Customer Satisfaction Survey

A

AKY

Joined
Oct 29, 1998
Messages
114
The auto industry does, so let's begin.

How would you rate your satisfaction with the custom knife you own? Did the knife turn out to be everything you thought it was when you ordered it? Would you buy from that maker again? How has it performed? Any regrets?

I don't own any handmades...yet. I just put myself on a three year waiting list for my first. (You all get three guesses and the first two don't count.) Actually, by the time I get it I will probably own others.

Speak up for your favorite!

TTFN,
Tony
 
I currently own three customs so I'll rate them here.

1) RJ Martin mini-kozuka: Extreme customer satisfaction on this one. Absolutely the sharpest knife I've ever owned, small enough
to carry daily, and very comfortable to use.
I will definetely buy from him again very soon.

2) A Scott Sawby combat utility: Again very sharp. The self-lock is very secure and easy to operate. Fit and finish is amazing, way beyond any factory knife I own (except my Sebenza). The knife is very slim, comfortable to carry and has a lip that doesn't tear up my pockets.

It makes more economic sense for me to carry something like a Benchmade or Spyderco, which
I'm sure would serve me quite well, but they lack the charm that a good custom has.
It's kind of like wearing a Rolex, a Seiko might serve you just as well, but it just feels better to wear the Rolex.


 
I also currently own 3 customs.
Darrel Ralph Krait, absolutley flawless. . Kit Carson Large 4, fit and finish flawless. Locks up solid. Built like a tank.
Terzoula ATCF. simple and flawless. handle design excellent. locks up solid. Would buy again. All the grind lines excellent. Clips are well thought out and rides well in the pocket. All came Razor sharp.
My exp with customs is very limited, but its been first rate all the way.
Tom
 
Hi AKY,

Welcome to the world of custom knives. First let me say that your "mystery" maker claims to have over 3,000 orders (Blade Magazine last November 97). No custom knife maker produces over 500 knives a year. Im sure you can do the math. No you will not see your knife in 3 years, 4 years, 5 years etc.

For those of you who have been waiting far past your delivery date with nothing but hollow promises to show for it (lies). Emerson is now in the Knife Makers Guild. According to their rules, the maker must produce the knife or the money in the allotted time (barring circumstances beyond thier control). Send your letters to the President of the Guild:

Al Pendray
Rt.2 Box 1950
Williston, FL 32696

You must submit in writing the date you ordered the knife, when you were told you would receive the knife (Send a copy of the receipt and a copy of your cancelled deposit check).

The Guild will then inquire as to why the knives have not been made. My attorney who is also one of my clients, paid Emerson in full 4 years ago for a CQC6, you guessed it, no knife. He was told 6 months at the time.
His letter is on its way to Al.

Please note, only the first few will get action on their letters, after that Mr. Emerson will be asked to leave the Guild. So dont delay send today. Or better yet, just dont order one, there are several knifemakers who are much better and their knives are less expensive and you can get them in a timely manner.

You skeptics, print a copy of this and put it in a calander for the year 2003. Just so you can email me then and let me know what the status of your knife is in 2003.

Ok, enough of that.

Over the last 3 years I have bought in excess of $1.2 Million worth of custom knives (I do this as a profession). I can honestly say that less than 1% of those knives did not live up to the expectations for a knife at the price level they were sold at.

I mention the $1.2 Million for two reasons.
First, you are not alone, there are alot of people buying custom knives for all different reasons.

Secondly, each year I purchase and resell more knives than the year before. Thousands of customers entery the custom knife field every year again for various reasons.

Ninety percent or higer of the people you will run across in custom knives are honest, reputable and hard working people. However, there are those, as there are in any business who are not honorable. Do yourself and your fellow collectors/users a favor and do not purchase knives from these individuals.

I look forward to hearing more stories about which makers get your votes for excellent quality and customer service.

