Critique of a couple of profiled blades to be.

[CUTS LIKE A KRIS]

I am just getting back into making after a year and a half off. I'm not accomplished, and it looks like my 4x36" grinder is on last legs, the flex shaft for my dremel broke yesterday, so other than drill press I am using files, hacksaw and elbow grease. I have been asked to make knives for 3 different ladies I know- 2 friends getting married in July and Feb. and a classmates little sister asked for a knife from me for her 17th birthday. I am honored and a little nervous about completing these in a short time (for me) as well as having them as esthetically pleasing as possible. I am hoping that I can get some design tweaks from those with a critical eye so that I can mangle them with the best intentions!

I have shown the design of the larger Damascus wharncliffe to the bride to be, and she liked it. After initial profile I decided the handle was too short in relation to the blade, so added an extra finger groove. I've done single finger grooves before as I do not care for guards, but a bit of extra security is nice. Do the grooves seem equal in proportion? I tend to make grooves a bit less circular on the blade side as in testing I have found a more perpendicular aspect retains the hand better than a perfectly arc shaped cutout, but I still am trying for a semblance of balance and symmetry. Do the lines seem appropriate enough with the rather simple handle shape. I am unsure if 2 or 3 pins would look better on this knife as well (AAA or BB on the drawing). I am planning on having the handle material start at the second finger cutout, so that there is room for my stamps as well as allowing a finer pinch grip, and allowing the blade to be used as a longer blade by utilizing only the second finger cutout. It is Dan Seaver 1095/15n20, about 3/32" thick, 4 3/4" blade, overall just over 9 1/4" long.

The curvier wharncliffe (I love wharncliffes on my users so I am drawn to making them) is for the young lady. I wanted to give her a unique knife, and the curves took over when designing it. I was asked to make a compact everyday style user for her- a country girl not afraid of work and responsible enough that I'm not worried about her misusing it. The feedback I've gotten from ladies at home and at work is very positive- moreso than the cake knife above. I used the butt design from my wife's Spyderco Meerkat to allow for a shorter handle that gives the finger support of the full hand. I don't have ladies hands so I was a bit worried that I was going to supersize the handle, but from my 5 year old daughter to the 40+ year old receptionist at work it seems that the curve works with their hands. It is CPM154, again 3/32" (my favorite thickness for most knives in my collection), just over 2 1/2" blade, and an overall straight line measurement of 6 1/4". I am thinking of using the 3 pin setup as in the drawing- 2 smaller and a larger central mosaic pin.

The cake knife will have a sparkly white acrylic MOP handle chosen by the bride, while the smaller will have pink G10 under a yet to be determined "fancy wood"- possibly curly eucalyptus/Koa/ironwood/lacewood handle- the sister is visiting this weekend to pick it out.

I will be draw filing the bevels for the most part- on shorter blades should I just use a finer file rather than risk deeper gouges and rounding the tips. I am admittedly not the best when it comes to cleaning up blades by hand so do not want to risk messing things up while not having a lot of extra time for my slow endeavors. I will attempt a more convex grind with the Damascus, and a more flat grind on the curvy one, but know that things change as I go due to my inexperience.

Any advice at all on overall design or where I go from here will be appreciated- especially on your opinions of pin placement and number. I will have a couple of blanks of the curvy one, but only a single piece of the Damascus for now. They will be professionally heat treated as well, so I don't mess up that stage!

Thank you for any advice, even if it is to say they look like crap (and I won't blame it on the crappy pictures I take either), I want to learn from the advice given.

Kris



(p.s. posting pictures from a phone on Photobucket is very frustrating, with how the URL pop up is off screen when ever the keyboard pops up! Hmmm, get a crappy "new" computer or crappy "new" grinder first, ah, too many limitations on spending to worry about either!!)

 

[AVigil]

Those look great.

I really like Wharncliffes for my users as well.

You have a lot of work cut out for you.

Good Luck

 

[CUTS LIKE A KRIS]

Thanks for the support AVigil! If anybody else has comments they don't wish to share publicly, feel free to PM me- positive or negative.

Kris

 

[tryppyr]

The smaller one looks like a fish.

I'm always curious about handles that drop below the line of the edge... how does one use the back part of the edge on such a knife?

