Curious about powder steels?

jay2pointoh

jay2pointoh

Joined
Feb 25, 2009
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This is just one of a few manufacturers out there that develop powdered steel. If you were curious about them. Bohler steels are used in some of the knives being produced today like M390 and Elmax. They also produce conventional steels as well. Also their website has some info http://www.bucorp.com/index.htm Enjoy!

[video=youtube;0YZRquCR1TA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YZRquCR1TA[/video]
 
I've got an eye out for their steels, but it seems like their PM steels are rarely used(Kershaw uses most of their Elmax while Benchmade uses M390 in a few limited run models). I believe the Vanax series have supply issues along with high pricing. For M390 I think the reason most commonly stated to me for their lack of use is that makers don't have a furnace that burns hot enough to reach the austinizing temperature of 2100 deg F.

Still, some of their high alloy non-stainless steels seem to be worthy of attention. K294 seems a bit like CPM-10V, and Vanadis 60 seems like it could give CPM Rex 121 a run for its money. It would certainly be interesting to see how those steels perform with the improved toughness and grain refinement. It would be like S90V with the toughness of S35VN:thumbup:. I for one would like to see their equivalent of S90V or S110V(or even S125V).
 
Noctis3880 said:
I've got an eye out for their steels, but it seems like their PM steels are rarely used(Kershaw uses most of their Elmax while Benchmade uses M390 in a few limited run models). I believe the Vanax series have supply issues along with high pricing. For M390 I think the reason most commonly stated to me for their lack of use is that makers don't have a furnace that burns hot enough to reach the austinizing temperature of 2100 deg F.

Still, some of their high alloy non-stainless steels seem to be worthy of attention. K294 seems a bit like CPM-10V, and Vanadis 60 seems like it could give CPM Rex 121 a run for its money. It would certainly be interesting to see how those steels perform with the improved toughness and grain refinement. It would be like S90V with the toughness of S35VN:thumbup:. I for one would like to see their equivalent of S90V or S110V(or even S125V).
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M390 needs a HT that has an accurate vacuum furnace that will hold 2150 degrees and has a min of a 4 bar quench and M390 must be Sub Zero quenched to reach high hardness 61-62+.

Little difficult in a production HT.

That's why we see production blades in the 59-60 HRC range.

Here is a Phil Wilson Custom in M390 @ 62 HRC.

Made 460 slicing cuts on 5/8" Manila rope, then went straight to cardboard without touching the edge and it would still slice paper clean after.

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Would M390 @61/62RC be on a similar level with CTS-20CP and CPM-S90V (both @59-60RC)? That would be an awesome testing comparison to do
 
RevDevil said:
Would M390 @61/62RC be on a similar level with CTS-20CP and CPM-S90V (both @59-60RC)? That would be an awesome testing comparison to do
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From my testing M390 at 62 will beat S90V or CTS 20CP at 60 HRC easy, but I doubt we will ever see a production knife in M390 at 61+ anytime soon.

Take CTS 20CP or S90V and make 400 slicing cuts on 5/8" manila rope then cut some cardboard and see what happens.

Test the edge after the rope and then after cardboard, without sharpening after either.
 
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I already knew that stuff ! Somewhere on the Buhler website are photos of the structure of the first and third generation product .Much improved and the carbides are much smaller now. That's because metallurgists are nice guys !!
 
mete said:
I already knew that stuff ! Somewhere on the Buhler website are photos of the structure of the first and third generation product .Much improved and the carbides are much smaller now. That's because metallurgists are nice guys !!
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They really know their stuff too from what I hear. :D
 
Ankerson said:
M390 needs a HT that has an accurate vacuum furnace that will hold 2150 degrees and has a min of a 4 bar quench and M390 must be Sub Zero quenched to reach high hardness 61-62+.

Little difficult in a production HT.

That's why we see production blades in the 59-60 HRC range.

Here is a Phil Wilson Custom in M390 @ 62 HRC.

Made 460 slicing cuts on 5/8" Manila rope, then went straight to cardboard without touching the edge and it would still slice paper clean after.
Click to expand...
Very juicy, I'm expecting my own in orange G10:thumbup:. Though it seems like that level of edge holding is so far beyond conventional steels that one can't fully appreciate it without doing what you're doing. I for one just use my knives for mundane tasks like food processing. Probably won't notice a thing until I go a year without sharpening:D.
 
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