Do new makers sample making different types of knives for skill?

rrrgcy

rrrgcy

Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
Joined
Aug 21, 2005
Messages
126
General question: I know everyone has their interests in a particular style to build, but for new makers trying this out, do you make numerous types of blades, from outdoors/combat/japanese/kitchen etc. until you find you can make one best and then begin focusing singularly on that style to perfect it? I'm new, playing with many styles trying to see what 'works' for me, but I fear it might actually be a shortcut developing a niche unintended thus ignoring other skills. For example, made this kitchen paring knife, and while i don't want to keep doing these sorts, I'm finding they're a bit easier to do for my skill level (which is about zero). I find it's becoming "safe" and perhaps i should try to make my best of these before other styles. Frankly, from week to week I'm making like two sets of knives of any style and trying to see what comes out.

Q. Do you newer makers feel it's better to just focus on one style?

As for the work involved, I'm simply grinding .110 stock down via an angled platen, then heat treating, then more work until i touch it all up slightly convex only to smooth the edges and then use a sharp angle convex on the edge to put on a cutting bevel, then hand sharpen. As another example of skill limiting, I'm also having a tough time with handles - resulting in tthis easier version here being slotted polyresin stock with the tang inserted and secured via JBWeld, which method I'm really beginning to rely on. Am I falling into a trap?
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There are a few schools of thoughts on this. A good way to proceed is to make 10 of the same knife start to finish, one at a time. You will improve on each one. On the other hand, what is your goals for knife making? Do you want to have fun or progress to selling? If you just want to have fun, do whatever you like. If you make too many types of knives, you might not master any particular style.
 
My first seven knives were completely different styles (complete crap too), but they helped me understand not only what was involved in making a knife but what I was interested in. Even though I made a warncliffe and an ulu and a new tanto for a Kershaw folder I realized that I really wanted to make daggers and bowies, and maybe a kitchen knife occasionally.
The next knife you make should be the one you want to make, the only thing you should be striving for is a better blade than the last one.
 
I don't care so much about styles.

I love learning new techniques though. It's pretty much the driving force behind my knife making.

I see many different styles incorporating cool techniques and just think: "I want to be able to do that! "

But If I were a pro who actually HAD to make money off this thing I'd make what ever sold. Not what I wanted.
 
Yup, what the people ask for. If I need to suddenly become good at a certain grind (or whatever else), I make it happen.
 
Probably not a trap until you make 20 more identical to this one. Review each knife, very critically and see where you can improve. You can make a similar knife improving each one. You can also transfer that knowledge to a new design, maybe do some hunters or camping knives.
 
When I started out I made what I wanted to make and was able to make. As time passed certain knife styles started selling, so I made more of those while still making many knives simply because I wanted to. I had this idea to learn all the possible ways to construct a knife, methods I liked became incorporated into the knives that sold... full tangs gave way to rabbited tangs, stock removal blades gave way to forged blades. Other than selling hunting knives, I was always seeking to make something unique, something that would cause people to do a double-take, and in some ways I succeeded, but finally burned out... the high end knives I wanted to make didn't sell, or sold for such a small amount considering the labor involved that instead of being elated when I sold one I was depressed instead. I had a customer base for the low end work, but not the high end that I wanted to make. I stopped making knives all together for 7 years, I just lost the drive.

5 years ago I started back, simply because I enjoy the work and needed the artistic outlet. I went from making very complex ergonomic post-modern knives to reducing the knife to it's simplest form. Now I make what I want to make, market be damned. Oddly enough, I found a market for the odd, simple little knives I enjoy making, and I am now at peace...:)

Make what you want to make. Make each one better than the last. Put your soul into it... be patient, be persistent. Always be willing to push the envelope, to try new things, new styles and designs. You will find your niche, or create a new one.
 
Like was just noted, For me it's been about passion!
I started with a few hunter Utility/Camp knives and then moved to culinary because someone commissioned me to make an 8" Chef knife for them and I found what I really have passion for making. I make about 10 Culinary patterns and 5 hunter Camp knives going on 19 years of full time.

So? What do you want to make? Do you want to sell them? or just make a few for friends and family?
The sky is the limit, I know one part timer that makes a drop point Hunter of his design and that's the only knife he makes.
I know others that make 20 different patterns. What do you want to do?
 
I'm a very new maker(don't even know if I'd consider myself a maker yet) but I am going to focus on hunting knives for now at least. That's what interests me. Hunting knives are what have always been my favorites. Bird & Trout, skinners, and general hunting knives are what I lean towards. In the future I may venture into kitchen cutlery.

Jay
 
When I was studying with Ken Onion, he told me he enjoyed making just about every kind of knife. Trying new things, even as far as forging a sword- which is about as far from assisted flipper folders as you can get. Made sense to me. I've been doing the same- I made a lot of hunters and skinners, a fair few kitchen knives, a lot of integrals, with a smattering all the while off the occasional bowie, folder, or chopper and culminating recently in a mad fling with daggers.
Right now I'm working on an integral dagger, a damascus chef knife, and a dammy liner lock. I like working that way.
I quit taking orders when it was really burning me out. I didn't want to risk losing the drive to make knives; i almost did. Now I make what I want, and take orders only form family and friends at a discounted rate. It's working for me, for now- you never can tell about the future. I'm flying off to New Jersey for a month in August for a fabricating job, because the money's good but also because it's a nice break from my shop and I enjoy welding as well.
Play it by ear is all I can say, and be sensitive to your own needs, while remaining honest with yourself.
 
