CPM S90V and Sharpmaker.

I tryed 6 and 3 micron Diamond spray - it works!
Results after 6 micron similar to what I have after fine (which is 6 micron also) on different steel. Noticebly better aftre 3 micron, but not much.

I used Spyderco stones this time. After Medium I have results worse that after medium on Sharpmaker rods. But after fine stones results are same, but on rods they were degradating from medium. I suspect that something wrong with sharpening method itself.

Pictures:

Sharpening on stones is new experience for me - I find the way to make it simplier keeping blade horizontal. Everybody who able to eat with spoon aslo able to keep something strictly horizontal. So I put stones on 15 degree stand.

stones-05.jpg


stones-04.jpg


Same sings I use for stroping, but put turn it around on 180.

This is sprays:

stones-06.jpg


I'll try 1 micron.

My compliment to Spayderco - this stones just wonderfull, I hope they'll make something similar with silicon carbides.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
Hi Vassili,

Just to confirm: Spyderco stones or Eze-Lap? Your photos show Eze-Lap.

I was thinking of getting the set of Spyderco stones too. Highly recommended?

Thanks
 
nozh2002 said:
I used Spyderco stones this time. After Medium I have results worse that after medium on Sharpmaker rods. But after fine stones results are same, but on rods they were degradating from medium. I suspect that something wrong with sharpening method itself.
Click to expand...
You can just take the Sharpmaker rods and stick them in the base and use it like a benchstone.

-Cliff
 
Well Eazy Lap just not fine enough - 1200 too corse in comparison to Spyderco Medium. I have stones and they are better in terms of edge controle IMHO then rods.

Med - 15-20 microns
Fine - 6 microns
SuperFine - 3 microns.

Meds are good for sure, I am not sure that Fine and UltraFine is better then leather and diamond spray. I need more experience to say this. For sure they are not able to cut vanadium carbides.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
Ez-Lap have a very rough initial finish, you need to break them in a bit before they cut evenly.

-Cliff
 
so what say you guys about dmt stones i have used them with all my cpm steel knives and have had good luck
i have up to 1200 grit but have never tested just how sharp they get if i can get sharper then im going to have to change my ways
 
Numbers:
Diamond Easy Lap (new stones) 1200

average 166 median 170 standart devation 34

Spyderco Medium stone

a 116 m 110 sd 25

too big standart devation, not expected - probably it was not sharpened right and acurate again I do sharpening longer and more acurate this time

second run
a 133 m 130 sd 15

This is better - standart devation much less then first time

Spyderco Fine (6 micron)

a 132 m 120 sd 25

No difference because Vanadium Carbide hardness 2800 Vikers and Spiderco Ceramic (aluminium oxide) 2400 Vikers

6 micron diamond spray on leather
a 104 m 100 sd 26

Better but probably I did too small sharpening. Try again

second run
a 68 m 70 sd 11

This is almost what I usually have after Fine Spyderco Ceramic. Very good standart devation.

3 micron Diamond Spray
a 65 m 60 sd 13
second run
a 64 m 60 sd 12

Not too much different at all.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
How long are you sharpening with the higher abrasives, are you resetting the edges each time or just continuing on from the previous one? How many sharpness measurements are you taking on the edge?

-Cliff
 
Cliff Stamp said:
How long are you sharpening with the higher abrasives, are you resetting the edges each time or just continuing on from the previous one? How many sharpness measurements are you taking on the edge?

-Cliff
Click to expand...
Continuing. Ten moves each place one side then another then same without any pressure.

I made 10 measurements on 1/4, 1/2 and 3/4 jf the blade - 30 total.

Exact results are here
http://playground.sun.com/~vasya/Testing-Res.html
- at the end of the page.

Comments are in Russian - sorry, but it has enough English to understand.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
You may want to try less measurements on more of the blade to give a more accurate result. There is a problem with continuing on with the same blade because if you damage the edge it can interfer with what follows. If you tear out or round all the carbides then even moving to diamond can give less than optimal results. So you may want to reset the edge with a SiC or diamond abrasive and test the final finish independently - its a lot more work that way though.

-Cliff
 
You mean not to use Medium rods at all?
But how can I come from 1200 Diamond directly to 6 micron diamond. I afraid that this will not work.

I thought 15-20 micron Spyderco will not damage too much blade.

