Custom vs. Kit knife

R

rprocter

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i would like to know if there are any clues to look for when viewing a knife online, that might help distinguish between a kit knife FB and a true custom FB.
below are pics of an unmarked 8 1/4"(not including pommel nut) FB as an example. the 4 3/8" blade has a flat grind and bilateral swedges, looking to my eye, symmetrical and "perfect", rounded spine, comes to a perfect point and is shaving sharp. it does not appear to have ever been used or re-sharpened.
the guard and butt plate are brass and there is a threaded tang secured by a brass nut.
the one piece handle looks like desert ironwood.
the sheath is substantial and well made of thick cowhide and is a perfect fit with the knife.

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i am hoping that some custom knifemakers will comment on aspects of this knife and sheath which might indicate a true custom or a kit knife.
besides being interested in the possible origin of this knife, i am also looking for 'pointers' that could be applied to other knives as well.
thanks, roland
 
im going to go out on a limb and call it a kit blade
for the grinds from you post are dead on and great care in making them that way
why then is there mostly ruff handle work? thats not to say its not a good knife but if a maker was spending all that time on the blade to make it dead on i would think that a bit more care and time would also have been spent on the handle fit up

sheath looks nice but im not a leather guy
 
Heya Roland.... sorry to say but I'm going with Butch and calling that a kit blade. The quality finish of the grinds are a mismatch to the fit and finish of the handle work. There's obvious gaps, there's large grit sanding marks in the handle near the guard, the finish of the butt cap and that pommel nut is pretty much standard from kit suppliers. Someone who can pull a swedge like that isn't going to leave that kind of mess on the handle. Sorry to tell it to ya :(

Quit buying knives late at night man!!!! :p
The sheath looks alright, stitching isn't that hot and hasn't been tapped down or had a stitching wheel run over it. I'm not the best leather guy though but it's a decent sheath.
 
I'm thinking the same thing. Aside from what the others mentioned, the blade shape is sort of an indicator, too. I think Jantz offers a blank just like that, which itself is a copy/version of a Marble's woodcraft. That's not to say that a custom maker can't/won't use a woodcraft design, I'm just saying it automatically puts doubt in my mind as it being a custom blade. With the other factors mentioned added to this, I'd say it's a factory blade somebody put a handle on. Right or wrong, that's my initial impression.
Later,
Iz
 
Oh yeah... it's unmarked.... someone that can grind like that is going to mark a blade at least to my way of thinking.
 
that is a Solingen "Skinner" knife blade. It comes with a threaded tang and even comes with the threaded nut. I have seen it for sale on the web at places such as "Thompson's Scandinavian Knife Supplies"
 
Thanks guys for all the input. this knife was a $23 ebay item which i purposely bought to post in this forum so i could learn more about what to look for to differentiate between kit vs. custom.
so looking for uniform quality of finish in all parts of the knife is important.
and as a general rule, most customs do have the maker's mark or name on the blade, but not always and i have seen kit knives which the maker had stamped or etched.
the sheath is really well made. you couldn't stitch through the 3.5mm thick leather, which is 5 layers thick at the throat of the sheath, without a very heavy duty sewing machine. so i presume some kits come with the sheaths already made up to fit the blade.
roland
 
Roland,
A maker that can do that kind of grind, especially the swedge, is going to mark his blade. As a rule beginning makers won't mark their blade but the blade will look like a begginer's knife... hope that makes sense.

As a rule, the whole package should be equal... the blade should never be finished better than the handle IMO since woodworking is easier to clean up than metal.

$23? if that's ironwood I might have bought it just to have the handle material :p
 
rprocter said:
you couldn't stitch through the 3.5mm thick leather, which is 5 layers thick at the throat of the sheath, without a very heavy duty sewing machine.
roland
Click to expand...
Roland,
Myself and a lot of makers on these forums sew through that much leather by hand. You can use and awl or drill press to make your holes.
Later,
Iz
 
A few minutes perusing sites/catalogs like Jantz, Texas Knifemaker's Supply, and the like will familiarize you with the common kit knife blade patterns.

There's nothing automatically "wrong" with using a kit blade or modifying/re-handling a factory knife; some of them are made from quality steel and heat-treated well. Full disclosure is important, and the finished knife should be priced accordingly.
 
i am not trying to get any debate going on kit vs. customs; and the skill involved in assembling and finishing this o.p. knife is far greater than what i am capable of. but i do want to learn how to distinguish between the two when perusing ebay, where for sure the vast majority of unmarked pieces are from kits.
knifemakers of experience will know every little step in minute detail and so have an ability to see things in a knife which i, lacking this knowledge, will overlook. so it's a "pick your brains" thread, rather than debate the merits.
i have about 60 sole authorship custom knives. i'm not sure that they cut any better than a really high end production knife, but some of them have an indescribable quality, kind of like a friend. the knife almost talks to you. it is as though the concentration, effort, and pride of workmanship, i.e. the energy of the maker, resides within the knife. i can really like a production or kit knife, but i never get this same feeling. that, to me, is the difference.
now, i'm about to open up a package containing a Bulldog from T.K. i'll be very surprised if it does not talk to me.
roland
 
I'm just showing off my new knife eh ! oh ya, and official T.K. hat too.

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and somebody has to correct "political correctness".
roland
 
Roland, she is a lovely, lovely child, where do you buy a "full custom kid?" :p So now I see the whole package sans Roland, the dogs, the daughter and a knife :D You're a lucky man.
 
Roland what everybody else said, I used to actually put handles on blades like that 30 years ago. At the time they were all carbon steel and if I'm not mistaken they offered
a 4" and 5" model.
Ken.
 
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