Dodo lock discussion

Joined
Feb 4, 1999
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Thankfully I didn't discover this the hard way (didn't cut myself), but all it takes to get my Dodo to close is moderate hand pressure. If I hold the blade in one hand and I apply maybe 10 pounds of pressure on the spine of the blade the ball kicks out of the lock and the blade closes. I assume this is not normal. Is there something I need to do to change this? Maybe the pivot is an eccentric pivot or something? The ball only seems to engage the very tip of the tang of the blade. The ball is about 1/2 way in the lock slot when the knife is open. Any ideas? Also, I didn't buy the knife, but got it in on trade, if that makes a difference. It is NIB.
 
You have a problem. I think I could stand on the spine of my DODO, holding a large automobile and the lock wouldn't fail. Spyderco will absolutely fix it! Customer service rocks! Josh
 
Well, I got to the office this morning where all my Torx drivers are and I think I solved my problem. The pivot must be an eccentric setup of some sort, or there must be just enough off on the centering of the pivot tube in the setup that turning the screw makes a difference. I backed the female/tube part of the pivot assembly back about 1/8" of a turn, then held it in place and tightened up the male part of the assembly to keep enough pressure on the blade to keep it play-free. The knife has a more satisfying "click" when it opens (so the lock is engaging better) and I can't use hand pressure to fail the lock anymore. If I back the female part of the assembly back the other way I can get it so that if I pinch the blade between my thumb and index finger I can pull downward on it and fail the lock, which is probably just a couple pounds of pressure at best.

So, I fixed the problem! In every case where I've had a "problem" with a Spyderco knife it's because of my tinkering with it. Go figure. :rolleyes:

Well, I spoke too soon. The lock worked properly for a while then I just put some light hand pressure on the spine and it collapsed. Turning the pivot does nothing to remedy this. Something is obviously "off" on this one. I don't get how this happens with production knives, though. Aren't they all made the same way on the same machines? How can one have a significant problem like this and another doesn't?
 
Well, the plot thickens. At this point my Dodo seems to randomly lock up properly and other times fail completely to varying degrees. I've found that if I open the knife really slowly, the lock barely engages at all. Right after I found this out, I repeated this a few times and sure enough, it's pretty consistent. Also at the same time opening and closing started to feel really rough and it gets rougher every time I open and close the knife. I read another post where a lock was having problems and froze up, too, so maybe this is the same problem? I'll definitely send it to customer service and have them take a look. The way it is it obviously has problems and I can't afford to lose any fingers! I cut myself twice yesterday just using it normally. Is it possible for a knife to be TOO sharp? Anyway, I'll call Spyderco and customer service and get this sent in and keep everyone in the loop. Maybe now I can get my Wegner clip replaced, too! :D
 
Boy, this one man conversation is really fun! I’m sure I voided my warranty, but when the lock starting getting really rough I knew something funny was going on, so I just had to pop the knife open and see what was up. I noticed several things:

1) There were little flecks of aluminum in the piston “chamber” coming off the back of the ovals that the ball sits in. Not a lot, but a few on each side.
2) The cause of the rough lock action was that the small spring in the lock was jammed about two coils’ worth into the metal slot that the piston goes in.
3) I pulled the lock out of the knife and noticed that the aluminum piston itself had a few rough spots on it, probably from testing the lock over and over again. These little notches/grooves/pits are where the aluminum flecks came from.
4) I blew out the metal flecks, flipped the small inner spring over, replaced the ball and piston, put everything back together and it works like a charm. Action is smooth, lock isn’t failing.

So, I guess what probably happened is that the small inner spring on the piston got jammed up and just wasn’t creating the tension on the ball like it’s supposed to, so it was sliding back under pressure and allowing the blade to disengage. As it got worse, the spring really started to bind up and even the piston got banged up in the whole mess. It feels “fixed” now, but this does bring up an obvious problem: if the inner spring of the lock mechanism gets stuck in the piston chamber, which we have at least one more report of, the lock can easily fail. In my case, I noticed lock failure BEFORE anything else, which is a concern. It takes 30 seconds to fix the problem, but if lock failure could be the first thing you notice of a problem brewing, that’s not good because this knife is SHARP!

Anyway, an interesting problem with a simple solution. Any ideas on how to fix the design so that the inner spring can’t screw the whole show up?

On a side note, the knife is MUCH easier to unlock now. I think I was getting problems right out of the box with this one because it was all I could do to pull the ball back with one hand before. Now that I fixed the problem, it is easy to use. So, I guess I'll hold onto the knife until this happens again or until the Dodo V. 1.2 upgrade kit comes out!

I suppose this is an inherent problem in this type of lock. For example, REKAT's Rolling Lock would go to seed, too, if the spring broke. I don't know what the mechanism are with other locks, but there is always a potential of a little problem causing a big muckety muck.
 
One more update. The knife works fine unless I gently open it. Think of how a non-knife person would open a folding knife, sort of gingerly. Even if the ball and lock "grabs" the tang at the end (open your Dodo really slowly and you'll see what I mean), very light pressure on the spine of the blade causes the blade to disengage. If I open the knife normally/briskly it's fine. Does my knife still have a problem or is this normal? Here I thought I'd fixed it, but now I'm not so sure...
 
I got my Dodo yesterday and my first impressions are on another thread in this forum. It was VERY hard to close the knife because the ball didn't want to move much, but I figured that was normal.

Last night I noticed that light-moderate hand pressure on the spine of the knife is enough to collapse the lock! I did it over and over again, but I had adjusted the pivot earlier, so I thought that maybe the pivot was eccentric.

