CONTEST -- How many Survival Mistakes did I make?

[dipbait]

I had had a couple of eggs and a lot of coffee that morning.

That there would have done me in. Im hypoglycemic and caffeine screws me up.

If all you had was coffee ,you may have started out dehydrated.

 

[MrCoffee]

The biggest mistake has been mentioned, but I will mention it again. You went out assuming that NOTHING bad would happen. No note, no map of where you were going, no one knew you were gone, and you went out with the very barest of equipment. No plan, none. The way it is written, you the "what if's" never entered your mind.

Ok, most of what I was going to add has been said already. Couple of things... did you bother to check the weather before heading out to be sure there wasnt another storm trailing the one that had hit already? Did you take a map at all?

While you had your PSK, pocket survival kit, IT IS NO replacement for a pack with first aid, blanket, food, water, etc, it was designed to keep you alive long enough to get help IF you lost all your gear, or the gear was destroyed.

Too much caffine... well like I am one to talk about THAT But it will dehydrate you much faster.

No means of communication is huge too. Not even a small pocket radio to at least hear the news/weather.

 

[Rotte]

The way it is written, you the "what if's" never entered your mind.

did you bother to check the weather before heading out to be sure there wasn't another storm trailing the one that had hit already? Did you take a map at all?

No, didn't check the weather. I looked outside and thought it was clearing. The forecast the day before was for clearing weather on the day I went out. I'm pretty sure. It never cleared, it snowed on/off all day. I can't tell if it's snowing now or if it's just the wind blowing snow around.

No map.

Too much caffine... well like I am one to talk about THAT But it will dehydrate you much faster.

I'm glad you brought this up; I wondered if someone would. I have mixed thoughts about this. After a couple cups of coffee, I usually have to pee like the proverbial racehorse. However, it's my understanding that several studies have shown that coffee or caffeine does not cause dehydration--this is apparently one of those old wives tales. This is good news for me and you, unless anyone knows different?

No means of communication is huge too. Not even a small pocket radio to at least hear the news/weather.

I'll disagree with this. Most of the places I really like to go are out of cell phone coverage, and even radio reception can be sketchy (it's a mountain thing). I don't consider this a big deal. Lack of comms may increase the overall risk, but this is completely acceptable in order to get into some actual wilderness. At least for me. Your sense of risk acceptance may deem this imprudent, but I'm not going to count lack of communications as a "mistake" unless there are some strong arguments to the contrary.

BTW--great assessment Mr. Coffee, now time for another cup of joe this morning

 

[Diomedes Industries]

Mental Attitude:

**You did have the will to survive - that is likely what carried the day - but your boyish exuberance could have caused problems. But hell, you only live once!

Preparation:

**Did you check the weather forecast that day? Hour by hour?

**Not telling anyone where you were going.

**Not leaving a map and a time in your house in case people came to look for you. It should have your itinerary on it as well - and contact information.

**Not dressed well. Cotton is a wicking agent. Warmer clothes - and water proofs would have been good. At least water proof gaiters.

**Not sure what is in that Mints tin - but you may have been ill prepared to make fire. A good tinder kit with a double or triple redundant fire making system would have been great.

**I did not see that you brought water. You drank a lot of coffee and this would dehydrate you - water is the main ingredient for this trip.

Kit:

**Map and Compass. You had a basic compass to help you out - but nothing to help you with a good map. A simple 10 dollar Suunto would have gone a long way - and a good USGA grid map. You could supplement this with a good GPS and map system.

**No pack to hold this stuff in.

**No back up clothing. You should have something in your pack that can keep you warm if you need it. A solar blanket, a fleece, something.

**You do not have a vessel to melt water in. Without water with you - nor a means to melt snow - you are left with eating snow - which will lower your core temperature.

**No first aid kit. A small ace bandage would have helped that knee - as well as some ibuprophen.

**No sunscreen, no sunglasses. Getting stuck out there could cause snowblindness.

**No signalling kit, Whistle, mirror, and the like - you did have your cell phone - but was the battery charged? Did you have a back up battery? This is likely a lump if you do not get signal as you mentioned. Did you have any wire to spark the battery for fire?

