D2 Chinese steel

The Aflac Duck said:
Umm, D2 is D2… But more specifically to your question it depends on the heat treat. There’s no such thing as “Chinese D2”. It’s either the real thing or it’s not, and then the heat treat matters after that.
Click to expand...
the only part true about your statement is heat treatment is very important

deep dive...
I've mentioned this before, and there are other threads that talk about it:
Typical mass produced d2 in the orient tends to actually be this 'equivalent' : cr12mo1v1 or even cr12mo1v
- notice the key difference, skimping out on vanadium - only 0.15-0.3% let's call it 0.25% to be generous

... which is still 4 times less than the spec of 1%

even the good quality bohler has a different version of d2 they call k110 - http://www.zknives.com/knives/steels/Bohler-Uddeholm/k110.shtml
the better oriental knife makers use k110 (I think they make it locally) - cleaner steel for sure & much closer to spec, but still can be as low as 0.7% vanadium
... here is a perfect bestech example: https://www.knifecenter.com/item/BT...one-drop-point-blade-milled-black-g10-handles

but the old gold standard is old school carpenter 610

I think Dozier used this one

d2 is old stuff, back when wide variations were allowed because they didn't really understand how very slight differences really impacted steel

if you want the authoritative write up about d2 - thank Dr. Larrin Larrin
knifesteelnerds.com

All About D2 Steel - Development, Use in Knives, and Properties - Knife Steel Nerds

Thanks to Robert Erickson, knifeandgear_swiss, Dale Bushness, and Paul Hart for becoming Knife Steel Nerds Patreon supporters! Update 10/22/2020: I now have an article with how to heat treat D2, PSF27, and CPM-D2 and it also includes toughness testing of each steel and edge retention testing of...
knifesteelnerds.com knifesteelnerds.com
 
Last edited:
dirc said:
the only part true about your statement is heat treatment is very important

deep dive...
I've mentioned this before, and there are other threads that talk about it:
Typical mass produced d2 in the orient tends to actually be this 'equivalent' : cr12mo1v1 or even cr12mo1v
- notice the key difference, skimping out on vanadium - only 0.15-0.3% let's call it 0.25% to be generous

... which is still 4 times less than the spec of 1%

even the good quality bohler has a different version of d2 they call k110 - http://www.zknives.com/knives/steels/Bohler-Uddeholm/k110.shtml
the better oriental knife makers use k110 (I think they make it locally) - cleaner steel for sure & much closer to spec, but still can be as low as 0.7% vanadium
... here is a perfect bestech example: https://www.knifecenter.com/item/BT...one-drop-point-blade-milled-black-g10-handles

but the old gold standard is old school carpenter 610

I think Dozier used this one

d2 is old stuff, back when wide variations were allowed because they didn't really understand how very slight differences really impacted steel

if you want the authoritative write up about d2 - thank Dr. Larrin Larrin
knifesteelnerds.com

All About D2 Steel - Development, Use in Knives, and Properties - Knife Steel Nerds

Thanks to Robert Erickson, knifeandgear_swiss, Dale Bushness, and Paul Hart for becoming Knife Steel Nerds Patreon supporters! Update 10/22/2020: I now have an article with how to heat treat D2, PSF27, and CPM-D2 and it also includes toughness testing of each steel and edge retention testing of...
knifesteelnerds.com knifesteelnerds.com
Click to expand...

I don’t ever plan on buying any Chinese D2, so I’ll take your word for it.
 
The issue is are you really getting what you have paid for. I know we had major issues with fake certifications in China for various materials that when we audited the supply chain. And we were one of the biggest Aerospace companies

Not to say there are not good makers in China cause there are and I don't believe they would risk there own reputations. But there is aleways the risk the orders were padded with low grade mixed in unknown to them.
 
dirc said:
... notice the key difference, skimping out on vanadium - only 0.15-0.3% let's call it 0.25% to be generous ...

... the better oriental knife makers use k110 (I think they make it locally) - cleaner steel for sure & much closer to spec ...
Click to expand...

Both Bestech and Petrified Fish have started releasing knives in K110. Both of those companies use Chinese D2 in their base models. Petrified Fish does a better job than most with Chinese D2. Still, the underlying issues with Chinese D2 have become more widely known. I'm guessing that has been a factor in choosing K110, along with D2's market saturation and getting models into the next tier up price-wise.

I haven't tried any of the Chinese models in K110. I'm curious to see what kind of bump in performance it gets relative to Chinese D2.
 
dirc said:
the only part true about your statement is heat treatment is very important

deep dive...
I've mentioned this before, and there are other threads that talk about it:
Typical mass produced d2 in the orient tends to actually be this 'equivalent' : cr12mo1v1 or even cr12mo1v
- notice the key difference, skimping out on vanadium - only 0.15-0.3% let's call it 0.25% to be generous

... which is still 4 times less than the spec of 1%

even the good quality bohler has a different version of d2 they call k110 - http://www.zknives.com/knives/steels/Bohler-Uddeholm/k110.shtml
the better oriental knife makers use k110 (I think they make it locally) - cleaner steel for sure & much closer to spec, but still can be as low as 0.7% vanadium
... here is a perfect bestech example: https://www.knifecenter.com/item/BT...one-drop-point-blade-milled-black-g10-handles

but the old gold standard is old school carpenter 610

I think Dozier used this one

d2 is old stuff, back when wide variations were allowed because they didn't really understand how very slight differences really impacted steel

if you want the authoritative write up about d2 - thank Dr. Larrin Larrin
knifesteelnerds.com

All About D2 Steel - Development, Use in Knives, and Properties - Knife Steel Nerds

Thanks to Robert Erickson, knifeandgear_swiss, Dale Bushness, and Paul Hart for becoming Knife Steel Nerds Patreon supporters! Update 10/22/2020: I now have an article with how to heat treat D2, PSF27, and CPM-D2 and it also includes toughness testing of each steel and edge retention testing of...
knifesteelnerds.com knifesteelnerds.com
Click to expand...
Based on the D2 patent cited in Larrin's article on D2, the spec for vanadium is "about .75 to 1.25%." LINK
Which means K110, even at 0.7%, could be considered within spec (if 0.7 qualifies as "about .75").
 
yes, that's why I said 'good quality bohler k110' - technically, it's made in shanghai/chengdu/shengyang/foshan ... since the company has setup mills there from 2012-19

History - BÖHLER China

www.bohler.com.cn www.bohler.com.cn

it's a good company I think, which has a proven good track record, including their oriental locations
...having said all that, I'd still prefer the lower limit in k110 was 0.9% V : )
 
Last edited:
unwisefool said:
There are some bigger name knife brands out of China that have original designs or licensed/collaborated designs with well known knife makers. They have contracts with companies such as Crucible, Bohler, etc. and are definitely using what they say they are.
Click to expand...
Yup; I agree...
Having 3 knives from WE (all with different steels): they all seem to be holding up as well as their USA made equivalents.
(But my experience with them is limited...)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top