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I want to play around a lil' bit with some CPM-3V. Where do I get it? (couldn't find ordering info on crucible's website...
)
Thanks!
)Thanks!
-
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CPM-3V - where to get it?
- Thread starter Daniel Koster
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As far as I know Crucible is the only place to get 3V.. May not be on the site, but they have it. Give em a call that will take care of it.
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Daniel,
Crucible is the only place to get CPM 3V. I would suggest calling them. I usually call the Dallas TX office as they are closer to me. Their number is 1-800-365-1168, and I usually ask for Bruce. They can give you info on availability and cost. Let us know if you find some. I have been thinking about trying some of this as it sounds like really good stuff.
Tom
Crucible is the only place to get CPM 3V. I would suggest calling them. I usually call the Dallas TX office as they are closer to me. Their number is 1-800-365-1168, and I usually ask for Bruce. They can give you info on availability and cost. Let us know if you find some. I have been thinking about trying some of this as it sounds like really good stuff.
Tom
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Tom - I'll be in your area next week.....want to go in on an order?
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I just got off the phone with Rhonda at Crucible in Texas.
2 x 36 x 0.252 piece is $110.....
Ok, Tom...sounds like a deal. I'll call when I get settled.
2 x 36 x 0.252 piece is $110.....
Ok, Tom...sounds like a deal. I'll call when I get settled.
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Daniel Koster said:I just got off the phone with Rhonda at Crucible in Texas.
2 x 36 x 0.252 piece is $110.....
Ok, Tom...sounds like a deal. I'll call when I get settled.
Wow that is more then I thought that it would cost. I figured that it would be expensive but man. I guess since I am the shop talk shill for S7 steel, I will start to add that it is the poor mans CPM-3V. Here is link to a knife made of CPM-3V and 154CM damascus (pic towards the bottom). The knife is a Hossom and the damascus by Devin Thomas. I can't imagine how much it is per inch. Thanks for the info guys. Mark
edited to add link (I guess that would help):
http://www.knifeforums.com/ubbthrea...=387443&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1
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That's a great link, Mark. Thanks!
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Just an observation. You very likely don't need steel that thick. One of the important advantages of using a very tough steel like 3V is that you can use thinner stock and get the same strength. I'd strongly recommend 3/16" as plenty strong for everything up to sword length. In fact I've made several 3V swords in that thickness.
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Thanks, Jerry. I will definitely start at 3/16".
Has anybody tried the flex test with 3V? Will it bend and not break?
The data sheet says to bring it up to ~1975 and then double temper it at ~950. Can this be solved by just having 2 well-gauged forges to do the HT?
Has anybody tried the flex test with 3V? Will it bend and not break?
The data sheet says to bring it up to ~1975 and then double temper it at ~950. Can this be solved by just having 2 well-gauged forges to do the HT?
Dan, I have gotten the impression that Crucible is not excited about selling to us little guys. I wanted 18 inches of S30V and they quated me 100 bucks. I got 6 foot of it from Terry Summers at Admiral for a lot less than that.
I'll see if I have data on 3V but its designator makes me think it has vanadium (I don't remember the data sheet on it though). If so I wonder about HT'ing it the way you want to.
EDIT: I just went to Crucible and looked at their data sheet. It appears austenitizing at about 1950 F would give a good marriage of wear resistance and toughness. I think I would soak this steel (in blade size) at 1950 - 1960 F for a minimum of 22 min. to up to and including 25 minutes. It is a deep hardening steel and does have enough chromium and vanadium that I doubt the method of HT you are wanting would be good however, I would feel better if Mete would chime in and say what he thinks about it.
RL
I'll see if I have data on 3V but its designator makes me think it has vanadium (I don't remember the data sheet on it though). If so I wonder about HT'ing it the way you want to.
EDIT: I just went to Crucible and looked at their data sheet. It appears austenitizing at about 1950 F would give a good marriage of wear resistance and toughness. I think I would soak this steel (in blade size) at 1950 - 1960 F for a minimum of 22 min. to up to and including 25 minutes. It is a deep hardening steel and does have enough chromium and vanadium that I doubt the method of HT you are wanting would be good however, I would feel better if Mete would chime in and say what he thinks about it.
RL
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I will relate my personal story of 3V again. A couple of years ago, I got some of the first 3V available from a guy who has seemingly vanished off the face of the Earth(Ed Schott). I profiled and flat ground some crude looking Busse Steelheart resembling thing of a knife, and drove over to my friend's house(who has an old Paragon oven). Together(ok, mostly him)we double stainless foil wrapped the blade, preheated the oven to Crucible's specs and followed the specs as best we could. Note, I said as best we could. It seems that 3V needs a pretty fast air quench to get the most out of it. Most people either send it to Paul Bos, or they utilize quench plates. We did neither, and simply took the blade out of the foil pouch as quickly as possible and put it in front of a fan until room temp. Then, the specs call for a triple temper of 2 hours each temper. We only did 2 tempers, as time was running out, and I had a long drive to go.
