Current issue with Scrim

[kevin4242]

(I’m typing this before receiving the knife back (May15))
I am going to try to tell this unbiased as possible. I am trying to make this deal right, On May 11, 2016 I sold the bladeforums member “Scrim” A CKF Morrf for $258 shipped. (http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1394695-Southard-Tolk-CKF-Morrf) I shipped the knife on May 12th and he recieved the knife on May 14. When he got the knife he messaged me and said it had bad lock stick. I do not remember the knife having any lock stick. This is his word vs my word type of deal so i’m not going to say if it definitely had it or not.. First thing I did was apologize and offered him a partial refund or to return the knife and I will pay shipping and insurance. He said, “ I would be willing too keep it if the refund brings the final price I paid down to a fair price for a Morrf with a substantial problem…” When he said that(direct quote) it sounded like he wanted a lot of money back for it, on a knife which had no problems when I had it. I said “Ok, when I had the knife I saw no apparent issues with it so sending a partial refund for a damaged knife on a knife I was fine with keeping doesn't make sense to me. I think I want the knife returned. I will pay the shipping and insurance for it, “ He got upset at the fact that i revoked the partial refund option- which i still offered him a full refund with no monetary loss to him.
He then said, “So if you are now _only_ giving me the option to return, I'll look into Paypal and those rules and how much time I have to execute & file a return/refund claim. It might be 180 days, I think.” That sounds awfully like he is implying he is going to hold onto the knife for a decent amount of time before returning it and starting a paypal claim- because he has the ability to do so. (ill will post entire discussion) I know i said some things I probably shouldn’t of said but he is not working with me to just simply return the knife and get this over with.

I also said, “Also, I know your upset at the transaction and I'm afraid I'm going to get the knife back damaged or used in some way- so I'm going to film the knife being delivered and opened and if there's an issue I will submit the video to PayPal and bladeforums- not accusing you of anything, just saying.
I just want to get this behind our backs and a done deal and get your money back to you.
Thanks” and he replied with-
“Kevin: I really dislike your veiled (and some outright) accusations of me "damaging" or "using" "your" damaged knife that you sold me with undisclosed damage/problems. Remember, this knife is NO LONGER YOURS TO MAKE DEMANDS OR DECISIONS ABOUT. IT IS MINE, BOUGHT & PAID FOR, sir. But because I PAID EXTRA for PP buyer protection, I have THE RIGHT and A VALID CASE to USE IT re: this transaction... I will decide how & when I make the next move regarding this, currently MY knife.”
Where is sounds like he is going to use the knife which he knows he is going to make a return for. I just want him to return the knife and to give him a refund. I’m trying to just get the knife back and have a done deal. Neither of us are happy with how it went, I know i said things that probably didn’t need to be said. End of the day- I offered him a full return and he will not work with me. I can’t get past the fact that he is knowingly going to return it and says he has the “right” to use it. If you think im in the wrong please tell me but I can’t believe how much is he taking advantage of the paypal buyer protection just to annoy me. I’m sure he will be here saying his side- so im posting the full discussion below to remain unbiased.

 

[kevin4242]

-------Entire unedited discussion below





Scrim May 14 4:29 :Kevin,

Knife just arrived. Took it out of the box, very 1st flip...really bad lock stick that was obvious and not disclosed. Next 6 flips, sticks every time. VERY surprised you elected not to mention this in your sales thread text.
If it were a knife without a steel insert..and it was titanium sticking against steel, I'd not be as worried, could be carbonized or wear away a little bit so eventually, no more lock stick. But not in this case.
Steel on steel with lock stick tells me there is something not right, misaligned, mis-measured somewhere in construction. Not your fault but it IS your job as an honest & experienced seller to disclose an obvious issue like this...upfront.
I am a little aggravated right now. Paid your price, a premium, with immediate payment. Did MY part honestly, honorably and fast. So I will let you make the next suggestion about what we should do in this particular case.