If I were a new maker, I would probably focus on one or two styles initially until I had built up a basic level of skill. Afterwards, I would experiment with other styles and see what I really enjoyed making.

I like the idea of being a well rounded maker, so I make a little bit of everything. This also give me some options. If I get tired of making a certain style of knife, I can move to another style for a while.

As others have stated, I would suggest not taking orders and just making whatever you wanted.
 
Speaking as a new maker, I have an interest in many different styles of knives and have no intention of limiting myself. That said, the more I learn about knives and their construction, the more critical I become about my own work and what I want to produce in terms of quality and aesthetics. I have seen a lot of experienced makers on the forum tell new makers that they should start simple and keep it simple for a while. I can certainly see the logic of that but, that ain't me. It is entirely possible that in a few years I may look back and say my first knives were too complex and the execution too sloppy because of it. Or, I may be that much further ahead because I didn't work within a comfort zone...who knows? I think knifemaking is art. It is a form of self expression and if you're doing what you want, then it's not wrong. Like other art forms though, when you present it to the world for critique, you have to be prepared for harsh comments.

Bob
 
I would say I am a new maker. Been at it a little while, but my shop time is very limited. First of all have fun with it. do what you like. If you are a hobby maker I don't see why you would want to make stuff you don't want to. To me making knives is relaxing, I would not want to make knives that caused me irritation as I get plenty of that at work.
 
I'm really thankful to everyone's thoughtful replies. Another turn on my question: In the end it's just me alone in the garage wrestling with "what do i want to try." As much as i try to gain inspiration from various knife mag photos, I throw them away after reading them.

Instead, I always rely on looking over my personal Randall, Nealy, and odd kitchen knife here in the house as outlines. Though my Scagel book sure draws inspiration! Where do most of the new makers gain inspiration ? and do you mimic the knives you own? I find it a little hard to just begin drawing "new-to-me" designs. Does anybody rrreally start out making novel (to the maker) stuff ?
 
rrrgcy said:
I find it a little hard to just begin drawing "new-to-me" designs. Does anybody rrreally start out making novel (to the maker) stuff ?
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I read the magazines and study the knives that interest me. I spend a good deal of time studying the knives in the Custom and Handmade Knives forum and I look at every knife in the knifemakers for sale section. I like to think that I have a good understanding of how a person uses a knife in the applications for which I make knives. When I sit down to design a knife, I do not look at anything else and start with a blank page and a purpose for the knife. I design in Adobe Illustrator so I may spend days or weeks refining an idea before I take it to the shop and start profiling it.

Bob
 
I started by imitating knives that caught my attention here, but after using a few, the designs come from what I now know will work well and be comfortable in hand. I take feedback from my testers and incorporate those suggestions to improve the knives. I don't think the evolution ever stops.
 
Looking a a ton of knife pics over the years helps. You'll get a sense of what is a good looking knife to you, and what is clunky. I like looking through the yearly "Knives" books, actually most of the knives will strike me as ugly or jsut OKish but a few, maybe one every page or two, jump out at me as something I think is beautiful/well designed. You'll start identifying makers who regularly make pieces that speak to you, and what it is about their knives that you like. To me, mostly it is "flow". Examples of this for me would be Don Hanson, Schuyler Lovestrand, Jason Knight, Rodrigo Sfreddo, Terry Primos and Steve Filicietti back in the day, all guys who I became familiar with through lots of pics and whose work has influenced mine.

Finding yourself a good teacher in person would be great, if possible. Perhaps there are some folks in the Ft. Lauderdale area you could reach out to.
 
If you're looking for improvement, what you make and how you make it can be less important than getting out of the shop and getting feedback from people who use knives, and people who have been making knives for a while, and looking carefully and critically at whatever you do make.

It's really easy for me to just continue doing things a certain way until somebody says, "Why do you have that feature?" or "Wouldn't it cut better/feel better if you....."
 
True, true. Try to solicit honest feedback from everyone, no one ever learned from a bunch of "atta boys".
 
I give a third vote here for you to find a local maker you hang with for even say, just an afternoon. Just watching others work on there knives made the synapsis's in my brain fire with ideas. I took a little notebook and a pencil to note down these ideas and different methods of theirs and the ideas that they may have inspired.

Look for local knife maker associations, groups that have hammer ins and grind ins that you can attend and join too! It's a great way to learn and meet fellow makers that can become dear friends.

I just recently had to close my large shop & retail space because there was no point in paying for the retail space when most people these days would pick my brain for a proper culinary knife etc and then go buy it on the net for a price I couldn't match.
The upside of this is I am back making my customs in my one car garage and can start going to local knife maker meetings and shows if I like.

So meet up with any other makers or groups in your area and take along a few of your knives. When you see someone that's made a knife or gives a demonstration or how to, that really hits your hot button ask them politely if when they have time, would they mind giving you some honest feedback on your knives?
 
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