Customs Community – A Responsibility?

RogerP said:
I think we may have a different understanding of the term "obligation". When I have a passion for something I pursue it because I want to, not because I feel I have to.

I don't spend hard earned money and equally hard earned vacation time attending shows and hammer-ins because I feel a moral compulsion to do so.

I don't buy knives - direct orders from makers, show purchases, dealer purchases and felllow collector purchases out of a sense of duty.

I don't spend time researching and writing articles for magazines because I feel that I am required to do so.

I don't make thousands of posts over many years on an internet forum because I feel conscience-bound to do so.

I would say all these things do in fact contribute to the industry I enjoy. I would not describe my two decades plus of participation within the industry as simply "enjoying it as long as it lasts or is of benefit to me".

But moral / ethical compulsion, duty, requirement, conscience - all of which lie at the heart of "obligation" do not inform my motivation.

Roger
Click to expand...

Well Roger, at the end of the day I guess it doesn't matter why you do the things you describe above. The important thing is that you are a "doer" and the community benefits from it. :thumbup: That's my point.
 
Lorien said:
I do feel a sense of responsibility towards the custom knife scene, now that I think about it, because on several occasions I've been on the receiving end of others' generosity. I feel obligated to 'pay it forward'.
:)
Click to expand...

I think most of us have been on the receiving end. :)

RogerP said:
I think we may have a different understanding of the term "obligation". When I have a passion for something I pursue it because I want to, not because I feel I have to.

But moral / ethical compulsion, duty, requirement, conscience - all of which lie at the heart of "obligation" do not inform my motivation.

Roger
Click to expand...

Websters:
ob·li·ga·tion
Pronunciation: \ˌä-blə-ˈgā-shən\
Function: noun
3 a: a condition or feeling of being obligated b: a debt of gratitude
 
Last edited:
I would classify this - to me - a hobby. If it were a profession or religion, or political campaign i might feel more compelled.

But, community is a good thing. This little forum is a part of my social network i guess. Which i enjoy.

"Obligation" is for those who want to effect change.
David
 
Kevin Jones said:
Websters:
ob·li·ga·tion
Pronunciation: \ˌä-blə-ˈgā-shən\
Function: noun
3 a: a condition or feeling of being obligated b: a debt of gratitude
Click to expand...

Definition - obligation - noun

1) The act of binding oneself by a social, legal, or moral tie.

2)

a) A social, legal, or moral requirement, such as a duty, contract, or promise that compels one to follow or avoid a particular course of action.

b) A course of action imposed by society, law, or conscience by which one is bound or restricted.

3. The constraining power of a promise, contract, law, or sense of duty.

4) Law.

a) A legal agreement stipulating a specified payment or action, especially if the agreement also specifies a penalty for failure to comply.

b) The document containing the terms of such an agreement.

5)

a) Something owed as payment or in return for a special service or favor.

b) The service or favor for which one is indebted to another.

6) The state, fact, or feeling of being indebted to another for a special service or favor received.


RogerP said:
But moral / ethical compulsion, duty, requirement, conscience - all of which lie at the heart of "obligation" do not inform my motivation.

Roger
Click to expand...

When you reproduce an entire definition, you get a better flavour of the meaning of the term.

Roger
 
severedthumbs said:
Kevin feels obligated

Roger does not feel obligated

ok we get it
Click to expand...

That may be what you are getting out of it, but is not entire picture.

Roger..do you have a sense of obligation WRT Dan Farr?

Best Regards,

Steven Garsson
 
I feel no debt of gratitude and I feel no obligation. I sometimes will do things to help a specific maker or the community, but I do so for my own interest, pursuing rational egoism. Anything less than that is demeaning to the maker, the collector, and our little community.
 
Kohai999 said:
Roger..do you have a sense of obligation WRT Dan Farr?

Best Regards,

Steven Garsson
Click to expand...

Yep. You can find that under "The state, fact, or feeling of being indebted to another for a special service or favor received."

But is that why I buy his knives?

Nope.

In response to the question posed, a sense of obligation is not what motivates my "supporting knife publications, shows, organizations, forums and such".

Nor do I accept for a fleeting moment that absent a sense of obligation, all that remains is selfish indifference, as suggested by Kevin.