Me:Ok , first off I'm sorry , you can ether return it and I'll pay your shipping back or you we can work out a partial refund

Scrim May 14 4:36: Apology accepted. If I send it back I would only do so thru Paypal, and would have to file a claim. This is only Paypal method of continuing buyer protection until return of knife and funds are compete. I would be willing too keep it if the refund brings the final price I paid down to a fair price for a Morrf with a substantial problem...that can't be fixed without going through hell & risk of sending it to Russia and very possibly never getting it back from Russian Post. I would not send it to Russia, ever. So talk to me about a partial refund option. What amount do you feel is fair given this situation.

Me:Ok, when I had the knife I saw no apparent issues with it so sending a partial refund for a damaged knife on a knife I was fine with keeping doesn't make sense to me. I think I want the knife returned. I will pay the shipping and insurance for it, not sure the best way to go through. I don't know the best way to get through a return, never had a knife returned yet. You can open up a PayPal case if you please, I'll make sure this bad transaction doesn't cost you any money. My phone number is 734(xxx)xxxx if you need it but I'm fine talking through here

Scrim 5:48 pm: So to clarify, you offered me 2 options: "you can ether return it and I'll pay your shipping back...or you we can work out a partial refund".
So now I don't have the MUCH simpler for me...option.....where I don't have to repack, find time to re-drive to the post office, stand in line and re-ship. I live in a major city. It is neither quick nor convenient for me to have to undo everything because you didn't admit there is substantial lock stick in your sales thread, but sold it that way anyway.
So you are now taking the much easier (for me) option away now? And you are implying that you never knew this knife had massive & obvious lock stick before you sold it to me? Just trying to clarify this situation that seems to now be changing. And what exactly did I do to receive all these headaches? Oh yes, trust you and pay you YOUR asking price, immediately...and wait & trust that you were an honest, seasoned seller that knew what was important in a sale. Wow. Really?PS. I own a Morrf 3, just like this one but PERFECT...#3/120...bought it on the forums for $225...again, it was/is PERFECT. So to now be having to deal with THIS situation, having paid $258 for one with a substantial problem, and these increasing hassles...just not cool.
See my feedback, Kevin. I bend over backwards to make all my purchases and MY SALES go super smoothly for anyone, especially for those who would trust me and buy from me. But that's just how I choose to do business and show thanks to a customer...who may also buy from me again in the future.
So if you are now _only_ giving me the option to return, I'll look into Paypal and those rules and how much time I have to execute & file a return/refund claim. It might be 180 days, I think. I was hoping we could make this much easier on both of us. But I'm only one half of the parties in this...transaction.

Me: When you said you want a refund on a damaged knife, I did not want to do that. When I had the knife there were no problems with it, so I would rather just take it back then pay a refund for a broken knife. You've sold a lot on here so I imagine it's not super hard for you to make it to the post. In any transaction, if your not happy with it, send the knife back and I'll refund it. I don't think PayPal even makes me pay for the return shipping which I offered. I am being nothing but fair with you and you are blowing up on me. I also have perfect feedback and I'm offering the solution to a bad sale which is to return it with no monetary loss to you. And now you are blackmailing me by saying your going to hold the knife for 180 days to file a PayPal claim? How do you even threaten someone like that....?
It is such a simple matter, send the knife back and I will give you all your money back. I'm being fair and respectful and you are blowing up.

Scrim 6:17pm :Not blowing up at all. You are just accusing me of something you are deciding is happening. You are also accusing me of "blackmailing you". You have to be kidding. Maybe I SHOULD blow up at these accusations. I...did nothing wrong here. Try to remember that. We don't need to go back & forth anymore. If you are now reneging on YOUR offer of a partial refund, I will just use Paypal and follow their rules & time tables. It's pretty simple. I don't see where there is any blackmailing. If you want to take back an option you offered me, why would you then expect me to do things quickly and easily for YOU? Can you explain the fairness & logic behind that assumption. I really don't have the time and interest in arguing over a $258 pocket knife. If You don't want to simplify both our lives and agree to honoring a partial refund, as you originally offered...that's ok. I will simply follow and utilize the time tables and options Paypal offers me as a buyer of an item NOT AS DESCRIBED. This is why I NEER buy using Payapal GIFT. For unexpected situations like this. No hard feelings, Just don't have the time to get into pissing matches about pocket knives. Thanks for everything, Kevin. Sincerely, the guy that trusted & bought from you...but received a messed up knife and rude accusations from you, the seller. Wow.