I took this blade home and tried to do a little finish grinding on it with a fairly new blue ceramic 50 grit belt. I could barely take the blue/black heat treat colors off it! I managed to grind it pretty close to finished thinness, but got frustrated with my inaccurate grinding, and literally threw the blade pointfirst down, really hard, onto my concrete floor in the shop. Took a nice chip out of the concrete, and barely put a gray mark on the tip of the blade. Then, I took the blade outside, and started chopping away on some old cedar 4x4s. The blade sunk into these boards quite deeply, as the blade was thinner ground than any axe, and I had to twist to get the blade out. I was a twisting and pulling and chopping, and all with no damage to the edge or any part of the blade.
Curious, I mailed the blade down to my friend Bailey Bradshaw, who has a Rockwell tester. Bailey said the blade Rockwelled at 62-63!
I asked Bailey to do the final temper, and now the blade is right at 60 Rockwell. Still not finished, but someday.
Now, this impressed the heck out of me. If this blade could survive(no, not only survive, but laugh at me too) all I put it through, then just think what a PROPERLY heat treated 3V blade will do.
I took this blade home and tried to do a little finish grinding on it with a fairly new blue ceramic 50 grit belt. I could barely take the blue/black heat treat colors off it! I managed to grind it pretty close to finished thinness, but got frustrated with my inaccurate grinding, and literally threw the blade pointfirst down, really hard, onto my concrete floor in the shop. Took a nice chip out of the concrete, and barely put a gray mark on the tip of the blade. Then, I took the blade outside, and started chopping away on some old cedar 4x4s. The blade sunk into these boards quite deeply, as the blade was thinner ground than any axe, and I had to twist to get the blade out. I was a twisting and pulling and chopping, and all with no damage to the edge or any part of the blade.
Curious, I mailed the blade down to my friend Bailey Bradshaw, who has a Rockwell tester. Bailey said the blade Rockwelled at 62-63!
I asked Bailey to do the final temper, and now the blade is right at 60 Rockwell. Still not finished, but someday.
Now, this impressed the heck out of me. If this blade could survive(no, not only survive, but laugh at me too) all I put it through, then just think what a PROPERLY heat treated 3V blade will do.
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Roger, this is one of those secondary hardening steels and carefully heat treating to Crucible's specs ( 1950 etc) will give you good results , better than Danbo's !.....Unfortunately Crucible is a big company and like all big companies isn't set up for the little guy. The only solution would be to find a dealer who handled a lot of 3V or make a group purchase if there's enough interest in that.....BTW did you see my comment - Crucible will introduce CPM 154CM ? sounds interesting.
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At the Blade show we talked to Dick Barber and he said the powdered 154-CM didn't come out like they wanted it too, so they would add nitrogen and vanadium so that it would come out right, making it more like CPM BG-42 than 154-CM, making it even more promising.
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Yo Rlinger,,,, METE
I don't know if crucible likes the little guys, But Bruce does. He is a very nice guy that will talk to the little guys (like me) and give them a good deal on the steel. As I said, ordering from Rhonda was more expensive than going thru Bruce.
Heard Bruce is on vacation until Thursday. Wait and speak to him.
I had a blade heat treated by the man himself, (Paul Bose) he does know how to HT this steel. Jerry Hossom also has Paul HT his blades, and you know Hossom knows his stuff.
Cheers
I don't know if crucible likes the little guys, But Bruce does. He is a very nice guy that will talk to the little guys (like me) and give them a good deal on the steel. As I said, ordering from Rhonda was more expensive than going thru Bruce.
Heard Bruce is on vacation until Thursday. Wait and speak to him.
I had a blade heat treated by the man himself, (Paul Bose) he does know how to HT this steel. Jerry Hossom also has Paul HT his blades, and you know Hossom knows his stuff.
Cheers
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Walt,
Paul's minimum is 20 blades or 75.00. You can send less blades but it is still 75.00. You also need to check with him on size because he charges more for blades over a certain length, I can't remember the exact size so check with him. Paul does a really good job. I highly recomend his services.
Tom
Paul's minimum is 20 blades or 75.00. You can send less blades but it is still 75.00. You also need to check with him on size because he charges more for blades over a certain length, I can't remember the exact size so check with him. Paul does a really good job. I highly recomend his services.
Tom
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I could not believe how hard the 3V folder blade that I made was. I wanted to make something my dad (the heating and plumbing guy) could not break as he is notoriously hard on knives. So I built him a a nice 3 1/4" tanto with 5/32 stock. It's been almost a year now and he hasn't managed to do diddly to this knife despite daily gasket scraping and other ridiculously rough work. He says it's the best knife he's ever had and I don't think it's just because I made it. 
The temper is real high on this steel, 950 or so for the two hours, three times. I had to wait until I had a computer controlled oven before I was willing to try to work it.
The temper is real high on this steel, 950 or so for the two hours, three times. I had to wait until I had a computer controlled oven before I was willing to try to work it.