Council Tool- carbon content of all axes revealed

The Whiskey River ones were a custom limited run. The one in the latest general Council price list is 40DV36C GSA and is described as "4lbs Dayton Pattern SB Axe; 36" curved handle, Olive Drab NSN# 5110-00-293-2336"

Running a search on the NSN shows that it has very loose requirements.
 
I honestly don't think it would make any meaningful impact on performance unless heat treated harder anyhow. But still, I'm pretty sure those ones are 1060 as a result of them being GSA models. They do have a NFES 1080 Pulaski currently, however.
 
What does that matter if you hit the same RC? While it might be measurable with precision instruments, it's doubtful that you'd be able to tell between the two blind in use. Is there technically a difference? Yes. But is there a practical one? Not so much.
 
Fatigue strength, shear strength and tensile strength are all appreciably better in 1080. It's just a bit better.
 
Those all happen to be at annealed hardness. And again, as I mentioned previously, while you might be able to measure the differences with precision instruments, it unlikely that you could tell blind which one was which based on their performance qualities if both were heat treated to the same hardness. It's simply not a major factor.
 
garry3 said:
That's a great idea. 1080 would hold an edge much better than 1060 at a higher hardness.

I'm guessing Vaughan still uses 1080 and would be a good candidate as well?
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Edge holding of an axe requires somewhat different criteria than a knife.
In a knife, even in a chopping knife, the shock resistance is less of a factor than in an axe.
Unless you use your axe exclusively for making feathersticks, heavy chopping and splitting causes more edge damage than simple abrasion during slicing.
As 42 said, there would be difficult to experience without measurements any major differences between 1060 and 1080 at the same typical axe hardness range when you use your axe as an axe and not as a knife. Presuming heat treatment was done properly and both axes are around the same hardness.
 
At the same time, I'd never begrudge someone the option of buying what they think they want.
We buy things all the time for reasons that aren't empirically performance related.
I'm sure (though I can't prove it) that most knife steels, for instance, are as much user impression as much as they are science.
1080's better on paper, so if that's what Square Peg wants, that's what Square Peg should get.

I'm as guilty as anyone for liking the idea of something, even if there's no practical difference.
 
littleknife said:
Edge holding of an axe requires somewhat different criteria than a knife.
In a knife, even in a chopping knife, the shock resistance is less of a factor than in an axe.
Unless you use your axe exclusively for making feathersticks, heavy chopping and splitting causes more edge damage than simple abrasion during slicing.
As 42 said, there would be difficult to experience without measurements any major differences between 1060 and 1080 at the same typical axe hardness range when you use your axe as an axe and not as a knife. Presuming heat treatment was done properly and both axes are around the same hardness.
Click to expand...
Right on time, 42's burner account.....
 
littleknife said:
Edge holding of an axe requires somewhat different criteria than a knife.
In a knife, even in a chopping knife, the shock resistance is less of a factor than in an axe.
Unless you use your axe exclusively for making feathersticks, heavy chopping and splitting causes more edge damage than simple abrasion during slicing.
As 42 said, there would be difficult to experience without measurements any major differences between 1060 and 1080 at the same typical axe hardness range when you use your axe as an axe and not as a knife. Presuming heat treatment was done properly and both axes are around the same hardness.
Click to expand...

I can tell you one thing that would be noticeable to the manufacturer--the metal would be more reluctant to move under the hammer. But the end user? If the RC was the same--and both steels are capable of achieving a hardness high enough to make file sharpening unpleasant--then it would be imperceptible in use.
 
garry3 said:
Right on time, 42's burner account.....
Click to expand...
I’ll take this as a good natured joke, but only you know if that’s really the case.
I happened to agree with 42 quite frequently, but that doesn’t mean I would accept everything he says as an unquestionable divine proclamation.

In another thread I urged a fellow forum member to listen to what 42 said. I did not asked him to agree with 42, just to listen, because that member dismissed 42 right away without any arguments. Some people don’t like the fact that 42 is younger than many of the well respected authorities here, has strong opinions which he is not shy to share in a polite manner and finally, he has a business, so some think he is saying things just to promote his wares.

I thought about many things 42 said here in this forum and happened to agree with many of his arguments and conclusions or opinions. I would voice my disagreement as well, if and when I have a disagreement.

Finally, we all know that square_peg is highly knowledgeable, experienced and intelligent as well, he is one of the authorities I listen to, learn from and agree with almost always here. I trust he has well argued and supported arguments for his preferences and those choices are not wrong at all, even if it is my opinion that there might be alternatives which could be for all practical purposes be just as satisfactory.

But I admit that my dissent is just my opinion rather than an indisputable fact, and just because I happen to agree about this question with 42, does not make my opinion right. But in the same time it doesn’t make it wrong either. :)
 
garry3 said:
That's a great idea. 1080 would hold an edge much better than 1060 at a higher hardness.

I'm guessing Vaughan still uses 1080 and would be a good candidate as well?
Click to expand...
Vaughan doesn’t make axes in America anymore, only hatchets and hammers. Those are 1080.
 
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