DHIII Scary Tac Set vs Ivory Ban eff July 6, 2016

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Wow, you are a man of seriously discerning tastes Bob. On your question, I would carry on as normal. I wouldn't ever expect or accept inspections. I also wouldn't put up billboards advertising my collection that would attract unwanted attention. I would also remove geographic indicators from my profile.
 
JustinFournier said:
Wow, you are a man of seriously discerning tastes Bob. On your question, I would carry on as normal. I wouldn't ever expect or accept inspections. I also wouldn't put up billboards advertising my collection that would attract unwanted attention. I would also remove geographic indicators from my profile.
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Hi Justin,

I don't worry about geographic location indicators, but do keep them generalized. I don't use navigation equipment, don't carry a smart phone, don't advertise my email address, etc. And the greatest part of my collection is in another location in the same city, on the same street on which I live. Beyond that, a good alarm system helps with the rest. A few years ago I stopped posting images of the more important pieces on any online forum. The point is, I'm not trying to avoid anything or anyone, it's just the way I prefer to live my life.

Remember, ownership isn't illegal. Only sale, transfer or possession with intent to sell is illegal and there will never be any cause for any agency to look at me. Hey, I collect. I'm not a dealer. They are the ones who need to be concerned. The law is the law and I believe in strict compliance. I'm not about to add anything to my collection that's problematic in any respect. This thread is to prompt thought about selling or keeping, PRIOR to the federal deadline of July 6, not after it.

Best regards,

Bob


ps: But I DO HATE all you people in the other 47 states that can still own, buy and sell mammoth, LOL.
 
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They are both wonderful

But I would split them up and send one or the other to me :)
 
The matching and complimentary materials make these a perfect set. As far as keeping them together, absolutely- that's what a good collector aims to do, finding or searching out something that works as a set, or a group, or on theme. I'd say you did a fine job here, they work together very successfully. Don't worry about resale, things change over time. Appreciate the artistry. There is one I saw recently posted Don had made with the green mammoth ivory that reminded me of an alligator. He is quite amazing at picking the finest ivory, with the best hues and colors. They look alive almost. Great style on these two knives! Buy five more.
David
 
way to do your due diligence, Bob! I think that this thread is a great way to cover your ass :)

as more and more of the ancient stuff starts showing up due to a warming climate, I think that eventually it will provide a real compelling alternative to that troublesome fresh ivory, and all the increasing hassle that comes with that stuff. The market will dictate its legitimacy, and no doubt the custom knife market could do a lot to advocate for its use. It just has to be untangled from the fresh ivory. Once the chamber of commerce finds out the commercial value of ancient ivory, and its difference from the fresh ivory, you can bet that laws will change. We all know who is ultimately in charge of laws these days, and it ain't regular folk, it's that chamber of commerce!
 
betzner said:
Hi Justin,

I don't worry about geographic location indicators, but do keep them generalized. I don't use navigation equipment, don't carry a smart phone, don't advertise my email address, etc. And the greatest part of my collection is in another location in the same city, on the same street on which I live. Beyond that, a good alarm system helps with the rest. A few years ago I stopped posting images of the more important pieces on any online forum. The point is, I'm not trying to avoid anything or anyone, it's just the way I prefer to live my life.

Remember, ownership isn't illegal. Only sale, transfer or possession with intent to sell is illegal and there will never be any cause for any agency to look at me. Hey, I collect. I'm not a dealer. They are the ones who need to be concerned. The law is the law and I believe in strict compliance. I'm not about to add anything to my collection that's problematic in any respect. This thread is to prompt thought about selling or keeping, PRIOR to the federal deadline of July 6, not after it.

Best regards,

Bob


ps: But I DO HATE all you people in the other 47 states that can still own, buy and sell mammoth, LOL.
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Hi Bob,

I understand and it looks like you are taking precautions as necessary.

I don't have as much faith in authority as you. Sure you say you are not a dealer. Maybe authorities say with your volume you have intent to sell. Maybe this is the first step and in the end complete ownership and confiscation is the plan.

I don't know, but I do know there are too many laws, and it's getting to the point authorities can find you in breach of some law or regulation if they try hard enough.

I'm just fed up being told how to live.

As I said before, I wouldn't act different as to my collection habits because of this law.

Hope this is not too political!
 