This morning I adjusted the pivot again and it seemed to fix the problem, but then it came back again. I noticed, too, that the lock would not really engage if I open the blade really slowly. At the same time, the knife started getting very difficult to open and close and it felt it was "gliding" on rocks. I had read the thread about another Dodo having the piston get jammed in the channel it slides in, so I figured that was the problem I was having. The lock was working miserably at this point and I could pinch the blade between my thumb and index finger and pull down and the lock would collapse with that meager pressure.

I opened the knife up and found metal flakes in the piston channel. Also, the little spring that is wrapped around the piston was jammed in the channel the piston slides in. About two turns of the spring were jammed there, and they were biting into the piston, which accounted for the rough action and the repeated lock failure. I pulled the ball and piston out, got them back in properly and everything seems to work a lot better.

I still have one problem, though: if I open the kinfe slowly (like someone would who is unfamiliar with knives), the lock will still collapse under light hand pressure. If I open with my thumb, normally, no problem, but any slow opening, even if the ball and lock "grab" the tang at the end of the motion (open your Dodo slowly and you'll see what I mean) I can get the lock to fail.

Maybe mine is defective and I need to send it back to Spyderco. But, based on this experience and a couple hours of obsessing about this problem, I see a few things worthy of discussion:

1) Is there a way to fix the possibility of the spring jamming in the piston channel? In my case, the first sign of a problem was complete lock failure. I'm lucky that my fingers were to the side of the scales at the time.

2) Why does the ball only engage a tiny portion of the tang? It seems that the problems I'm having now are related to this. A snappier opening seats the ball in the tang a bit tighter and the lock is strong, but with a weak, slow opening the ball still engages the tang, but not as good as it should, and it rolls back and unlocks under pressure to the spine of the blade. Why not have the ball engage more of the tang to prevent this?

Again, maybe my knife just has some serious problems but it seems unlikely in a production knife that one could get through with problems like this when they're being ground on the same machines, fixtures, etc. I'd love to hear a discussion on this lock design. I think it works great when it works, but it worries me a little to think that I have to open it just right to get it to work. With my other Spyderco's, I know when the lock is engaged.
 
Chiro75,

Sorry to hear you're having so much trouble with your Dodo. I have a blue and a black Dodo and the issues you bring up simply do not apply to either of these knives. The blue is brand new, the black has been used hard since I got it. They both lock up very solid, regardless of the manner in which they are opened. I sincerely believe you got a problem knife. I encourage you to contact Spyderco and send it back for repair/replacement.
 
I guess the next logical question would be on a production knife, how does a problem like this show up? I'm completely unaware of how production knives are really made, what steps are involved, etc. I assume some steps are being done by hand and that's where the problem would occur? I guess I'll have to send this in still (I was hoping my problems were solved) and have it looked at. I need to have 100% confidence in my knives. It seems to work under normal circumstances but it still worries me a bit...
 
That might actually be a good thing. Most non-knife people who use knives don't expect the knife to lock at all...
 
I called Spyderco Customer Service and talked to Richard. The knife is going out today. I guess I don't want to lose any fingers! Can't wait to get the fixed knife back! In the time I've played with this knife I realized this will definitely be an EDC so I want it back NOW! :D
 
Chiro75,

I've merged your two Dodo lock threads. Please don't start two seperate threads on the same subject at the same time.
 
That's a real bummer you got a funky Dodo :(

It's a great Spyderco. I think it's really amazing what you get for under $100. I honestly don't think you could spend $600 and do any better. Some people I've talked to knock it or laugh at it but they just don't understand what it is or stop to consider all the brilliant thinking behind it. Just look at all the features:

-Top of the line materials
-Spyderco's reverse S curve blade
-Spyderco's ball bearing lock
-An extra large Spyderhole
-Spyderco's wire clip
-The best damn ergonomics with
-A deep finger choil
-Impact tail that still allows for capping with the thumb
 
Actually I've the same problem with my Dodo. "X" amount of pressure on the spine of the blade and the lock disengages. It's in to Spyderco now. It's been two weeks now and I'm suffering from Dodo separation anxiety. :(


~jeff
 
Oh no! I asked Richard how long he thought he'd have it and he said it'd probably be a return rather than a repair, so he figured on next week sometime! Nooooooooo! :eek: The worst part about this sort of thing for me is the waiting part! Even though I haven't even really used the knife, I was really wishing I had it, too. It is one super knife and it will be in my pocket daily for a long time.

On to the lock design, why not have the ball roll forward just a little more in the lock? It seems like that's the majority of the problem. I suppose if it rolls too far forward it would cause pressure on the spine of the blade to jam the ball forward and make it really tough to unlock.
 
I am guesssing that the ball doesn't move all the way forward when the knife is new, to allow for wear - on the ball and the blade tang - so that the knife continues to lock up without blade play for a loooong time. It's the same theory with the pin on an axis-lock. Most of those lock up with room to move forward as time goes by.

And....No, it's not possible for a knife to be "too sharp".

Thom
 
How interesting that with this lock problem people still like this knife.
I need to get my hands on one.
I think I might wait until Spyderco figures it out, though.
By the way, would a mid-lock or back-lock work on this knife?
 
When I first got my Dodo, the lockup also had problems. The ball would sit in the right spot and wouldn't give even when under pressure, but sometimes it would be impossible to unlock. It felt as if something was binding/jamming the lock open and wouldn't let the ball slide back.

I took it apart because I figured it'd be an easy fix, and thankfully, it was. The shaft that the two springs go on had a little burr at the end of it, so it was occasionally catching on the backspacer(?) where the locking mechanism's parts sit. I filed the burr off, put it back together, and it's been working problem free ever since.
 
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