CS Master Hunter vs. Rat-3......?

C

carpediem

Joined
Dec 11, 2000
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Looking for an all around outdoor knife, camp, skinning, food prep, etc. M.H. in carbon-V or Aus-8, just wanted to know some facts on both and which one might be better.

Your information is appreciated.

Tom
 
carpediem said:
Looking for an all around outdoor knife, camp, skinning, food prep, etc. M.H. in carbon-V or Aus-8, just wanted to know some facts on both and which one might be better.

Your information is appreciated.

Tom
Click to expand...

RAT-3 would be my choice, wouldn't even be close.

It has:

Better steel
Full Tang
Micarta scales (as opposed to Kraton)
TexLok sheath

The 10-15 dollars more for the RAT-3 is worth it for the D2 and full tang construction.
 
I'd disagree. The CS product has better QC than the Ontario in my experience (a buddy & I both have the MH in C5 & another boddy has the RAT). And other than corrosion protection, I disagree about D2 being a "better" steel either. Maybe better than the AUS8 but not better than Carbon V.
 
Better is a dangerously non-commital word, too. D2 will hold an edge better than Carbon V in slicing use, especially on hard and abrasive materials (great amounts of heavy tape, cardboard, rope, plastic, woodcarving...). When people hear this, however, I think they automatically relegate the "lesser" steel to being totally unfit for those jobs, which is simply not true. Carbon V will hold its edge quite well through such uses. It is also robust when the work becomes harder, involving scraping, twisting, chopping, and other general 'utility' chores which can bring out D2's more brittle nature--which would mean that Carbon V is, in that sense, better.

I have not handled a RAT-3 yet, though I intend to. I will say, however, that the Master Hunter has one of the most efficient blade shapes and edge geometries I've ever seen on a production knife, particularly on one so inexpensive. Thick at the spine to provide great strength, and tapering to a VERY thin edge that just sails through cutting mediums.

I'm not really an advocate of Cold Steel--I've had several products from them over the years (though it's been awhile) and have had mixed results. But I think the Master Hunter is one of the best production hunter/utility knives ever put out.
 
The Confederate may be right about D2; I've heard great things about it's slicing ability. I don't own any D2 (sad - I need to fix that!) so I can't judge.

I do, however, own a CS Master Hunter and an SRK, both in Carbon V, and the steel has proven very tough (I do things with my SRK that I really shouldn't :D ). Without question, the MH has been my favorite for dressing game through the years, and I own many suitable knives. It holds it's edge well, and as t1mpani said, the design is unbeatable; it just feels right. It will rust, but minor care prevents this (it's available in stainless, too).
 
What is Carbon V?

It's my understanding that the actual steel changes to whatever CS can get cheapest at the time and then they call them all Carbon V which is their internal house name used for knives that Camillus makes for them.

If that's the case, then how can they make any claims to consistent performance if the actual steel used changes?
 
carpediem said:
Looking for an all around outdoor knife, camp, skinning, food prep, etc. M.H. in carbon-V or Aus-8, just wanted to know some facts on both and which one might be better.

Your information is appreciated.

Tom
Click to expand...
I bought a CS Master Hunter in Carbon V a number of years ago, and used it primarily in deer season. It has nice size, balance and grip (especially with wet hands). It holds an edge as well as most. Pretty good bang for the buck for a production knife.
I also have a Dozier K1 that I've carried the last couple of years. I like the thinner blade of the Dozier, the D2 steel, and the Dozier sheath. The Dozier is hard to beat in the woods, and around camp. Pretty good bang for the buck for a custom knife.
Good luck with your search.
Jim
 
I believe it has been a few different steels, just as "Surgical Stainless Steel" has had more than one definition.

Right now, I believe the prevailing opinion is it's the same 0170-6 used in Camillus' Becker Line. I find this quite plausible, as it greatly simplifies things for Camillus not having to have several different types of steel that have to be stored and kept seperate, and all with different heat treatments. I lend furthur credence to this simply because it "acts like" the Beckers on my water stones. This last is definitely subjective and unscientific, but since I don't really have a bias I tend to believe the impression.

Some others contend that it is still either O1 or 1095. If it is, then their behaviors will be very similar to 0170-6 in comparison to D2. All lose a bit of abrasion and deformation resistance, while gaining some ruggedness and flexibility. Whichever of the three it might be, assuming equal quality heat treatments, the realistic performance differences will be quite small and difficult to notice in normal knife use. And I say that as a person absolutely in love with O1--lest anyone think that I'm one of those unwashed heathens not obsessed with steel types. ;)
 
The RAT-3 is just too short for all around utility work. The blade is only 3.3 inches. If you aren't cleaning game you might as well get a folding knfe if you want a blade that short. Even if you are cleaning game a 3.3 inch blade is around the length for a caping knife. I would pick around a 4" blade for a hunting knife and more like 5" blade for general utility. The 4.5" blade of the Master Hunter is a great choice to cover most bases. The handle is great when your hands get slippery and the blade shape and grind is highly utilitarian.
 