** Having the flashlight was a good thing - but only when dark for signaling. Again - wire and those batteries would have been nice. Steel wool in your kit?

**No food in your kit. A few energy bars or snickers would have done wonders for energy - especially in the cold.

**No cordage. This would do wonders if stuck.

** Extra batteries for phone and Flashlight.

Misc Mistakes:

***If sweating, you need a wicking layer under a warm layer. Also, slow down. Sweat is a killer.

If Melting snow made you more wet? You need a water proof layer, mentioned above.

TEST the ice before you step.

*** When the weather started to turn - did you go back - or push on? If pushing on, a mistake can be made by over estimating your strength or under estimating the weather.





Boy is easy to play Monday Morning quarterback. Besides the clothing - I would have went out and did the same thing!

TF

 

[koyote]

I was only a few miles from home, and was in somewhat familiar territory so I didn't think I needed a map.

Funny how stuff looks different when covered in snow, eh?

this is a fun idea, though I'm a bit confused about how to make the list.

Did you take ANY navigational tools with you? going without a map in an area you know is fine- as long as you can figure out what direction you are going after the whiteout.


Whistle? mirrors? besides a cell phone, what emergency signalling devices?

Space blanket or 4?

 

[Rotte]

this is a fun idea, though I'm a bit confused about how to make the list.

My bad. All one needs to do to have any entry is make a list of "mistakes", see Talfuchre's post above for a good example.

Did you take ANY navigational tools with you? going without a map in an area you know is fine- as long as you can figure out what direction you are going after the whiteout.

I had my small Marbles compass ad my sometimes fallible sense of direction. If there was moss on the trees it was covered in snow.

Whistle? mirrors? besides a cell phone, what emergency signalling devices?

Space blanket or 4?

 

[Rotte]

Mental Attitude:

**You did have the will to survive - that is likely what carried the day - but your boyish exuberance could have caused problems. But hell, you only live once!

Preparation:

**Did you check the weather forecast that day? Hour by hour?

**Not telling anyone where you were going.

**Not leaving a map and a time in your house in case people came to look for you. It should have your itinerary on it as well - and contact information.

**Not dressed well. Cotton is a wicking agent. Warmer clothes - and water proofs would have been good. At least water proof gaiters.

**Not sure what is in that Mints tin - but you may have been ill prepared to make fire. A good tinder kit with a double or triple redundant fire making system would have been great.

**I did not see that you brought water. You drank a lot of coffee and this would dehydrate you - water is the main ingredient for this trip.

Kit:

**Map and Compass. You had a basic compass to help you out - but nothing to help you with a good map. A simple 10 dollar Suunto would have gone a long way - and a good USGA grid map. You could supplement this with a good GPS and map system.

**No pack to hold this stuff in.

**No back up clothing. You should have something in your pack that can keep you warm if you need it. A solar blanket, a fleece, something.

**You do not have a vessel to melt water in. Without water with you - nor a means to melt snow - you are left with eating snow - which will lower your core temperature.

**No first aid kit. A small ace bandage would have helped that knee - as well as some ibuprophen.

**No sunscreen, no sunglasses. Getting stuck out there could cause snowblindness.

**No signalling kit, Whistle, mirror, and the like - you did have your cell phone - but was the battery charged? Did you have a back up battery? This is likely a lump if you do not get signal as you mentioned. Did you have any wire to spark the battery for fire?

** Having the flashlight was a good thing - but only when dark for signaling. Again - wire and those batteries would have been nice. Steel wool in your kit?

**No food in your kit. A few energy bars or snickers would have done wonders for energy - especially in the cold.

**No cordage. This would do wonders if stuck.

** Extra batteries for phone and Flashlight.

Misc Mistakes:

***If sweating, you need a wicking layer under a warm layer. Also, slow down. Sweat is a killer.

If Melting snow made you more wet? You need a water proof layer, mentioned above.

TEST the ice before you step.