Les
 
I picked up an Elishewitz Specter at a show.
Loved the knife but split my thumbnail trying to release the liner lock. It was tight and would chatter. I sent it to Allen for adjustment and got it back in less then two weeks. Now the lock is perhaps Too easy to release. I lived with it for a while but then the thumb studs started to loosen and would rotate freely. Back it went. Again, it was returned in a fortnight replete with new studs. I thought, "Great, I'm all set."
Nope. Now the closed blade sits off center inside the handle almost touching the liner
and I can't put enough tension on the pivot.
I really wanted to make this knife my main carry/user but instead I ended up selling it for about half what I paid for it. I must say though that Allen was a very nice guy to deal with. I just wish he would INSPECT the knife before promptly shipping it out.

On the positive side, I have an Osborne
damascus Policemate that is perfect and can do no wrong
wink.gif
What a piece of work! Only possible design flaw might be the difficulty in closing it with one hand.

As an aside, I've owned around ten hand-mades
and, with the exception of an early Butch Valloton, I've Always lost money when selling them. I also collect "antique" Remingtons and
*gasp* ...Microtechs (I'm sorry! I'm sorry!
I'll never mention the M word in this forum again!) and I've Never lost one crummy dime
selling either of those. I love hand-mades. I think they really give you the most bang for the buck but I can't afford to always loose on my investment.



[This message has been edited by Rick (edited 16 December 1998).]
 
Les,

Not what I wanted to hear. Although, you should know since your in the business. (Wow, $1.2mm!) I ordered the CQC6 fully aware of the three year wait. I figured it would allow me time to save that kind of money. I don't know about going much past 3 years though...

I'm also condidering Carson, Lightfoot, Martin, Chamblin and others. All these people make some really cool designs with outstanding reputations. The CQC6 just holds a special place in my heart. If I could find something similar I could very well change my mind. Any thoughts? The overall picture is important to me. I don't care for sharp angles on the handle. I look for the handle to flow smoothly into the blade. I don't like a lot of curve tip-to-tip (ala AFCK). Bull strong and well executed (fit & finish). I have never handled a CQC6, so I'm going on reputation and what I've heard other owners say. Does any of this make since??

Aargh!
Tony

[This message has been edited by AKY (edited 16 December 1998).]
 
Tony,

I buy you books, I send you to school and you refuse to learn. Ok, here is your alternative, the 458 Magnum from Greg Lightfoot. Superior fit and finsh, also the blade is ground on the correct side for a right handed person! The knife is $425 with black G-10 and will out perform the CQC6.

You should pruchase one of these. Just so youll have a knife to use for the next 5 years while your waiting for your CQC6!

The other makers you asked about all do excellent work. My advice is to go to a major show so you can pick up all of these knives and check them out.

Good Hunting

Les


 
Les,

I, for one, wish yhat you would stop the smear campaign against the Emersons. I understand that you feel that you have some issues with them but I feel that your one-sided war on this forum, given the fact that they do not participate in it, is quite unfair to them.

You repatedly state that there are better knives for the money (whitch may or may not be true, opinions vary) but since when was knife collecting such an analytical science.
Emerson is one of the main influences in the popularity of the chisel ground, synthetic handled liner lock folders. As such, there is a certain "pride of ownership" associated with having an Emerson knife.

A comparison might be drawn loosely to some other great and well known makers. Bill Moran, "the father of modern Damascus" boasts astronomical prices and a seemingly interminal wait. There are other makers turning out very similar knives at a fraction of the price, but they still do not bear the Moran name. There are many makers of fine interframe folders but that does not mean that they have the mistique of one made by Ron Lake.

In the rather ecclectic world of "custom knives", there are often many forces beyond the knife in question that contributes to a knifes value to a customer.

In fairness, the one time I had the opportunity to speak with you, you were patient and informative with me. I just wish you would take your problems to the Emersons and off of the forum.

Please excuse the rant. I just felt that it had to be said.

Sincerely,
Derek Russell

[This message has been edited by Derek (edited 17 December 1998).]
 
Derek,

This is not a one sided war that Emerson does not particpate in. He started it. In April of 1996 he called me and told me the next time he saw me he was going to "kick my ass". To date this has not happened. He has also threatend physical violence to Allen Elishewitz and Kit Carson, dont take my word for it call or write them to verify this. I would call that participation wouldnt you?