 

[CUTS LIKE A KRIS]

I can't speak for others, but most of my cutting with knives like the "fish" is done freehand, so I've never noticed a problem cutting close to the hand. With wharncliffes I use the tip more than anything on cutting boards, so the drop of the handle doesn't affect me much. Not a design for dicing veggies, but for straight slicing/paring/strong push cuts on thin things (twigs, rope- things that I usually cut with the part of the blade closest to my hand) I find the curve of the handle helps keep it in hand. I am making 2 of these, so the less nice one will be used by me to get a better feel for the design. I've been manipulating the blanks for the last couple of days and think it should be solid in hand for general farm work, as I did it back in the day.

Hopefully I understand your question properly, and thanks for making me think about the use of the blade from your perspective- what kind of tasks do you see as being difficult with the design?

 

[james terrio]

The cake knife seems awfully straight, but maybe that's just me. I like the smaller one a lot.

I will be draw filing the bevels for the most part- on shorter blades should I just use a finer file rather than risk deeper gouges and rounding the tips.

That will work, or just stop before the bevel is completely filed, and switch to a finer file, then your usual progression of sandpaper. The tip could be tricky; on the next one leave a little extra around/above the tip, grind the bevel, the go back and bring the profile into final shape. This helps avoid rounding it over. Look at some of jonnymac's WIPs, he uses that trick quite a bit.

 

[Nixelplix]

I see you have a Sears there in Edmonton. I use a 2x42 inch Craftsman belt sander. It was only $140, and has been working great for years. You might consider it as an inexpensive replacement for your dying grinder.

I like the profiles of both of the knives. The curved aspect on the smaller one is just great! The cake knife is cool, too- it is alot like a design I've used before too. The finger grooves look perfect. I would add a bolster at the first finger groove similar to the one I added on mine:

 

[Carl_First_Timer]

I like them both. Post pictures of your progress when you can.

 

[1066vik]

For me, the finger notch on the cake knife throws off the visual proportions of the handle - but that could change once the scales are on.
the smaller carry knife has enough curve on it for my mind to say "kerambit" - even though it obviously is not one.
my personal preference would be for it to have a less pronounced curve in the handle - maybe a bit less pronounced "bottom fin"?

I also put in a positive vote for the craftsman 2x42 as a low cost belt grinder.

 

[CUTS LIKE A KRIS]

Thanks for the opinions. I meant to leave more meat at the tip, but taking out some groove marks from the steel it was profiled from I got abut over zealous. I plan on leaving more on the second blank, and almost have it cut out, but took ladt night off. The positive of a wharncliffe is that I can always shorten the blade a bit if I need to as the design isn't one that has to be exact to specifications. I'm not really a fan of bolsters on knives, but will think of adding to it. The bottom fin will be softened yet as it digs into my wife's hand, so I'm not too sure about how much it will change. I wasn't sure how the curve would turn out, perhaps I'll straighten it more on the second. As for how straight the cake knife is, kind of a limitation of the Damascus I had in stock. I had planned on a bit different design, but life happened and the billet I wanted to buy has to be put on the back burner so I modified the design for my limitations. I was worried about its linear shape, as most of my designs are fairly curvy, but took it as a challenge to try and make a shorter straighter design work.

I probably will get the 1x42" (a 2x72" is a pipe dream for now) down the line, the 4x36 was a sale at Canadian Tire for $100 when I had my first knife ordered- it was all I could afford at the time and I thought the extra width of the belt would hog material off better- ive since learned better, although it has served well for making a dozen knives and modifying others, but definately has been interesting to use. It's the first grinder I ever put steel too, and I have learned a lot from the belt and the disk.

I hope that I can make them look like somewhat quality pieces and will update as I do more work. Thanks

 

[james terrio]

The positive of a wharncliffe is that I can always shorten the blade a bit if I need to as the design isn't one that has to be exact to specifications.

That will work too. You might be surprised how many blades of various styles end up 1/16" or 1/8" shorter than they were originally intended

 

[CUTS LIKE A KRIS]

So the birthday knife went out yesterday. There were delays in getting it back from heat treat (left on the doorstep of our old house by the postal worker and not forwarded to our new address like we paid for), and my friend had to pick It up last night rather than tonight so it had a bit less refinement in the edge than I wanted, and I didn't get the leather sheath compleated, but I'm happy with how it turned out overall. It cuts words out of one side of newsprint, shaves hair and cut a paper towel tube in half with one swing- my usual determinants of edge quality. I whittled with it and found the handle fairly comfortable although too small for my liking, but designed for a young lady I don't expect it to fit me well.