*** When the weather started to turn - did you go back - or push on? If pushing on, a mistake can be made by over estimating your strength or under estimating the weather.





Boy is easy to play Monday Morning quarterback. Besides the clothing - I would have went out and did the same thing!

TF

OK, TF hit every mistake I had on my list. So, unless you guys come up with some mistakes he and I didn't think of, we may have our winner....

I'll go through the list in more detail in a little while

 

[dipbait]

ditto on what Talfucre posted.

 

[Calebklyne]

he only be allowed to win if he makes another pretty sheath for it

 

[koyote]

lack of route planning.

lack of comminucating with someone else your intents

lack of short term shelter

possibly lack of adequate extra clothing. (not sure about this one, really. I'd take and extra pair of socks and mittens.)

lack of heat source

lack of emergency food- like 3 clif bars.

lack of signalling methods.

the presence of a thataway compass is good enough for known territory.

lack of testing environment before proceeding in different areas.

presumed lack of winter first aid kit.

water container? heatable?

 

[TreeChopper]

Any gear in the car? Extra clothes, food, pain killers, water, pet stuff, shovel, etc... everything you forgot to take with? You made it back to the car, what if you couldn't leave and had to stay put?
If this had happened to me and I had gear in the car I think I'd take care of my body (dry clothes, food, water, Pain mgmt) take care of the pooch, and then drive away... if possible. Maybe it's me but being cold and shivery isn't fun. Ya know?... 98.6 degrees and all that... keeping your ass alive ala Lundin.

Thanks for the thread.. very cool. I recently blundered (kayaking) and tho I had no mishaps what I forgot to take was really stupid. PUtting together a permanent kayak kit now!

 

[Rotte]

Mental Attitude:

**You did have the will to survive - that is likely what carried the day - but your boyish exuberance could have caused problems. But hell, you only live once!

>> As others have mentioned, I didn’t think before I went out. This is actually a bit unusual for me, I tend to be a planner. However, the fun of the moment seized me and I just went out. I assumed it would a quick, short trip.

Even when I got wet, cold, and was shivering in my wet cotton clothing I was still having fun. While I was lying in the snow feeling my knee start to stiffen up I recognized that I had gotten myself into a potentially bad situation, but knew I was basically OK and didn’t get panicky. So for mental attitude I think I did OK with the exception of being a basic dumb-ass.



Preparation:

**Did you check the weather forecast that day? Hour by hour?

>> Even though the weather forecast out here is notoriously difficult, it would have been smart to check the forecast before heading out. I assumed the weather was improving. It wasn’t. I hadn’t accounted for the wind picking up and making visibility very low at times. (It’s always windy in Wyoming so you’d think I wold have thought of this. This was the first snow and my first time snowshoeing for 8 months--lessons learnt last season had been forgotten. And I wasn’t thinking.


**Not telling anyone where you were going.

>> Big no-no. If I had broken my leg instead of just spraining it I may have been stranded, off-trail, and not easily seen. The wind caused significant snow drifting and my tracks were being obscured and filled in with snowdrift within a few minutes. If my absence had been noted, rescue personnel could have found my truck easily, but my trail would have been tough to find. Leaving a note could have facilitated my rescue by several hours--perhaps critical in sub-freezing weather.


**Not leaving a map and a time in your house in case people came to look for you. It should have your itinerary on it as well - and contact information.

>> see above


**Not dressed well. Cotton is a wicking agent. Warmer clothes - and water proofs would have been good. At least water proof gaiters.

>> Good call TF! Here I was really kicking myself for being so blithe about my clothing. My quick pace led to sweating and my clothes becoming damp, I broke through some snow and ice and splashed myself with cold water, snow began to stick to my pants. In some places I had ice forming on my pants, in some places my pants were wet (and cold). When I tripped and tumbled down the incline, snow got pushed up into my sweatshirt and down into my pants. My body heat melted the snow and my clothing became even wetter.

