3 days of filing I use to take:p

Most of what I learned, I learned from watching Nick Wheeler's WIP threads and the tips I got here from other members. One tip I got from Nick on design is watch the transition from spine to handle and ricasso to handle. they need to be the same line, no dips or rises or it throws the flow of the knife off. Stacy often points that out to others to, so its not just a Nick thing, Nick is just who drove it home for me:o


Dig in and start grinding, filing and sanding. Make two or three at the same time, that way if you screw up one you have a couple more to fall back on:D
 
I'm in the "ease back into it" advice group. ;) :)

Six months sounds like a long time, but if you are talking about a project that has many firsts/unknowns AND you still have to get the shop going, that's not very much time.

The fact you're particular about things does not (IMHO) coincide well with some of this. Like the guard fitting stuff. Fitting a guard is pretty simple in theory. Fitting one WELL in application isn't. Shoot, my very first knife made when I was 12 was a hidden tang with a guard.

I drilled something like a 5/16" hole and then filed a slot to one side of it big enough to allow the 3/16" thick dagger blade to slide in.... Easy peasy lemon squeezy!!! Um... right?

Well sure, it was easy, but it looked like I stuck the knife into an antique door knob keyhole! :eek: :grumpy: LOL

The jist of what I'm saying is, "Everything in knife making is easy. The level of difficulty just depends on your desired outcome." ;)

Best of luck for whichever route you take! :)
 
Well I spent some time this morning getting my shop in somewhat of a shape. It's close and I still need to figure out where I'm going to put the stuff that was in it's way but I should have a workable area very soon. I think I'm going to make a knife before I undertake the Bowie per many folks advice here. I also have about 2 or 3 knives that have been sitting back from HT for quite a while. I can hop on them too so I'll get a bit more practice on the fit and finish part of the game. I mean in the grand scheme of things I'm giving myself a 6 month time frame but in reality I can give it whenever it's done. I was just shooting for a birthday present presentation. If it gets finished a month or 2 later I'm sure it's not going to get shoved back at me :D
 
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