I don't have the measurements, but it was about 2.5-3" blade oal~6.5"
Acid etched 3/32" CPM154 Rc60 by Knifemaker.ca- pattern from paper towel and FeCl
Pink G10 under stabilized black palm from BurlSource- finished to 600 grit with hand buffed renwax finish coat
Wood grain kydex from a sample box from kleerdex
Pink twine I twisted into a rope.

I would have liked to thin the edge a bit more and take it to a 1000 grit handle, but time constraints did not allow that, the handle I would have extended further to the handle next time (it chipped out on me at the choil so I had to shorten it, not enough time to redo the handle) to make the pins more even.

Let me know honest opinions please, I have scribed out another because I like the pattern and would like to make another down the line!

Here are the last 2 I finished up while waiting for the return of this one from heat treat- the smaller etched one is rawhide and caribou on 3/32" 440C (one of the first blades I ever profiled, just put aside for a few years), the CanukMuk is micarta and caribou on 1/8" O1- was supposed to be for WSS bushcraft knife challenge before I took a hiatus for 2 years.

Again, any input is appreciated.

 

[1066vik]

the pink knife came out looking good -- and I like the canukmuk, although it might be a better slicer if you raise the shoulders on your grind so the convex isn't quite so steep.

 

[CUTS LIKE A KRIS]

Thanks! The CanukMuk is still a work in progress as far as edge goes. I finish edges by hand after ht because my 4x36 runs way too fast and I don't want to ruin the HT. I'm working on it slowly, testing the edge as I go to find my sweet spot. It is for me so i can take it slow and not worry about deadlines. Thanks for the comment!

 

[CUTS LIKE A KRIS]

To finalize the thread, I finished the wedding knife last week and it was used at the wedding this weekend. It was very well received, and it seems there were a couple of knife educated people there, as I discussed manufacturing process of the Damascus, the difference in stainless and non-stainless steel, and finishing techniques.

Room for improvement obviously, but I am happy with how the knife and stand both came out. The stand is caribou antler and the inner core of a musk ox horn (both collected from the arctic town that my wife and the bride are from), on a Tru Oil finished piece of Walnut. It was my first time using the horn, walnut and Tru-oil, but I liked how each of the three worked and plan on using them more!

(the best I could do to give honor to the materials I used).

Unfortunately there was an incident at the cake cutting!

The groom went to put it away on the stand, and the bride reached across the path. Stopped bleeding after a bit, but they were holding hands for a while, as he tried to add compression to the wound!!


I am very glad to have an outlet for creativity again! Any comments and especially critiques are appreciated. I have more descriptions and pics available if wanted, but thought being brief for now is better.

Thanks for looking!
Kris

 

[AVigil]

Nice.

But that has to be some kind of OMEN

 

[Bailey Knives]

What is it with wedding knives? I made one for one of my friends that was getting married, and her new husband opened up a nice wound on his finger that probably should have required stitches, but he refused to leave the reception to spend time in the ER.

 

[12345678910]

I don't think a wedding cake knife would have to be sharp - more thin wide and spatula like

 

[Bailey Knives]

True, Count, but the husband of my friend likes to cook, and I thought that after the wedding, he could use the knife in the kitchen. Hence, it was razor sharp.
(just ask his finger)

 

[CUTS LIKE A KRIS]

True, Count, but the husband of my friend likes to cook, and I thought that after the wedding, he could use the knife in the kitchen. Hence, it was razor sharp.
(just ask his finger)

That has always been my thought as well, I want the ones I make to be used, so I can get feedback. I hope that they are not just put away after that night. Plus pretty much every wedding has a fancy spatula anyways, some leeway can be made in design.

My groomsman did this at my wedding, with another groomsman's knife (small knife on the far left)

If a knife bites me it seems more mine . I guess the bride owns it more now- although she is the only chick I know brave enough to grab a chopper and try to cut 1" manilla- she got through in 2 swipes, while a jujitsu black belt couldn't and blamed the knife!