dericdesmond
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Dont listen to Bravado, all his knives could be fakes and he wouldnt even know it as the only thing he uses them for is to catch dust
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The BladeForums.com 2024 Traditional Knife is ready to order! See this thread for details: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/bladeforums-2024-traditional-knife.2003187/
Price is$300$250 ea (shipped within CONUS). If you live outside the US, I will contact you after your order for extra shipping charges.
Order here: https://www.bladeforums.com/help/2024-traditional/ - Order as many as you like, we have plenty.
Desert Ergo Steel Heart and Armorall sheath on eBay.
- Thread starter highpointforge
- Start date
Dont listen to Bravado, all his knives could be fakes and he wouldnt even know it as the only thing he uses them for is to catch dust
dericdesmond
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He was too busy trying to track down more pumpkins.
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Which one???
dericdesmond
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HA, it would appear all of them! 
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HA, it would appear all of them!
Man I would love to see a BM-e in Pumpkin, wow that would be the ticket!!!
dericdesmond
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What you waiting for, send em in !!!!!
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Who me? I never kiss and tell.
My son has studied with him for 6 years and is already a first degree Brown belt at the ripe old age of 19.
As far as fleabay goes do a search here on GBU and read the horror stories. I know there's people on here and from the Busse forums that sell on there that I would never worry about it's the other ones I'm concerned with.
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Who me? I never kiss and tell.
We didn't have BJJ when I was growing up, just wrestling. Your son is gonna be a beast. Having the guy who coached Werdum to victory over Fedor as your mestre doesn't suck though.....I just got back from class and have it again at 7.
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I don't think so. The swedge is pretty long on that blade, ZT's have much smaller swedge.
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Arrived today. Pics forthcoming.
13ninjas
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I don't think so. The swedge is pretty long on that blade, ZT's have much smaller swedge.
Hey Monte......I'm kinda missing that bottom knife for my ZT set.
Care to send it my way? I'm sure you have two. 
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I don't think I have ever seen a swedge like that on an Ergo ... and it is sterile ... and how many Mil Over run's have a unique design ? After all the hassle with the AK 's ... I would be inclined to get the shop to check and confirm it is pukka ... because the seller highlights that the swedge is rare and should know it would normally fetch a premium ... and given what it went for you would normally expect a reserve above that ? Just seems too good to be true to me .... particularly after the coated AK's are being produced in the USA ...
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Good idea. Anyone have a DSHE to compare it to?
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Hey Monte......I'm kinda missing that bottom knife for my ZT set.
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Don't mean to hijack highpointforge's thread but great catch BTW. Is the swedge on your ZTNO look like mine? Can't make out from the pic.
13ninjas
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Pretty sure the swedge on my NO-e matches the BM-e and SH-e swedge. Yours doesn't appear to. What's the deal with that?
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What's the best way to check for cutlery that is Kosher?
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If you saved the pic's done of the knife in the e-bay advert ... pop them into an e-mail as attachments and send it to Jerry or Garth and ask if these were done.
Another way to tell is with a "gun blue" pen ... the knife should be made out of Infi ... Infi does'nt take gun blue very easily ... guys have done them but usually with a full on blueing kit ... whereas A2 or cheaper steel such as 01 will take the gun blue pen quite well ... if you put some on the exposed edge and the blueing really "takes" and won't wipe off ... maybe consider sending it in for the shop to check.
If Jerry remembers doing those E handled Mil Overuns with such a long swedge then probably that is all you need.
The thing is ... if someone were going to copy a Busse and hope to get away with it for ever ... doing a pristine old model with a unique design which was not laser etched with a logo would be the ideal thing to do. Anyone buying such a rare one would be unlikely to turn it into a "user" where the traits of Infi or none Infi may come to the surface ... so a "collectable" like that ... done right ... would likely remain in a safe and no-one would be any the wiser.
The trouble someone has gone to though ... to be able to do painted copies which cannot be etched ... and which can mimmick the handle designs well ... such as the AK's recently found ... well that could mean they did'nt stop there and did other knives which are being sold to re-seller's like the guy on e-bay ... and he either bought it SO cheap he can afford to let it go with a good sheath which does add to convincing anyone it is Pukka ... OR HE HAS DOUBTS AND HAS'NT PUT A RESERVE PRICE ON IT ... that troubled me ... the seller knew it was a rare swedge design and let it go for a snip including the sheath ???
Anyway ... the shop ought to know ... a rare mil over run like that would stay in the memory banks ... especially with such a longer swedge ... the only swedges I had seen before yours were all along the lines of the Zero Tolerance models ... which are a bit shorter and don't go as far along the spine.
