Curious to what others think about disassembling your knives

It's to dissuade people who don't know what they are doing and will screw things up. And because your dealing with a sharp object and it can be dangerous, my Ka-Bar Dozier for example if you take it apart a certain way the blade will spring out with a bit of speed.
 
Topcatpt said:
I do see this point but if you want to retain your customers you have to deal with it. Yes not everybody is mechanically inclined but taking a knife apart isn't rocket science. And as far as taking away from production I'd rather wait for a good knife from a company with a good warranty than get something right away from one without. And as for those little screws I guarantee even the pros strip them out. T6 torx it's bound to happen. But if you say you can fully clean a knife out without taking it apart I don't believe it. And I do only take it apart if it really needs it which is not every other day usually months apart. But if I drop 600 dollars on a hard use knife I don't think I should hear don't take it apart.
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Nonsense. For every person that takes down their knives, there are at least a dozen that don't. Your making the assumption that everyone might be like you, and can take apart a knife and get it back together. The folks that put together your knife more than likely don't use homeowner grade tools, instead they use Wiha Torx drives, and have specific torque settings on some of their drives. I'm positive they make mistakes, but they also have spares and don't need to call and explain stuff away to someone or email. This is what sets them apart from the shade tree disassembler/cleaner. To each their own, as I said. Just answering the question being asked.
 
I used to completely take down my knives about every 3-4 months and clean them, but I've found that that is largely unnecessary. My Umnumzaan is going on a year and a half without being taken apart, and it is still very smooth and pretty much dirt free.

I've had more practice on BM Axis-locks than any other type of knife. It has sort of been necessary, as I've had to replace the omega springs a few times. After a few years of carrying, I think it would be very hard for BM to tell that you had disassembled your knife:

Cynic2701 said:
Here's a picture of my BM 943 that I carried exclusively for about three years. The screws are supposed to be black, but they started turning silver after the second year:

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Just wanted to mention my Manix 2's warranty was voided by Spyderco because I disassembled it.
That's my first time having warranty voided for disassembling a knife.
That's it, nothing else that was enough.

Personally I've yet to see a knife that was difficult to disassemble. It's pretty darn simple even the "harder locks", Axis lock, caged ball, arc lock, automatic, assist opening, and others.

RevDevil said:
Nonsense. For every person that takes down their knives, there are at least a dozen that don't. Your making the assumption that everyone might be like you, and can take apart a knife and get it back together. The folks that put together your knife more than likely don't use homeowner grade tools, instead they use Wiha Torx drives, and have specific torque settings on some of their drives. I'm positive they make mistakes, but they also have spares and don't need to call and explain stuff away to someone or email. This is what sets them apart from the shade tree disassembler/cleaner. To each their own, as I said. Just answering the question being asked.
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I've spent a lot on screw drivers. Currently I have Wiha simply because I found little difference in other makers. From expensive to cheapies. I can assure you anyone worth a brain can utilize a cheap tool as well as Wiha with no real difference. The $7 home depot torx screws work just as well as my Wiha, I think I got a set of Elkind USA made torx bits somewhere in the office (lost after a move).

To be perfectly honest, I highly doubt a knife factory worker has the same experience as me disassembling and reassembling things. If you want tough, try a watch movement. But don't come in telling us how a knife requires skilled hands to assemble. Sorry but no, it's very very easy.
 
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It is also a legal issue. What if someone takes apart a knife and doesn't get it back together right and it fails and cuts a finger off. In our world that person will be suing the company. Even worse. What if they sell it to someone and that happens and they have no idea it was taken apart.

Some knives, like a lot of back locks, can be taken apart and put back together incorrectly where they are dangerous. This is true with Spyderco where there are plastic tabs that have to go in holes and it isn't easy to know if it was done correctly. Until it fails.

Plus I bet I can clean a knife just as good as someone that takes it apart. The only thing that can't be cleaned easily is rust and oxidation. But with running hot water, soap, q tips, toothpicks, and compressed air I can make a knife look like new inside. I have even pulled the blade out after to verify things are clean. I just don't see the need to pull them apart. I like to tinker with things and will take a knife apart sometimes, but it doesn't have to be done everytime it is cleaned.
 
If the knife is reassembled well, they won't be able to tell you were there.

OTOH, I have talked to a LOT of people that think they know how to skillfully reassemble a knife that, in fact, do not.

You cannot possibly know all that you do not know, but it is easy to think you know all you need to know;)

Just because a knife goes back together and functions does NOT mean it was rebuilt to the standards it was originally built. Some guys are capable of better, and some guys just think they are. Ego can be dangerous.
 
Luis G. said:
Just wanted to mention my Manix 2's warranty was voided by Spyderco because I disassembled it.
That's my first time having warranty voided for disassembling a knife.
That's it, nothing else that was enough.