In December 1997 I received a letter from Emerson's attornies telling me if I didnt stop talking about Ernie that I would be sued for Libel and Slander. I was accused of saying such libelous things as Emerson does not deliver his knives on time!

My attorney responded 1 year ago today 12/17/97. The started with, do you know your client goes around and threatens others in the custom knife community with physical violence. We then touched on other subjects as well. To date I have heard nothing from Emerson or his attornies.

So you see Derek, he has particpated plenty. You just havent known about it. Additionally, he was set up right behind me at the New York Custom Knife Show in November. He had ample opportunity to say anything he wanted to me. Neither of us spoke to the other which was fine with me and Im sure equally fine with Emerson.

Sorry Derek Emerson and Bill Moran even loosely used in the same sentence is incomprhensible.

Credit for tactical folders goes to makers such as Terzuola, Carson, Crawford and others, who were doing it long before Emerson ever did.

The Chisel grind goes to the Japanese first and then Phil Hartsfield (not Ernie).

The liner lock, goes to the Case Electricians knife cira 1912, the to Michael Walker (not Ernie).

Titanium in knives, Michale Walker probably gets credit, Im sure there are a couple of others (not Ernie).

The tanto, Im pretty sure that Emerson is not a name of Japanese origin. In the US Bob Lum gets credit for the Tanto (not Ernie).

The Clip, once again not Ernie. He got his from Spyderco (but so did just about anyone else).

Micarta, on a knife, again no!

Now in fariness to Emerson, I think he did a lot to bring attention to the tactical folder market. He is a great promoter and marketer.
His knives were many current collectors first experience with custom knives. So his knives had a positive effect on the market.

This is why his business practices are so troublesome now. Because, he does have (according to him 3,000) custom orders he has put himself in a hole. How can he possible make all 3,000 knives in 3 years? That works out to roughly 2 1/2 knives a day for the next 3 years? The next question is, would you want one of those knives?

For the same reasons that he has had a positive impact on the custom knife community. His current practices will have an equally negative impact on the custom knife community.

I understand pride in ownership, I have a Rolex Submariner. Obviously a Sekio would do just as well (better according to some). I do understand why some want an Emerson. It is their right to buy what ever they want.

Just as it is my right (and yours), to question things and point out errors in judgement. I get dozens of calls each week asking me about different makers. Where they stand among their peers, how is their work, what kind of man or woman are they.

Derek I get asked these questions because people know I will tell the truth. We both know that Emerson hears about these posts and he could respond any time he wants. Perhaps he considers it a waste of time, perhaps he it just to busy or whatever the reason is.

The fact remains that he is not being fair to his customers.

Derek at this point I hope you have gained a new insight to my perspective and understand it a little better.

Trust me if was a true "smear" campaign I could do much better at it then Im doing here on this forum. I think you would agree for the most part those that particpate in this particular forum have been around custom knives for a while and the things I am saying (except for contacting Pendray) are probably old news by now.

So to this end I will try and keep my posts to new issues concerning all makers.

Les
 
Les is right on about 99% of custom knives being great value for the money. If you have the opportunity to work with the maker to perfect a design, the final product takes on even more personal value.

I have a custom Guy Hielscher damascus fixed blade that was done up to my specs. An Elsihewitz M5 Omega that Allen made with options I asked for. The Talonite Wambli that Rob Simonich created for me was a fantastic experience giving me a great blade that is still blowing me away. And I'll soon have another Talonite blade Trace Rinaldi is calling the Chimera after the inspirations I used in laying out the knife's design.

All have been exceeded my expectations and serve me well. The quality of materials, craftsmanship, and interpersonal dealings are what makes having a custom knife special.

There are makers who create for the shear joy of it. Chat with Kit Carson, Darrel Ralph, Alan Folts, Rob Simonich, Trace Rinaldi, Mark Boyer or others and you'll understand. There are others, I'm told, who are more businessmen than artisans. So far I've managed to deal with only great folks, and for that I'm externally thankful.