On the gun blue pen ... if you decide to do that test ... use a definite Infi blade as a control experiment and do the edge in the same way ... if both are like each other then that would help erase any doubts ... if the knife is more like SR101 steel and the blue really "sticks" ... then you have legitimate need to worry. E-bay protection though should help you if it is a copy.
Another point ... if the knife has'nt been heat treated it should not take a razor sharp edge ... Jerry said the AK's were not heat treated ... but many of the blades back then would likely leave the shop not incredibly sharp ... the latest standards are by far, above what previously were the case ... unless they go back to when it was Jerry working by himself ... those blades were all very sharp ... E handles were still "one off's" IIRC ... meaning that they were individually made and not cad-cam cut ... different lengths to the ricasso before the blade began were common ... so by rights the edge ought to be pretty good.
Anyway ... I did'nt mean to give you the jitters over this and I hope it all turns out well and that you got a real rareity :thumbup:
One other point ... if a faker does a model as yours with a longer swedge and it turns out Busse never did one similar ... then without the logo he probably has a defense to any claim for "passing off" by saying it is not a copy of any existing design ... that is probably why Jerry trademarked the talon hole ... otherwise slight alterations legally could amount to a defense on things like "criminal fraud" ... or civil actions like "passing off" ... so a slight "variable" like your swedge ... also had me thinking was someone trying to be a bit clever here ...
Another way to tell is with a "gun blue" pen ... the knife should be made out of Infi ... Infi does'nt take gun blue very easily ... guys have done them but usually with a full on blueing kit ... whereas A2 or cheaper steel such as 01 will take the gun blue pen quite well ... if you put some on the exposed edge and the blueing really "takes" and won't wipe off ... maybe consider sending it in for the shop to check.
If Jerry remembers doing those E handled Mil Overuns with such a long swedge then probably that is all you need.
The thing is ... if someone were going to copy a Busse and hope to get away with it for ever ... doing a pristine old model with a unique design which was not laser etched with a logo would be the ideal thing to do. Anyone buying such a rare one would be unlikely to turn it into a "user" where the traits of Infi or none Infi may come to the surface ... so a "collectable" like that ... done right ... would likely remain in a safe and no-one would be any the wiser.
The trouble someone has gone to though ... to be able to do painted copies which cannot be etched ... and which can mimmick the handle designs well ... such as the AK's recently found ... well that could mean they did'nt stop there and did other knives which are being sold to re-seller's like the guy on e-bay ... and he either bought it SO cheap he can afford to let it go with a good sheath which does add to convincing anyone it is Pukka ... OR HE HAS DOUBTS AND HAS'NT PUT A RESERVE PRICE ON IT ... that troubled me ... the seller knew it was a rare swedge design and let it go for a snip including the sheath ???
Anyway ... the shop ought to know ... a rare mil over run like that would stay in the memory banks ... especially with such a longer swedge ... the only swedges I had seen before yours were all along the lines of the Zero Tolerance models ... which are a bit shorter and don't go as far along the spine.
On the gun blue pen ... if you decide to do that test ... use a definite Infi blade as a control experiment and do the edge in the same way ... if both are like each other then that would help erase any doubts ... if the knife is more like SR101 steel and the blue really "sticks" ... then you have legitimate need to worry. E-bay protection though should help you if it is a copy.
Another point ... if the knife has'nt been heat treated it should not take a razor sharp edge ... Jerry said the AK's were not heat treated ... but many of the blades back then would likely leave the shop not incredibly sharp ... the latest standards are by far, above what previously were the case ... unless they go back to when it was Jerry working by himself ... those blades were all very sharp ... E handles were still "one off's" IIRC ... meaning that they were individually made and not cad-cam cut ... different lengths to the ricasso before the blade began were common ... so by rights the edge ought to be pretty good.
Anyway ... I did'nt mean to give you the jitters over this and I hope it all turns out well and that you got a real rareity :thumbup:
One other point ... if a faker does a model as yours with a longer swedge and it turns out Busse never did one similar ... then without the logo he probably has a defense to any claim for "passing off" by saying it is not a copy of any existing design ... that is probably why Jerry trademarked the talon hole ... otherwise slight alterations legally could amount to a defense on things like "criminal fraud" ... or civil actions like "passing off" ... so a slight "variable" like your swedge ... also had me thinking was someone trying to be a bit clever here ...
Last edited:
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There were two swedge types on the ZTNOe's, I cant remember for the life of me why, but the two were rather distinct. Easily identified. It caused quite the stir as the collectors wanted both for a complete set.
I still drool at the thought of getting one someday.