In addition, I didn’t take my gaiters--I actually thought about them before I pulled out of the driveway, but in my eagerness to get out to the fresh snow, dismissed the thought! So as I walked along through deep snow, 24” in some spots, snow was pushed up into my pants and down into my boots. As a result, my feet became wet. Wet feet+cold=frostbite and loss of toes. This was perhaps my 2nd biggest mistake.


**Not sure what is in that Mints tin - but you may have been ill prepared to make fire. A good tinder kit with a double or triple redundant fire making system would have been great.

>> Another good call TF. I wasn’t sure what was in the Altoids tin either! I just pulled it off the counter and put it in my pocket. I didn’t check my gear. The actual contents--determined after the fact--were pretty skimpy.

It turns out that this was a kit I was starting to build and haven’t finished stocking. Oooops. That’s what I get for having multiple tins around.


**I did not see that you brought water. You drank a lot of coffee and this would dehydrate you - water is the main ingredient for this trip.

>> Agreed mostly. It’s easy to get dehydrated in Winter. dehydration decreases performance and can increase one’s risk for frostbite. I knew this, but didn’t take water. Very strange for me not to do so. I usually take a canteen and metal cup to procure water. Once again, the rush bit me.

I’m not aware of any studies that show caffeine causes dehydration, so this part I’ll debate. Otherwise, not taking water is a big mistake. When going out in the cold, I usually add a little sugar and salt to my water--this lowers the freezing point so it takes longer for your canteen to turn to a block of ice. Of course that only works if you actually take your canteen.

Kit:


**Map and Compass. You had a basic compass to help you out - but nothing to help you with a good map. A simple 10 dollar Suunto would have gone a long way - and a good USGA grid map. You could supplement this with a good GPS and map system.

>> I have a GPS but never use it, I don’t consider leaving this at home a mistake, but you could argue that in poor weather conditions with low visibility, a GPS is a good idea. Agree that a map would have been a good thing to have. The terrain looked very different covered in snow, but I could have used a topo may with my compass to get oriented more easily.

In re the compass: they are more useful if you use them. I did take an initial azimuth when I left my truck so I knew I was headed roughly WNW. However, until I found myself without an exact position, I didn’t recheck it.


**No pack to hold this stuff in.

>> What stuff?


**No back up clothing. You should have something in your pack that can keep you warm if you need it. A solar blanket, a fleece, something.

>> I missed having dry socks. Should definitely have had dry sock with me. Some foul weather gear would have been smart too. I assumed the weather would hold while I was out and was wrong. It stayed cold and the snow was dry (except where it melted into my cooton clothing), but if it had warmed and rained I wold have become wetter and colder.


**You do not have a vessel to melt water in. Without water with you - nor a means to melt snow - you are left with eating snow - which will lower your core temperature.

>> Dude, I have my Altoids tin. That’s deserves a C+ at least.



**No first aid kit. A small ace bandage would have helped that knee - as well as some ibuprophen.

>> Bandaids in Altoids tin don’t count?


**No sunscreen, no sunglasses. Getting stuck out there could cause snowblindness.

>> This was the first mistake I realized I made. Even though it was overcast, there was tremendous glare. By the end of the trip I had a slight headache from squinting. The glare was bad.


**No signalling kit, Whistle, mirror, and the like - you did have your cell phone - but was the battery charged? Did you have a back up battery? This is likely a lump if you do not get signal as you mentioned. Did you have any wire to spark the battery for fire?

>> No wire. No signal kit. Cell phone useless. I didn’t see anyone else all day, but there were tracks to indicate people had been in the area. If my fall/injury had immobilized me a whistle could have come in handy. If I needed to signal I would have made a fire.


** Having the flashlight was a good thing - but only when dark for signaling. Again - wire and those batteries would have been nice. Steel wool in your kit?

>> No steel wool. Flashlight would likely have been useless: if I had still been out when it became dark I probably wold have become hypothermic. As it was I was shivering, wet, and cold at 12:00 in the afternoon.


**No food in your kit. A few energy bars or snickers would have done wonders for energy - especially in the cold.

>> Not sure about this. For morale purposes, yes, but you don’t really need food for a few days.