The issue would be with anyone - dealers included, of course - who continue to buy and sell the regulated material beyond the effective date of enforcement. That ain't me. And intent to sell (only an issue in California) is the most difficult of all things to prove when it comes to any part of code, let alone convince a judge that sufficient probable cause exists for a warrant to be issued/signed. There's no need to go down this path of discussion, IMHO, as there are LOTS bigger fish to fry and issues at stake than this. My attitudes with respect to authority and enforcement are probably quite different than those of the majority of knife people, as "authority" has been more or less "with and around me" a good deal of my life.

But I think your and Justin's comments have changed the intended direction of the thread somewhat, from something it wasn't meant to be. It purely was meant to cause discussion about what others who are affected by the legislation (technically, final rule changes mandated by executive order) would do, going forward, using my "June quandry" as an example of what perhaps many have gone through to arrive at their concluding decisions. But no biggie, simply your personal expressions. Though as Canadian citizens, both of you are fortunate enough that these regulations do not impact you in the manner they do those of us south of you.

But let me add, to put life in perspective, that living on the ocean, in central California, is a whole lot more important to my life than knives will ever be.
 
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Sooooo Bob,

Does this mean we won't see you on the news running down the beach in nothing but a banana hammock and a mammoth knife in each hand chanting "We have nothing to lose but our chains, come and take them from my cold dead hands"? People are out there protesting a lot less important things!!

To be more concise with your OP, I wouldn't change anything. I would keep my knives if I planned to keep them, or I would sell them if that was my plan.
 
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I definitely agree with your last statement. I would not trade anything for living on the central coast, the beach is near by and the weather is always good.
 
Every single one of us is already an outlaw, whether we even realize it or not.

The United States today has more laws, regulations, rules and codes than any nation in the history of man. We have more armed enforcement officers from myriad local, state and federal agencies than we can even count. And we have more of our own citizens locked up behind bars than any other country on earth. Something to think about as we celebrate our "independence" in this "land of the free" this weekend. :)

Try not to run afoul, Bob. And keep your knives. But if they want you, they'll come and get you too. :p
 
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My answer to your question is - I would do whatever I want to do and whatever I felt like doing.
In essence, I would ignore this specific law. Or someone said earlier- I'll do as I please.

Last week I took my daughter for a ortho braces appointment, while sitting in the lobby I picked up a National Geographic. I saw a shocking photo of an African elephant laying on it's side dead with it's head cut off, for it's tusks. The poachers are in a hurry not to get caught so cutting the head off is faster. It was a terrible raw image.

In Ca violation of this law is a misdemeanor with fines of up to $50,000 and a year in jail. apparently CA is the 3rd largest market after NY and NJ.
From an online news source - "It has been illegal to sell ivory or any elephant parts in California since 1977 -- and nationwide since 1990. But federal and state laws allow the sale of older ivory imported before those dates. As a result, supporters of the bill say, some store owners are illegally labeling new ivory as old, or falsely claiming it came from the fossils of woolly mammoths that went extinct thousands of years ago."

Ok so now I understand why mammoth ivory is of concern now for this law
I've never bought ivory and never will. I have commissioned a folder with some incredible mammoth ivory. I don't think my small time transaction of 1 or 2 knives between friends is what this law is about.

regards
 
Wulf said:
Every single one of us is already an outlaw, whether we even realize it or not.

The United States today has more laws, regulations, rules and codes than any nation in the history of man. We have more armed enforcement officers from myriad local, state and federal agencies than we can even count. And we have more of our own citizens locked up behind bars than any other country on earth. Something to think about as we celebrate our "independence" in this "land of the free" this weekend. :)

Try not to run afoul, Bob. And keep your knives. But if they want you, they'll come and get you too. :p
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Please, everybody, it may be difficult, but please don't turn this thread into an arena for political statements. It is a thread meant to be fun.

Thanks
 
you asked for it, Bob :)
 
Lorien said:
you asked for it, Bob :)
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No, Lorien, I didn't. To be precise, this is exactly what I asked:

"But just for fun, I'm wondering what you folks would do, in those states that have no "mammoth problem", if you suddenly were faced with splitting apart a set that, at least IMHO, is beyond compare. If your state made the sale of mammoth illegal, what would you do with the piece below that is obviously mammoth?

Or to simplify the question, if your state enacted such legislation, would you sell your mammoth ahead of it's effective date or keep it?"

It doesn't call for political statements, or comments from anyone outside the 47 US states that are unaffected by the mammoth problem. But since it seems to be now going in a different direction than intended - off thread topic - I'll just simplify everything and shut it down.
 
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