Me:Ok I'm sorry for the bad deal, sorry I took back the offer of a partial refund but I just want my knife back. I don't see why to hold onto it, why wouldn't you want your money back and just finish it?
This isn't going good for either of us why drag it on?
Also sorry for the accusations, I'm just trying to get this a done deal. Neither of us are obviously happy but I would prefer just to have the knife back then to take a huge loss when I had no issue with the knife.
I don't know what else I could possibly do but to ask just to get my knife back and then you'll have your money back. We don't need to act like children and bicker over it.
To me, it seemed like your being a little unecessary when you were talking about the 180 day wait time. I just want to make it a done deal.
Sure follow what PayPal allows you to do but why not just get this over with then to make it a hassle on the both of us.
This is an unfortunate situation but we can act like adults.

Scrim May 15 5:02 am: I really dislike your veiled (and some outright) accusations of me "damaging" or "using" "your" damaged knife that you sold me with undisclosed damage/problems. Remember, this knife is NO LONGER YOURS TO MAKE DEMANDS OR DECISIONS ABOUT. IT IS MINE, BOUGHT & PAID FOR, sir. But because I PAID EXTRA for PP buyer protection, I have THE RIGHT and A VALID CASE to USE IT re: this transaction... I will decide how & when I make the next move regarding this, currently MY knife. -- YOU made this deal a nightmare, not me. YOU didn't disclose damage/problems before you sold it to me. YOU are only making things worse with your poorly thought out derogatory and accusatory comments towards a seller YOU'VE wronged. And it's all in writing for the records, should they be useful to me. -- So to be clear, I WILL DECIDE what I want to do and if & when I decide I am going to file a claim with Paypal because this knife is NOT AS DESCRIBED, I'm sure you'll get official notification from Paypal at some point within the time allotted BY PAYPAL for a buyer to file a claim against a (let's just say) less than forthright seller. But remember...this is all now AT MY OPTION. That's just the facts. Sorry if you are uncomfortable with the facts. -- I've NEVER had even 1 transaction with ANYONE on bladeforums even remotely like the negativity I've experience from YOU and this transaction. Good evening, Kevin.

May 16- Me via email-
Hi,
I would like to offer you one last chance to come to terms with the purchase of the CKF Morrf. If you would like to return the knife, please start a Paypal claim and we can get this over with and you will get a full refund. I have been in contact with Paypal and the moderators of Bladeforums about the issue and I was advised to open a GBU thread."

Scrim via bladeforums pm-
So now you’re threatening me (again)? You go from bad to worse.

You sold a misrepresented knife to me with knowingly undisclosed damage which you later apologized for. You were concerned about me “checking it out” as soon as I got it, obviously becaus you knew there was a problem and wanted to know what I would do about it. I contacted you about it. But YOU’VE BEEN PAID. So your concern is done, for now. If I choose to file a NOT AS REPRESENTED claim, well, that’s my business. All rules have been followed by me. You can bitch & threaten me with Paypal & Mods & GBU threads all you want. Tell you what. Why don’t you send the mod you spoke to, to me. They have my contact info. I'm happy to discuss this directly with them and show them all of the written proof/threads/pm's & emails.

You were paid. This is becoming harassment by you towards me, with threats. I’d chill out if I were you. You knowingly executed a fraudulent sale by intentionally not disclosing damage. Admission via instant apology once you realized you weren't going to get away with it easily due to an inexperienced buyer. I'm experienced, friend. What I choose to do about next it is MY business. I also spoke to Paypal and they confirmed I IN FACT do have 180 days to file a claim. I explained the situation and my claim, should I file it within 180 days from sending you payment…is VALID and follows their rules & policies. So save your threats.