Personally I've yet to see a knife that was difficult to disassemble. It's pretty darn simple even the "harder locks", Axis lock, caged ball, arc lock, automatic, assist opening, and others.
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I like Spyderco knives and have more of them than any other company. But their warranty isn't the best. I have mentioned multiple times that a warranty will be voided from just taking apart the knife. It's happened to me and others but if telling people that in the Spyderco forum, people don't believe you or even resort to name calling.

I can like something yet be open to problems. Only true fanboys will over look problems and convince themselves they have a perfect product.
 
FlaMtnBkr said:
I can like something yet be open to problems. Only true fanboys will over look problems and convince themselves they have a perfect product.
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Well said. I have no problems calling a spade for a spade when I see it. Whether or not I like the knife or not.
 
Quick story, My friend bought a Sog Spec Elite I here on the exchange.This is the Sog Arc lock model and the lock is very similar to the AXIS lock. It was described as LNIB. Once he received it he noticed it had vertical play. Not terrible but enough to bother him. He decided to send it in to Sog for repair. They called him to tell him his knife had been taken apart and the locking bar reinstalled backwards.

That's what was causing the play. He explained that he was the second owner and they waived the $25 fee for repair. Ok, the point being how many here, including myself would have even known that you could install the locking bar backwards? or that it would make a difference?

I think that's just one of many reasons why that unless you know what you are doing it's best not to disassemble your knife. Especially if you are only doing so to clean it. I've yet to not be able to thoroughly clean any knife with just soap and water and a can of WD-40 spray w/ the straw applicator.

Also, because of my previous job involving firearms I can't tell you how many time someone came to me with a "bag "O" Parts" because they decided to take apart their firearm beyond field stripping and couldn't get it back together. I'd add these were mostly fellow gun enthusiasts who are familiar with firearms.

So I'll say again, unless you know what your doing, have the right tools, a supply of extra screws, spring's, washers and other miscellaneous replacement parts your best bet is not to disassemble your knife unless you really have to. Especially if it's just to clean it.

Just my humble opinion..
 
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Curious to what others think about disassembling your knives
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Never done it to any knife I've ever owned. Never seen the need to do so.

It wasn't broke, so I didn't try to fix it.
 
unit said:
If the knife is reassembled well, they won't be able to tell you were there.

OTOH, I have talked to a LOT of people that think they know how to skillfully reassemble a knife that, in fact, do not.

You cannot possibly know all that you do not know, but it is easy to think you know all you need to know;)

Just because a knife goes back together and functions does NOT mean it was rebuilt to the standards it was originally built. Some guys are capable of better, and some guys just think they are. Ego can be dangerous.
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You sparked my curiosity it sounds like you have experience dealing with people who thought they put a knife back correctly but didn't. What kind of things did they do? I know with majority of my knives I have worked with they will only go back 1 way, but they were all frame lock, liner lock, and lockbacks. I can't even think of how to assemble it incorrectly unless I throw all the washers on one side.
 
It's not a rocket engine, it's a knife! A few screws and a couple washers. I don't see the problem.
 
Luis G. said:
Just wanted to mention my Manix 2's warranty was voided by Spyderco because I disassembled it.
That's my first time having warranty voided for disassembling a knife.
That's it, nothing else that was enough.

Personally I've yet to see a knife that was difficult to disassemble. It's pretty darn simple even the "harder locks", Axis lock, caged ball, arc lock, automatic, assist opening, and others.



I've spent a lot on screw drivers. Currently I have Wiha simply because I found little difference in other makers. From expensive to cheapies. I can assure you anyone worth a brain can utilize a cheap tool as well as Wiha with no real difference. The $7 home depot torx screws work just as well as my Wiha, I think I got a set of Elkind USA made torx bits somewhere in the office (lost after a move).

To be perfectly honest, I highly doubt a knife factory worker has the same experience as me disassembling and reassembling things. If you want tough, try a watch movement. But don't come in telling us how a knife requires skilled hands to assemble. Sorry but no, it's very very easy.
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you are giving the average person way too much credit, man. You probably also think there's no way anyone would ever put open ended lugnuts on their car backwards, or the WHOLE SPARE WHEEL/TIRE on in reverse, etc... etc... but if you work in the real world, dealing with the average person you come across situations like this every day. Believe it or not, but it is extremely common for someone to use the wrong size torx, worn out drivers, or way overtighten a screw causing stripped head or threads. Not to mention lost screws/washers. Common sense and a tiny bit of technical know how are becoming more and more rare.

I really can't fault a company for taking a stance against disassembly, especially because disassembly is completely unnecessary in 99% of the cases, and the vast majority of knife users never take apart a knife just for cleaning/maintenance. It's like taking the head off of your engine block to change the oil. Yeah, it's kind of crappy that people like you who do know what they are doing face a penalty for taking apart a knife, but if they are discouraging this process in the first place, then playing making an exception for you only encourages more people to do it.

If people want to be OCD and take their knives apart for no reason, then they might have to realize they might face additional consequences. And if a knife is broken in the first place, it should be sent in to be taken apart, not taken apart yourself.

my two cents.
 
