Delica 4 VG 10 question

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gnystrom

Joined
Dec 24, 2006
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I have a question about Spyderco steels. I really like the thickness, weight, and overall feel on my Delica 4 with VG 10 steel. This knife is just used for everyday cutting and nothing very heavy or repetitious.

I have never been able, using my Spyderco Sharpmaker, to get a good long lasting edge on that blade. It seems like I am always having to touch it up, and even then, the edge never seems to be close to my Damascus Leek or Kershaw Ram.

What are my alternatives in the Spyderco lineup or otherwise, that would most closely replicate the Delica 4, but have much better edge holding capabilities?

Please remember that I am only using the Spyderco Sharpmaker stones for sharpening.
 
In the Delica, you have the option of moving up to the ZDP 189 steel, but that will be a bugger to resharpen/reprofile on the standard Sharpmaker set. I had to get some diamond rods for mine, and even those took a long time. But once you get a good edge, it lasts a really, really long time. I went back to VG10, as I don't mind touching it up, and it gets a really nice, fine edge for me without a whole lot of work. Better, IMO, than S30V.
 
Are you sure you're hitting the very edge with the stones?
 
rycen said:
Are you sure you're hitting the very edge with the stones?
Click to expand...

Good question. My girlfriend has a selection of Delica's, most in VG-10 and I've never found it to be lacking in edge retention unless comparing it to seriously premium steels. It gets hair whittling sharp!
 
You could get a ZDP189 Delica, as Raindog101 recommended. That's the exact same knife with better steel. I sharpen freehand, so I don't know how the angles on the Sharpmaker work with the ZDP Delica's factory edge (if the bevel is set at a different angle you'll have to grind a lot), but I carry a ZDP Lum Chinese folder and find it easy to maintain using Spyderco ceramic stones and a strop. Perhaps another of the Delica sprints could work.

The S30V Blur might be a good alternative, too.
 
I had the same experience with my old Endura but did not have that issue with more recent Stretch. How old is your Delica and does it have a saber grind? My guess is that full flat grind is HT to marginally lower hardness and thus the edge "feels sharper" for whatever reason.
 
ZDP-189 is a pain to sharpen on the sharp maker I would recommend trying to get a super blue delica. Super blue holds an edge longer than VG-10 but sharpens way easier than ZDP.
 
Some answers.

I do not know how old the knife is. I bought it used. I checked the edge with a sharpie. I am getting the edge correctly. I have a Salt plain edge which works fine.
Any more suggestions?
 
gnystrom said:
Some answers.

I do not know how old the knife is. I bought it used. I checked the edge with a sharpie. I am getting the edge correctly. I have a Salt plain edge which works fine.
Any more suggestions?
Click to expand...

VG-10 is an excellent steel.
It's so easy to put a crazy edge on, and it holds it 'relatively' well.

What are you cutting, how often, and how often do you feel like you need to sharpen the edge?

After you sharpen it, how sharp is it?
I mean, what is your test for 'sharp' ?
 
Mostly opening packages, blister pack, and some cardboard. My sharpness test is slicing cleanly through printer paper or shaving arm hair.
 
So how long does it hold an acceptable edge for those tasks?
I am assuming that after you sharpen it you are able to really easily slice through paper?
(No grabbing or tearing, just clean cuts?)
 
There's no way for me to tell how well you're hitting the edge when sharpening.

In my experience with VG10 it never held it's razor edge very long, and it's working edge wasn't anything exceptional.
The good part is, it's really easy to maintain.

Cardboard is very tough on edges, especially fine ones like you get on VG10.

That steel can just be easily stropped to razor sharp.
If you don't own a strop, you should pick one up (or make one).....a few swipes when you feel the blade start to dull should bring it right back to life, and it's worth the 5 minutes every few days for the edge you get.

With the materials you seem to cut the most, you could just maintain that edge with a strop, no need for the SM unless you micro-chip it to the point where you need to remove some material.
 
I have the VG10 FFG delica. The steel takes a nice sharp, edge with good bite.

However, I have experienced very easy rolling, and chips on the factory edge. I spent considerable time grinding out the last chip. I made two small fuzz sticks, and got the chip. I switched to another knife (Kershaw needs work with a thinner edge and much shallower sharpening angle, with no trouble).

I'm hoping it is just a bit of steel that got overheated on sharpening, or something.


I feel like the VG10 does not hold the edge that long, but it is very easy to get it very sharp, and keep it that way.
 
JR88FAN said:
There's no way for me to tell how well you're hitting the edge when sharpening.

In my experience with VG10 it never held it's razor edge very long, and it's working edge wasn't anything exceptional.
The good part is, it's really easy to maintain.

Cardboard is very tough on edges, especially fine ones like you get on VG10.

That steel can just be easily stropped to razor sharp.
If you don't own a strop, you should pick one up (or make one).....a few swipes when you feel the blade start to dull should bring it right back to life, and it's worth the 5 minutes every few days for the edge you get.

With the materials you seem to cut the most, you could just maintain that edge with a strop, no need for the SM unless you micro-chip it to the point where you need to remove some material.
Click to expand...

Good answer and exactly what is happening. I was just comparing it to a couple of other knives I use for the same purpose.
 
JR88FAN said:
There's no way for me to tell how well you're hitting the edge when sharpening.

In my experience with VG10 it never held it's razor edge very long, and it's working edge wasn't anything exceptional.
The good part is, it's really easy to maintain.

Cardboard is very tough on edges, especially fine ones like you get on VG10.

That steel can just be easily stropped to razor sharp.
If you don't own a strop, you should pick one up (or make one).....a few swipes when you feel the blade start to dull should bring it right back to life, and it's worth the 5 minutes every few days for the edge you get.

With the materials you seem to cut the most, you could just maintain that edge with a strop, no need for the SM unless you micro-chip it to the point where you need to remove some material.
Click to expand...

This is great advice. I just bought a Dragonfly 2 in VG10. It came incredibly sharp out of the box but after a bunch of package opening at work, it lost that razor sharpness. Cardboard is definitely hard on edges. After any day of extensive box opening I have to touch up my edge.

I'll echo the strop idea. It's almost all that I ever use any more. A constantly maintained knife will seldom need to be fully sharpened. A few passes over my black and then my green stropping compound and my knives are back to being sharp again. Strops are also much more forgiving in terms of hitting the right angle than a stone or a sharpmaker.

I'd give the strop a try and see how that works out :thumbup:
 
VG-10 is one steel I have more experience with than probably any other. I've sharpened thousands of Japanese kitchen knives with this steel and have carried a Spyderco with it for longer than I can remember.

It's shining feature is the ability to easily take a high polish and hold a razor sharpness. I personally like it best with a 2000 grit waterstone edge which is like a Medium Spyderco Ceramic Stone. The edge has a tendency to hold onto a burr and it can be very difficult to deburr without a strop. If using a stropping compound I would not go below 1 micron or you can experience an extreme smoothing of the edge which despite making it very sharp will detract greatly from its cutting ability and edge retention.

Edge rolling is a common thing with VG-10 and IIRC, also a design feature which allows the edge to be quickly brought back with a ceramic honing rod. I would say honing steel but the honing steels can cause chipping with steels like these. While the Spyderco ceramics do a good job, Japanese waterstones are far more efficient.
 
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