I suggest you stop trying to make this situation even uglier. It won’t help your situation at all & probably make it quite a bit worse. I too can write up a GBU thread about you & this transaction if I choose to. Remember that. If you really want to turn this into an ugly pissing match, all you have to do is start it...publicly. I, to this point, have been polite, private & discreet. You can force that to change. You have been obnoxious & threatening to a buyer that did everything right by you. I hope you feel good about your behavior, before, during & after the purchase/sale. I don't think it will go well for you & your reputation on BF, ultimately, when all of the written truth is revealed. YOU broke the rules. YOU are making this deal a nightmare. YOU have threatened me…multiple times now. You should apologize again to me, sincerely, and hope I don’t decide to make an even bigger issue out of all of this. I certainly could. And I’d be 100% right to do so. Your threats are and have been completely unnecessary and unwarranted, not smart and are falling on deaf ears, Kevin.
Stop digging your hole deeper. Know what I mean? Thanks for making this the only, regrettable knife-purchase-transaction I’ve EVER had with ANYONE on bladeforums.

 

[NYOutdoors]

(I’m typing this before receiving the knife back (May15))
I am going to try to tell this unbiased as possible. I am trying to make this deal right, On May 11, 2016 I sold the bladeforums member “Scrim” A CKF Morrf for $258 shipped. (http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1394695-Southard-Tolk-CKF-Morrf) I shipped the knife on May 12th and he recieved the knife on May 14. When he got the knife he messaged me and said it had bad lock stick. I do not remember the knife having any lock stick. This is his word vs my word type of deal so i’m not going to say if it definitely had it or not.. First thing I did was apologize and offered him a partial refund or to return the knife and I will pay shipping and insurance. He said, “ I would be willing too keep it if the refund brings the final price I paid down to a fair price for a Morrf with a substantial problem…” When he said that(direct quote) it sounded like he wanted a lot of money back for it, on a knife which had no problems when I had it. I said “Ok, when I had the knife I saw no apparent issues with it so sending a partial refund for a damaged knife on a knife I was fine with keeping doesn't make sense to me. I think I want the knife returned. I will pay the shipping and insurance for it, “ He got upset at the fact that i revoked the partial refund option- which i still offered him a full refund with no monetary loss to him.
He then said, “So if you are now _only_ giving me the option to return, I'll look into Paypal and those rules and how much time I have to execute & file a return/refund claim. It might be 180 days, I think.” That sounds awfully like he is implying he is going to hold onto the knife for a decent amount of time before returning it and starting a paypal claim- because he has the ability to do so. (ill will post entire discussion) I know i said some things I probably shouldn’t of said but he is not working with me to just simply return the knife and get this over with.

I also said, “Also, I know your upset at the transaction and I'm afraid I'm going to get the knife back damaged or used in some way- so I'm going to film the knife being delivered and opened and if there's an issue I will submit the video to PayPal and bladeforums- not accusing you of anything, just saying.
I just want to get this behind our backs and a done deal and get your money back to you.
Thanks” and he replied with-
“Kevin: I really dislike your veiled (and some outright) accusations of me "damaging" or "using" "your" damaged knife that you sold me with undisclosed damage/problems. Remember, this knife is NO LONGER YOURS TO MAKE DEMANDS OR DECISIONS ABOUT. IT IS MINE, BOUGHT & PAID FOR, sir. But because I PAID EXTRA for PP buyer protection, I have THE RIGHT and A VALID CASE to USE IT re: this transaction... I will decide how & when I make the next move regarding this, currently MY knife.”
Where is sounds like he is going to use the knife which he knows he is going to make a return for. I just want him to return the knife and to give him a refund. I’m trying to just get the knife back and have a done deal. Neither of us are happy with how it went, I know i said things that probably didn’t need to be said. End of the day- I offered him a full return and he will not work with me. I can’t get past the fact that he is knowingly going to return it and says he has the “right” to use it. If you think im in the wrong please tell me but I can’t believe how much is he taking advantage of the paypal buyer protection just to annoy me. I’m sure he will be here saying his side- so im posting the full discussion below to remain unbiased.

You both have significant feedback. The un-edited exchange of contacts (emails, PMs, whatever) would help in this situation.

For what it's worth, it sounds like he was saying that it's "his right" to utilize PayPal Buyer Protection if he so chooses. I did not take it as him saying it was "his right" to use the knife to his heart's content and then file a PayPal dispute for a return.

To me (without seeing the conversation yet), it looks like you both are a little butt hurt and probably pissed each other off with less-than-respectful comments towards one another. Time to grow up and resolve it...and yes, that applies to both of you.


edit: I see you added the conversation, thanks.