At least, that is what I took from his "enjoying it as long as it lasts or is of benefit to me" and "just reaped the fruits of the land so to speak in only being interested in the pursuit of their next knife" comments.

Roger
 
RogerP said:
Yep. You can find that under "The state, fact, or feeling of being indebted to another for a special service or favor received."

But is that why I buy his knives?

Nope.

In response to the question posed, a sense of obligation is not what motivates my "supporting knife publications, shows, organizations, forums and such".

Nor do I accept for a fleeting moment that absent a sense of obligation, all that remains is selfish indifference, as suggested by Kevin.

At least, that is what I took from his "enjoying it as long as it lasts or is of benefit to me" and "just reaped the fruits of the land so to speak in only being interested in the pursuit of their next knife" comments.

Roger
Click to expand...

I know Kevin, Roger and Joss.

When Joss says that he feels no obligation, I agree….because I have seen it….Joss does what he wants to do, pretty much…..I would classify Joss as a knife collector, not a knife person.

This is not what I have seen with Roger OR Kevin…..regardless of how he perceives himself, Roger has shown to have some sense of responsibility to the knife community…he is a real knife person….and so is Kevin…..but that is JUST my perspective, and there is no designated Knife Person Annointer….and we can all hope that there never will be.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Is gratitude somehow tied into all this?
For example, if so and so felt grateful for this community, does that also mean that person feels indebted or obligated to it?
If one doesn't feel grateful for the community and what it offers, but involves themselves in it in one way or another, does that mean they wouldn't feel indebted or obligated to it?
 
Obligation is a difficult word to work with here so I will explain my own take on the subject.

People have given of their time to teach me so I teach others.

People have given me materials to work with, I do that with others whenever possible.

People have been kind friends to me over the years so I be a friend to others.

Whether or not this meets the criteria of obligation to the industry it is what we all do in our lives in a civil society.
 
RogerP said:
I think we may have a different understanding of the term "obligation".

Roger
Click to expand...

RogerP said:
When you reproduce an entire definition, you get a better flavour of the meaning of the term.
Roger
Click to expand...

Actually Roger, I was just pointing out that I didn't have a different understanding of the term "obligation", I just took a different definition of it.
Both your and my definitions are correct according to Webster.

I do feel an obligation to the custom knife community to give back whatever I can. I came into the community about eight years ago without a clue. Folks such as Jerry Fisk, Daniel Winkler, Karen Shook, Steve Dunn, Bob Neal, Larry Bailey, Jay Hendrickson, Tim Hancock, David Anders, more recently STeven, Les and many others including yourself have selflessly taught me. Yep Roger, I have learned quite a bit from your post here as I hope some novice collectors have learned from mine.

When I hardly knew the difference between a hunter and a bowie, Jerry spent the better part of an hour on a Saturday afternoon telling me about custom knives. Heck, I could probably make a pretty decent knife from what Jerry has taught me over the years.
Having the money to spend on a custom knife collection, does not guarantee a good collection. It takes a LOT of help along the way.

And there are many collectors who are interested in no more than their next knife and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, however I am saying that without collectors like you and STeven and many others, the custom knife industry would not be at the level it is today.
 
Kevin Jones said:
And there are many collectors who are interested in no more than their next knife and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, however I am saying that without collectors like you and STeven and many others, the custom knife industry would not be at the level it is today.
Click to expand...

That is real true, Kevin....but I would even say, just as we look at the makers who started it all(Scagel, Randall, Loveless, Moran, Warenski, Horn, Hale, Cronk, Henry......) we need to look at the COLLECTORS that were there, at the beginning right with them, Nate Posner, Phil Lobred, A.G. Russell.....who were NOT satisfied to just get another custom knife, but were COMPELLED to preach the gospel of the custom knife to all who would listen....they were the knife people that set the mold for the next generations.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
And who is responsible for the "art knife"? You could study this genre as a sickness.

Obligations we have to say it out loud.

That is my debt, say it the way you feel it..
David
 
Joss said:
I feel no debt of gratitude and I feel no obligation. I sometimes will do things to help a specific maker or the community, but I do so for my own interest, pursuing rational egoism. Anything less than that is demeaning to the maker, the collector, and our little community.[/QUOTE

A voice of reason! Who is John Galt?
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top