The Master Hunter is a classic IMHO; tough to do better (althoug the sheath from CS stucks). The Kydex grip is superb under challenging conditions, when it's cold, wet, slippery, covered with blood and fat, etc. Carbon V is one of the best high carbon steels around (the boys at Camillus know their heat treat, as Ethan Becker observed); the only one I would rate higher is 52100, which is very similar; it has a tad more chrome, while Carbon V has a pinch of vanadium and a little less chrome. Given equal heat treat, they'd be hard to tell apart.

AUS8 is also an excellent cutlery steel. I've read good things here about the MH in AUS8, and I like it in my Voyagers.
 
I have a MH in AUS8, and I like it a lot. not to hard to sharpen and holds a good edge, for the price I think it is a good buy.
 
I own both the CS Master Hunter(carbonV) and the RAT-3 in D2. I am currently doin testing on the rat-3 as far as game cleaning and all around use. In my opinion from using and doin my own tests on both I find the Master hunter to be better for all around camp chores and the like, I like the RAT-3 for skinning bar none, better than the hunter, used it on a deer and did a slick job. But due to its small size its better for just that skinning, it chops about as well asyou can expect a small knife too. It slices exceptionally well, it gave me 4 stiches . The Master hunter though I find to be a better choice for camp work and it is a bit thicker, with the narrow tip on the Rat its not that you cant do alot of diggin and pryin just the Master hunter would be better. I found that the RAT sharpened up very easily as does the MH. RAT has that coating which imho doesnt hold up that well, jabbed it into a tree and coating started to come off, but no rust so far. I dont care for the MH handles that much but I do like the RAT's handles. For all that you listed you might be better suited for the larger knife or Ontario Randall has a TAK-1 which is over 4 inches an diff blade design. Like already stated if you want more of a camp knife go 5 inches you can still gut a deer with it, it is more suiteable for all around chores.If at all possible hold both, you may get turned off by handle shape, handle material, the steel for what you described in both should be very adequate.
 
I bought a Master Hunter a long time ago and have been satisfied with it .
Strong, good blade shape and size for most things, the handle is comfortable and holds when wet.
It is a usable medium size knife.
 
I like the Blackjack Grunt as an all around knife better than either one actually. In spite of the AUS8 steel. Now if they made it in D2 or 0170-6 you would have very nearly the perfect knife IMO...
 
Can't comment on the R3. Looks pretty nice though. As for the MH, well I have had the same one since a year after they first were introduced. The blade steel on this one I belive is 01, at least that is what I was told originally. In a few words, the BEST hunting knife I have ever owned. The blade is deeply stained with everything from blood to vegetable and fruit juice. The blade is loosing it's original cantle from repeated use/sharpening but it has been used and used heavily. This particular year prod. has a really pronouned distal taper to the spine and the original leather type of sheath. I have said it before if they put G10 grips on it they wouldn't be able to keep them instock. It is a classic design and lives up to its hype as a very fine hunting knife. I don't know about the AUS8 knives but am sold on the carbon V steel at least for my particual knife any how. Takes and holds a great edge for a long time. keepem sharp
 
The rat3 is grip specific and not nearly as versatile. The MH is a better all-purpose knife where the Rat3 is IMO, a back-up knife. I got the Rat3 in the mail and returned it the next day.

Have you looked at the Marbles Woodcraft? I recently discovered it and love it! The sheath is weired but the knife is awsome. Soon as I held it I fell in love and the blade is convex ground and scary f'n sharp. All round a great knife. http://www.knivesplus.com/marbles-knife-woodcraft-mr-80202.html

Collecter
 
Another good knife company verging on custom quality is Bark River. I am impressed with their knives.

However, out of the two mentioned, I would go with the CS as I have always liked it's feel, great general use knife.
 
You said something about aus8a. I have a cs xl voyager that dulls quicker than my bucks. Heck i've got a Gerber ez out on clearence for $15.00 that holds an edge better. Aus8a may be tough stuff, but It would not be my first choice for skinning by a long shot.
 
Thanks to all for your comments. A deal came my way on an AG Russell Deer hunter.

Thanks again,

Tom
 
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