 

[kevin4242]

Thanks for the input. I posted the entire discussion. please refresh the page. I am trying to get this a done deal with a return and full refund to him.

 

[mqqn]

Wow - Seems like someone I don't ever want to deal with, unreasonable and unable to understand simple discussion.

It is really that hard to get to the post office?

I think, based on the above, that Kevin has done all he can save for sending Scrim money, which it seems Scrim is angling in on: "Send me money or I will hold onto the knife for as long as I like to inconvenience you."

Another one for the NEVER do business with list.

best

mqqn

 

[wtlj]

Scrim has played these games before. He's been blacklisted from more members than just myself. Im hoping his actions on this CKF sale may be the last we see of him.
Just 5 minutes of research brings up Scrims hatred for CKF before he purchased kevin4242's knife.
-He started a GBU thread stating "they lost him as a customer" due to "problems & insults" from CKF.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1248164
-He also posted a couple YouTube video bashing CKF and his feelings about the company:
https://youtu.be/NrN75RNVxe8
http://youtu.be/rsrjxt1CIrk

Clearly Scrim was already set in his ways before purchasing kevin4242's CKF. Why he would make the purchase, upset himself with the knife, then take it out on a phenomenal member of our community who has gone above and beyond numerous times is beyond me...

Also a few more threads on Scrim:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1354590

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1377737

kevin4242 offered a 100% refund and also surpassed the PayPal rules offering to pay return shipping. He admitted fault to issues he can no longer confirm nor deny by accepting a return. He should not have to fear a PayPal dispute will be started in 179 days from now...
As for Scrim having to find time to package, address, find a PO, ship, update PayPal etc. A shipping label can be printed at home quicker than a response email complaining about how long it takes. He can then walk to his mailbox and have the labeled package picked up by USPS which will be scanned immediately. If you don't want to walk to your mailbox or fear it may get stolen (or any other reason) simply state pickup at door/from customer etc.

Scrim is a BULLY...End of story.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[NYOutdoors]

After reviewing that exchange, I won't be doing business with scrim in the future. Not a cool way to handle this, man. You seem like a complete bully trying to squeeze as much as possible out of the seller.

Totally shady and a very disconcerting exchange of communication, especially on Scrim's end with his significant positive feedback. Hope he chimes in here soon.

 

[Corytr]

Scrim has been PM'd with a link to this thread

 

[kevin4242]

They are unedited, I can post screenshots of the messages if it comes down to it. I would like to add that he said , "You were concerned about me “checking it out” as soon as I got it, obviously becaus you knew there was a problem and wanted to know what I would do about it. "
I sent that to every single person that had a delivery from me that day (can show proof). I just like to make sure my books are clear and the customer is happy.

 

[NYOutdoors]

Scrim has played these games before. He's been blacklisted from more members than just myself. Im hoping his actions on this CKF sale may be the last we see of him.
Just 5 minutes of research brings up Scrims hatred for CKF before he purchased kevin4242's knife.
-He started a GBU thread stating "they lost him as a customer" due to "problems & insults" from CKF.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1248164
-He also posted a YouTube video bashing CKF and his feelings about the company:
http://youtu.be/NrN75RNVxe8

Clearly Scrim was already set in his ways before purchasing kevin4242's CKF. Why he would make the purchase, upset himself with the knife, then take it out on a phenomenal member of our community who has gone above and beyond numerous times is beyond me...

Also a few more threads on Scrim:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1354590

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1377737

kevin4242 offered a 100% refund and also surpassed the PayPal rules offering to pay return shipping. He admitted fault to issues he can no longer confirm nor deny by accepting a return. He should not have to fear a PayPal dispute will be started in 179 days from now...
As for Scrim having to find time to package, address, find a PO, ship, update PayPal etc. A shipping label can be printed at home quicker than a response email complaining about how long it takes. He can then walk to his mailbox and have the labeled package picked up by USPS which will be scanned immediately. If you don't want to walk to your mailbox or fear it may get stolen (or any other reason) simply state pickup at door/from customer etc.

Scrim is a BULLY...End of story.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

LOL!

If I may be so bold, I think it's time the mods booted this guy right off the plank into banhammer land.