Sharpnessis said:
It's not a rocket engine, it's a knife! A few screws and a couple washers. I don't see the problem.
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That is my thinking as well.

I have never needed to disassemble my knives but then I don't need to EDC a $400 Strider SnG. Knives are cool, in and out. ;)
 
goodeyesniper said:
you are giving the average person way too much credit, man. You probably also think there's no way anyone would ever put open ended lugnuts on their car backwards, or the WHOLE SPARE WHEEL/TIRE on in reverse, etc... etc... but if you work in the real world, dealing with the average person you come across situations like this every day. Believe it or not, but it is extremely common for someone to use the wrong size torx, worn out drivers, or way overtighten a screw causing stripped head or threads. Not to mention lost screws/washers. Common sense and a tiny bit of technical know how are becoming more and more rare.
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Not giving them too much credit. I am simply stating that some of us actually know what we're doing and have actually fixed badly assembled knives from the factory.
I do deal with customers directly, I have found most customers are for the most part fair. If they messed it up they will pay for this mistakes.

Sometimes however bad apples do come in, but you don't see us crying foul and punishing FAIR and GOOD customers. It is part of business, and we deal with it accordingly however we DO NOT take it out on our other customers.
I think it's a piss poor attitude to take a "all warranty is voided if disassembled stance" because of a few rotten apples by directly punishing those customers who are your bread and butter and are fair and haven't done anything wrong.
 
I always take my knives apart to clean them. I live in the East, hence the shipping cost to send a knife back for warranty would cost half of the knife itself, plus two-three weeks wait. Although I feel that there is nothing wrong with disassembling knives, it is unfair to send the knife back to be reassembled at the company's own cost. I think the only way anyone knows that i have disassembled my knives are by judging how clean the internals are. Haha.
 
Bob6794 said:
You sparked my curiosity it sounds like you have experience dealing with people who thought they put a knife back correctly but didn't. What kind of things did they do? I know with majority of my knives I have worked with they will only go back 1 way, but they were all frame lock, liner lock, and lockbacks. I can't even think of how to assemble it incorrectly unless I throw all the washers on one side.
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You are right they go back one way. Exactly one and only one.

Many have the mentality that its just a collection of washers and screws. For some knives this may be true, for many it goes slightly deeper.

The problems I have seen range from lost parts, wrinkled washers, key ways miss aligned or damaged, improper torque, misuse of thread compounds, rounded heads, tripped threads, off centered blades and broken parts. Some of them are pretty shameful, others are a very subtle detail that many would miss. Some were intentional modifications that the person assumed were reasonable (ie replace a backspacer on a frame lock with standoffs that were the wrong size). Sometimes the slightest interference (or slop) can cause some pretty major issues.

In many cases it was claimed that it was that way before they messed with it. Anyone that really knows what they are doing would have immediately known that sort of statement was BS (perhaps they didn't realize they screwed up, but it was certainly NOT that way before).

I have seen various locks totally compromised simply due to sloppy re-assembly. I have seen knives with a collection of screws all the same pitch but very subtle length differences that when place in the wrong place will bottom out and when the buy keeps cranking, they break or strip or worse...the knife goes together but the lock fails in situations that it previously wouldn't, or a slab cracks because the screw was too long. Other times I'll see a clear case of a short screw was placed where a long one should go and because fewer threads engaged, they pulled out (that stripped screw was NOT like that before, and it is NOT a defect, and DON'T try and claim you didn't do it...there is no way that knife EVER worked in that configuration).

It's not a Swiss watch, but it's not a set of tinker toys either...and some of these customs and mid-techs have tolerances that command respect.

The bottom line is, some people make mistakes and they don't even realize it, but anyone in the know (for that particular piece) can follow their work and realize immediately that a novice was there.

I'm not trying to be insulting...there are MANY knives that I am not familiar with...so I leave them to someone that is.

If you are unfamiliar with the exact workings of every piece, you are taking a risk. As long as you bear that risk entirely, all is fine. I believe this is the intention of these clauses in warranty limitation statements.

Just as there are actions that can improve the performance of a knife action, there are actions that can hamper the performance.

No offense to anyone, do as you wish. But OWN your mistakes;)
 
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not sure whether or not it's a good idea, but I do know that doing it naked is a bad, bad idea.
 
One of my concerns is that a knife may be improperly assembled at the factory. I'm sure the workers are skilled but factory work is way beyond hectic. I always laugh a little when someone says "how could they miss that at the factory?". It's easy when hundreds of knives a minute are rolling by.

I have only had a few knives but each Spyderco had slight imperfections. The Delica had a large burr on the entire liner that pushed it inwards and the Stretch had an extra washer at the pivot. You might say I'm obsessing over small details and you would be right. If I can easily improve the function of something, I do it. I enjoy tinkering... and yeah, I have made a few mistakes. ;)

I like this thread. :)
 
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