However after I sharpen on 1 micron I have bettere results. I'll pot in in an hour. So it may be wrong 3micron diamonds, not blade.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
nozh2002 said:
You mean not to use Medium rods at all?
Click to expand...
This is more for edge retention / durability issues, but if you go from fine Spyderco which has degraded the edge, to a high grit polishing diamond, it might skew the result. It depends on how the edge was actually effected by the ceramic.

But how can I come from 1200 Diamond directly to 6 micron diamond.
Click to expand...
That really isn't a problem, lots of people only have two stones, coarse and fine, it just takes longer to get the polish that way. You would just do sets of ten honings until the edge stabilized. Once you do it once you know when to stop next time.

If you are just applying a micro bevel it happens really fast, I will jump from 220 grit SiC right to Spyderco medium and the edge is pretty much set in 1-3 passes per side. This is with a 20 degree micro bevel on a 10 degree back bevel usually.

-Cliff
 
Here the raw results after 1 micron diamond:

1/4 50 50 50 60 50 60 50 50 50 50
1/2 60 50 50 50 60 50 50 70 40 40
3/4 40 50 70 30 40 30 50 60 70 50

Anova results:
Number of items= 30
30.0 30.0 40.0 40.0 40.0 40.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 50.0 60.0 60.0 60.0 60.0 60.0 70.0 70.0 70.0

Mean = 51.0
95% confidence interval for Mean: 47.39 thru 54.61
Standard Deviation = 9.95
High = 70.0 Low = 30.0
Median = 50.0
Average Absolute Deviation from Median = 6.33

Thanks, Vassili.
 
Can you see an increase in cutting ability to corrospond to the lower numbers? At what point for example does it have the ability to push straight down into newsprint, cut hair above the skin, cut tissue / toilet paper?

-Cliff
 
It is cutting hair little above 100 - even like 130. It was in my first thread.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
So when you go far below this, what else do you start to achive in terms of cutting ability? What does it do at ~80 that it doesn't at ~100, what does it do at ~60 that it can't do at ~80. Since you are getting blades that are almost three times as sharp as shaving, they should be able to do some impressive cutting.

-Cliff
 
Wow Vassili, you have way too much time on your hands ^0^ Pretty interesting page though (now if someone would just do such extensive reviews of sharpening stones :) ) I see M2 sharpens up very nicely (I like my BM 910HHS in M2). Have you tested any of your Japanese laminated knives yet?

BTW, diamond stones are very aggressive when new. They produce a much finer finish after they have broken in for a while (some impatient people think they are worn out when they finally get broken in because they start cutting more slowly, but my old fine eze-lap produces a nice even surface somewhere between a 1,000 and 2,000 waterstone)
 
2 Cliff Stamp

OK I'll try some tricks like cutting toilet paper. So far I accidently notice that it "shave" my fingerprints - I just try how sharp it is by finger. Juweler store have also even fine diamond sprays - 0.5 micron and more. But it does not seems practical for me. If I will try this - also I need change thread I am using - results like 30 and even 50 is too close to scale sencitivity (10) - this is what I got from Russian forum where I am discussing this right now. I also should round all results to 10 (because of this sencitivity).

2 yuzuha

Same I noticed on new Mediums fro Spyderco - new stones shows like 130 but old rods about 90-100.

About time issue. Well, my job is in general to think a lot - I am programmer. Doing some routine repetitive operatins helps me to relax - it is like meditation but not actually wasting time entierly. Motoric repetitive impulses from hands (or any muscules) set up some rithm - and this stabilases overactive centers in brain, sync them. It is kind of psycologic higiene... It is like sharpening, sanding handle etc...

Thanks, Vassili.
 
nozh2002 said:
About time issue. Well, my job is in general to think a lot - I am programmer. Doing some routine repetitive operatins helps me to relax - it is like meditation but not actually wasting time entierly. Motoric repetitive impulses from hands (or any muscules) set up some rithm - and this stabilases overactive centers in brain, sync them. It is kind of psycologic higiene... It is like sharpening, sanding handle etc...
Click to expand...

Ha ha... programmers are crazy people! Maybe that is why I polish small bits of steel on different stones and look at them under a microscope! This lets me pretend I'm doing something interesting while my mind turns into a vegetable ^0^
 
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