Kevin: make sure to retain screenshots and records of everything. Unfortunately, PayPal is very biased in the buyer's favor, which is great when you're the buyer and have an issue, but as a seller, it's a much harder case to prove. Hope it works out for you.

 

[RIPtastic]

I have some less than nice things to say about the buyer so I won't say them. I read the entire conversation and it just made me angry reading his responses.
I've never put anyone on ignore but theres always a first. What a *&*%

 

[NYOutdoors]

After some more thought, I think this just goes to show that iTrader is a great tool for determining who you're dealing with, but shouldn't be completely relied upon (this coming from someone who has significant positive iTrader feedback). Make sure that you search TGTBTU forum (and even the forum at large) for a better picture of who you're dealing with, especially on the higher end purchases.

 

[Scrim]

I don't really feel a need to defend anything in here on my end...but I'll spend a few minutes since my chiming in was requested. Also not sure if what was posted is compete but I don't have a ton of time to sift through threads, and waste that kind of time on pocket knife. It's quite simple. I was sold a knife with a big, obvious problem which was not disclosed by the seller. I believe I can decide if I want to keep it & and live with it or try to fix it...or not touch it and return it. But that is my reasonable decision as a buyer. I'm a little stunned at the negative comments towards me when it was the seller who did something wrong to begin with. How I choose to deal with it is at my discretion, fair, reasonable and by all the rules. As far as people that don't want to do business with me, when I've done everything by the rules and paid instantly, etc.....feel free to put me on your ignore list. You are obviously the type of seller/buyer or member I don't want to deal with. I like to deal with members that don't do slimy things in transactions and then follow up with threats toward a 100% honest buyer (& seller occasionally). Some real gems within this group. I gotta laugh.

-- PS. Mqqn, Your comment is most surprising as we had a very nice transaction in the past.

Oh well, I guess verbally stabbing someone in the back, that has treated you well in the past, is A-OK with some of you guys. Best of luck to ya. -- To the rest of the great members I've dealt with here on BF, many more than once, I look forward to more transactions and cool & interesting interactions. To the morons & scumbags, please, put me on your ignore list immediately! Thx, Scrim

 

[NYOutdoors]

I don't really feel a need to defend anything in here on my end...but I'll spend a few minutes since my chiming in was requested. Also not sure if what was posted is compete but I don't have a ton of time to sift through threads, and waste that kind of time on pocket knife. It's quite simple. I was sold a knife with a big, obvious problem which was not disclosed by the seller. I believe I can decide if I want to keep it & and live with it or try to fix it...or not touch it and return it. But that is my reasonable decision as a buyer. I'm a little stunned at the negative comments towards me when it was the seller who did something wrong to begin with. How I choose to deal with it is at my discretion, fair, reasonable and by all the rules. As far as people that don't want to do business with me, when I've done everything by the rules and paid instantly, etc.....feel free to put me on your ignore list. You are obviously the type of seller/buyer or member I don't want to deal with. I like to deal with members that don't do slimy things in transactions and then follow up with threats toward a 100% honest buyer (& seller occasionally). Some real gems within this group. I gotta laugh.

-- PS. Mqqn, Your comment is most surprising as we had a very nice transaction the past.

Oh well, I guess verbally stabbing someone in the back, that has treated you well in the past, is A-OK with some of you guys. Best of luck to ya. -- To the rest of the great members I've dealt with here on BF, many more than once, I look forward to more transactions and cool & interesting interactions. To the morons & scumbags, please, put me on your ignore list immediately! Thx, Scrim

Just goes to show what a class act does with his back against the wall.

When you give a crazy person enough rope to hang himself, what's the result?




Just go away, bro.

 

[robgmn]

-
Scrim May 14 4:29 :Kevin,

Knife just arrived. Took it out of the box, very 1st flip...really bad lock stick that was obvious and not disclosed. Next 6 flips, sticks every time. VERY surprised you elected not to mention this in your sales thread text.
If it were a knife without a steel insert..and it was titanium sticking against steel, I'd not be as worried, could be carbonized or wear away a little bit so eventually, no more lock stick. But not in this case.
Steel on steel with lock stick tells me there is something not right, misaligned, mis-measured somewhere in construction. Not your fault but it IS your job as an honest & experienced seller to disclose an obvious issue like this...upfront.