------------------
-=[Bob]=-

Bald is beautiful! Rub a dome for luck today!

 
Les,

Not to beat a dead(or dying) horse but just in the interest of clearing up a few points;

I never said that Emerson was the originator of his style of knife merely that he is largely responsible for their semi-recent rise in popularity. I do not necessarily compare Emerson to Moran in terms of "legendary" status. You could, however, make the case that you could buy a very nice Damascus Bowie, Dave Ellis or Tim Hancock for example, but it would still not be a Moran. You could buy a knife that will out perform a Moran such as a Mad Dog, but again, it does not have the mistique of one of his knives. you are indeed paying for the priviage of owning a handmade piece made by Bill Moran.

I do know a good deal of the background between the you but while he has more or less kept it between yourselves(ie; not posting them on a public forum), you have stated your issues here.

I am now lying my opinions to rest and I look forward to moving on to the continued discussion of knives.

Sincerely,
Derek Russell

[This message has been edited by Derek (edited 18 December 1998).]
 
Getting away from Emerson and back to original:

I have three customs so far, I'm 100% pleased with all.

Mad Dog: Zero problems, my particular piece was older production and an unpopular model I was pleased to score. Odd tastes, I guess. Kevin did me a slip sheath fitted to it in addition to the regular one the knife had and in a reasonable time, he also tuned the tension on the slip to my needs.

(Note: cash handling on the Mad Dog deal was through a dealer, on all others it was direct with the maker/heattreater/sheathmaker. Kevin deals money *only* with dealers but works direct with customers so there's no inherent problem with the difference.)

Harald Moeller: Harald did a custom based on my blueprints, working with me to improve the design. The result was beyond all expectations. We came to the mutual conclusion that it needed to be enlarged a tad from the original concept and I paid $50 over original quote, not bad at all. Key thing that went right: he sent two plexiglass mockups to me, I altered one and sent it back which was directly translated into steel; nothing else could allow close collaboration at over 1,000 miles range. There was a delay due to him being shipped the wrong steel and an early version being "stillborn"; the delay was around a month and a half, not terrible and he was 100% up-front on the problem. Total project was under six months, I'd do biz with him again in a heartbeat esp. if I wanted a "totally complete" blade. Scott Evans at Edgeworks did a superb sheath for this piece, good turnaround, fair price, killer quality.

Alan Folts: Alan ground me a sword blade to my specs but with his input on balance, unfinished sorta like an Engnath. Schedules were easily met, he even did a slight speedup to match Ernie Mayer's heat-treat schedule as descibed elsewhere. Ernie's turnaround was fast too. Alan is noteworthy as a good custom maker willing to do unfinished pieces.

In all cases I paid money order deposits averaging around 1/3rd (ballpark), I paid in full when they said they were shipping. Zero problems with cash handling, I feel that treating them reasonably led to them doing likewise to me.

Jim March
 
My first (and only, thus far) custom is a Lightfoot 460 Magnum. My knife has the chisel ground sabre-shape blade. Fit and finish are superb, great G-10, titanium. Blade is BG-42. Sharp and with a great satin finish. Talk about a big, tough mother of a tactical folder! The liner lock is superbly executed, easily passing JT's liner lock test per the FAQ. As a big fan of the BM 975 I have to strongly recommend this knife. I am currently eagerly awaiting the introduction of several new Lightfoot designs after the new year :-)

Happy Holidays,

Waldo
 
My only custom so far is an EDMF Trench Bowie by Dale Sandberg. It`s not a typical custom with flawless finish work and super duper materials,it`s a rough,tough,working knife that I`m not hesitant to use and abuse. I`d compare the overall finish work to that of an SKS. Still the grind lines are nice and even,the finish is consistent,and he made it just the way I wanted it. Dale was super nice to deal with and took a lot of time with me answering questions and discussing options which BTW went mostly without any surcharges. It`s not a glamour queen but it is a heck of a lot of knife for the money. I`d buy from him again in a minute. Marcus
 
As it happens, I own two Ernie Emerson custom knives (let's not get involved in handmade vs. custom, OK?). A CQC6 and CQC7. Frankly, I was disappointed at first, as the esthetics of the knives were not what I expected. There was a scratch on the Ti bolster on one of the knives where the screwdriver had slipped out of the slot. The micarta handles were slippery.