**No cordage. This would do wonders if stuck.

>> Agreed. I had a little sewing thread in the Altoids tin, but that was it. Oh--I forgot--I have a paracord bracelet. Probably 8’ of paracord.


** Extra batteries for phone and Flashlight.

>> nice to have, but a mistake? Not sure about that. I’m not one to carry 40# of gear for a day hike.



Misc Mistakes:

** If sweating, you need a wicking layer under a warm layer. Also, slow down. Sweat is a killer.

>> Agreed. After working up a sweat I realized this mistake (for the 100th time in my life) and started to pace myself.


** If Melting snow made you more wet? You need a waterproof layer, mentioned above.

>> Some nylon or Gortex overpants would have been a good idea. Wool or fleece pants likewise.


** TEST the ice before you step.

>> LOL.


*** When the weather started to turn - did you go back - or push on? If pushing on, a mistake can be made by over estimating your strength or under estimating the weather.

>> Being a basic dumb-ass I pushed on. I was having fun, the dog was having fun, what cold go wrong...***CRASH***...”WTF?!?!"..."ouch"....."man, it’s cold today".....***shiver***....

 

[Rotte]

Any gear in the car? Extra clothes, food, pain killers, water, pet stuff, shovel, etc... everything you forgot to take with? You made it back to the car, what if you couldn't leave and had to stay put?
If this had happened to me and I had gear in the car I think I'd take care of my body (dry clothes, food, water, Pain mgmt) take care of the pooch, and then drive away... if possible. Maybe it's me but being cold and shivery isn't fun. Ya know?... 98.6 degrees and all that... keeping your ass alive ala Lundin.

Thanks for the thread.. very cool. I recently blundered (kayaking) and tho I had no mishaps what I forgot to take was really stupid. PUtting together a permanent kayak kit now!

Yes, truck has tons of stuff in it. I could probably live for a month out of the crap in my truck. :thumbup:

 

[Diomedes Industries]

Forgot about the Tin for heating water - but you have to admit - that would be LABORIOUS.

I think if you had a tiny day pack with a few things we are all mentioning - life would be a lot better. A folded Aluminum pan for cooking would do wonders in the snow melting category.

AND - you were right to debate my caffiene argument.

Check out this study:

http://advance.uconn.edu/2002/020722/02072207.htm

I retract my coffee argument. Thanks for questioning me. I just stated what I had heard before!


What are the snow shoes made of?

TF

 

[Rotte]

The snowshoes are MSR Ascents. Made from some sort of plastic. Pretty tough.

Stock photo:

Work well, but for a guy my size they don't provide a lot of flotation. They do make extra "tails" you can add to the shoe for more flotation, but I prefer the smaller size, especially on small twisty mountain trails.

 

[TreeChopper]

put a must-have gear/communications/trip plan checklist on the house door and have a rule that you never ignore it.
Put another one in the truck... if you have all that "crap" in it maybe you could have trekked out with all you needed.
These lists will make you aware of what you have forgotten and if you choose to take the trip anyway, maybe you'll then think about the risks of doing so. Reviewing a list kind of creates an extra pause so you can think twice about whether the risks are worth it.

 

[flnder]

Is the Altoids tin inside lid shiny enough to reflect like a mirror?

 

[flnder]

PS If Talfuchre wins you should make him get a Magnussen knife,haha

 

[Rotte]

Is the Altoids tin inside lid shiny enough to reflect like a mirror?

No, I've heard of people polishing their Altoids tin, but I've never done that. When I have my act together, I do have a nice signal mirror that I carry. But that didn't happen yesterday.

(I don't want TF to order a knife from Magnussen because I'm trying to order a knife from Rick first! (Rick, PM sent!))

 

[Diomedes Industries]

I wouldn't order a knife from Rick - because I already have his custom Bushtool (tm)!!!


I was thinking Rotte, if you could make something from those show shoes... but no metal - no wood.

I reread Rotte's post above. If I win this contest - I think I know who I am going to have you send the money to!

Walt or Andy - they are both GREAT guys - both of which have been hurting in the pocket book lately. It would be great to give them a boost!

TF