Me:Ok , first off I'm sorry , you can ether return it and I'll pay your shipping back or you we can work out a partial refund

.

Even if I were to disregard the seven flips, if I were a judge I'd look at the reply from the seller and say "The buyer is in the wrong. He was offered: an apology, a full refund with no out-of-pocket costs, AND the option of a partial refund."
Since a dollar figure of a partial refund could not be agreed upon, the full refund with no out-of-pocket expense to the buyer is the only way to go.

Regardless of your intentions Scrim, what you are doing is painting a rather poor portrait of you.
Accepting the refund and walking away from this is the right thing to do.

Holding the knife captive and contacting PayPal for a resolution seems like a ploy to get the knife for free (as PayPal could never force the terms of a partial refund).
'And that would be a really &^%##* thing to do.
Do the right thing.

 

[Scrim]

.....

 

[Scrim]

Just goes to show what a class act does with his back against the wall.

When you give a crazy person enough rope to hang himself, what's the result?




Just go away, bro.

---

Um...yeah...bro. I think it might be you that should take up a new hobby...bro.

 

[Scrim]

Oh boy, a little more time wasting. Ok... I contacted Paypal because the seller did (first) and used it as a bit of a threat, one of many he issued and then appolgized for...after being called out on them. So I wanted to verify with Paypal what the rules and my rights are as a buyer. No more, no less.

Even if I were to disregard the seven flips, if I were a judge I'd look at the reply from the seller and say "The buyer is in the wrong. He was offered: an apology, a full refund with no out-of-pocket costs, AND the option of a partial refund."
Since a dollar figure of a partial refund could not be agreed upon, the full refund with no out-of-pocket expense to the buyer is the only way to go.

Regardless of your intentions Scrim, what you are doing is painting a rather poor portrait of you.
Accepting the refund and walking away from this is the right thing to do.

Holding the knife captive and contacting PayPal for a resolution seems like a ploy to get the knife for free (as PayPal could never force the terms of a partial refund).
'And that would be a really &^%##* thing to do.
Do the right thing.

 

[NYOutdoors]

-------Entire unedited discussion below

Scrim May 14 4:36: Apology accepted. If I send it back I would only do so thru Paypal, and would have to file a claim. This is only Paypal method of continuing buyer protection until return of knife and funds are compete. I would be willing too keep it if the refund brings the final price I paid down to a fair price for a Morrf with a substantial problem...that can't be fixed without going through hell & risk of sending it to Russia and very possibly never getting it back from Russian Post. I would not send it to Russia, ever. So talk to me about a partial refund option. What amount do you feel is fair given this situation.

Me:Ok, when I had the knife I saw no apparent issues with it so sending a partial refund for a damaged knife on a knife I was fine with keeping doesn't make sense to me. I think I want the knife returned. I will pay the shipping and insurance for it, not sure the best way to go through. I don't know the best way to get through a return, never had a knife returned yet. You can open up a PayPal case if you please, I'll make sure this bad transaction doesn't cost you any money. My phone number is 734(xxx)xxxx if you need it but I'm fine talking through here

According to the Kevin's logs, you were the first one to bring up PayPal being involved in the transaction at all. If that's not the case, then I'd love to see your side of the story.

 

[Scrim]

For what it's worth, it sounds like he was saying that it's "his right" to utilize PayPal Buyer Protection if he so chooses. I did not take it as him saying it was "his right" to use the knife to his heart's content and then file a PayPal dispute for a return.

To me (without seeing the conversation yet), it looks like you both are a little butt hurt and probably pissed each other off with less-than-respectful comments towards one another. Time to grow up and resolve it...and yes, that applies to both of you.


edit: I see you added the conversation, thanks.[/QUOTE]


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"For what it's worth, it sounds like he was saying that it's "his right" to utilize PayPal Buyer Protection if he so chooses. I did not take it as him saying it was "his right" to use the knife to his heart's content and then file a PayPal dispute for a return.

You both have significant feedback. The un-edited exchange of contacts (emails, PMs, whatever) would help in this situation."

EXACTLY! Thank you. (from Scrim)