I called Jay at AFCK, and remarked about this. Jay said that that is the way he makes them. Ernie makes knives to work, not look pretty. Jay said he had taken several apart, and there were structural elements of very high quality inside. He further said Ernie used standard slotted fasteners because he didn't want a user to be stranded without the proper driver, and slotted screwdrivers are nearly everywhere.

This made sense to me, and after a year's use, I am convinced that the knives are worth the price. If I had to hack my way out of a car, or dig through dirt, I would rather have an Ernie Emerson than any other folder.

I also have folders from A T Barr, and Kit Carson, and they are examples of beautiful knives that beg to be used. My Kit Carson is a fairly lightly constructed knife, however, with C-fiber scales, a part length inlet Ti liner lock on one side only, and a Stellite (r) blade. It is beautiful, and up to most cutting chores, but I wouldn't want to dig with it. Kit is making me folders in Talonite(r) and 420V, which, with their Ti scales will be undoubtedly much more robust.

The A T Barr folder is a more sturdily built knife, with an ATS-34 blade, double Ti liners, micarta scales and Ti bolsters. It is a beautiful piece of work, but I carry it daily, and wouldn't hesitate to use it for severe chores, but would do so as a last resort, as I would hate to ding up the bolsters or blade, even though A T would repair and refurbish them free.

Rob Simonich made me a Talonite (r) Cetan fixed blade, with Ti scales, and I wouldn't hesitate to use this for any task. He claims that it will survive anything short of a direct nuclear blast.

I have several Mad Dog knives, from a mongoose, mini-shrike, pATAK, pATAK2, ATAK2, and MAKO (Shrike is en route). The p(ygmy)ATAK2 is my car knife. It is probably the strongest knife Mad Dog makes, having a fairly short blade, and being 1/4" thick! I think I could pry up a car with it if I had to. Mad Dogs aren't pretty; the Kydex sheath puts scratches on the hard chrome everytime you sheath or unsheath it, but these knives will really withstand rugged service.

AKY; to answer your particular question, if I were you, I would get A T Barr or Kit Carson to make you up a folder in your choice of steel, and micarta or Ti scales, for strength. Both these maker's knives have flowing lines in both scales and blades. Also, they have a very long blade to scale length. Typically, the blade is only about 1" shorter than the scales. Here are some measurements:
closed length blade length (stab depth)
CQC6: 4 3/4" 3 1/4"
A T Barr 5 1/4" 4 1/8"
Kit Carson 5 1/4" 4 1/4"

After handling the various knives, you may well come to feel that the Emerson has a blade that is too short. Further the chisel grind is fine for fast and furious chopping, but not suited for fine cutting. Also,the grind is on the wrong side for R handed people. If you can only have one folder, I would advise against the Emerson. Walt Welch


 
Thanks everyone for your responses! I have learned several things from what has been posted here:

1. Everyone has their opinions. I cherish them all.

2. Politics is everywhere, even in the (cyber) knife community.

3. Barr, Carson, Emerson, Lightfoot, Martin, Crawford seem to be the most represented by this small sampling.

For now, I'm going to keep my order with Emerson. I was told I can always cancel and get my deposit back. I will also start saving for another handmade. I might even take Walt's suggestion and order a custom from Barr.

I'm glad there is a place for knife lovers to come and share opinions and experiences. I learn something everytime I log on, and will keep doing so as long as I'm learning and having fun. Isn't that what it's all about?

Peace to all and thanks again!

Tony
 
With only $25.00 invested in the Emerson so far, it's a just small gamble. If you're like a lot of us here, you add a few other knives to your collection to ease the pain of waiting for your Emerson.
wink.gif

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top