Does anyone make a reasonably priced Damascus steel folder? ...

Originally posted by Keith Montgomery
Now , off on a different tangent; Personally, I feel that damascus does not offer value on a user knife.

I would take exception to that as a general statement Keith, although I agree from a "hard-use" persepective for most that is currently available.

The A.G. Russel knife Phil referenced above is a pretty darned good "user" for people that just want to have a classy little folder, and also has very nice overall geometrics, from primary profile to edge dynamics. I've used one since they were offered (maybe 20 months ago)..., and it's a neat knife. Holds an edge well.., but also needs good care. I just keep it in my office drawer. It was a "gift", but I use it just about everyday for various stuff.
Originally posted by Keith Montgomery
In my opinion, the fact that it is way more expensive than the high end non-stainless carbon steels such as 52100, 5160, 1084, 1095 and O1, that it is no better than, leads me to feel that damascus is used to enhance the appearance of a knife and nothing more. If it can not outperform these other steels, and it costs substantially more, then its only added value is in appearance, not utility.

No doubt there sir :)..we totally agree. If I was buying it myself.., 52100, 5160..., and/or the 10-Series would get my vote everytime for a knife I'm going to take-to-task in all domains.

Like you, I do love Damascus (and not the "busy" stuff), and I guess where we -might- disagree is about usability. I have many Damascus knives.., but don't consider them "users".., although my best friend uses nothing but Damascus knives and is a major hunter and outdoorsman.

I opt to "Collect" them like most, but I do think wellmade Damascus is quite usable if it makes the owner feel "Warm & Fuzzy" about using it...(and taking care of it).
 
Pete, I am not saying that I don't think that damascus makes for good user blades. I think they will be as good as a blade made from whatever steel was used to make them, and that can be very good indeed. What I am saying is that I don't feel that damascus will do a better job than a knife made from any other high quality steel and it will cost more. This to me means that unless you are willing to pay the added cost for the added beauty of damascus, you would be better served with another steel.

Another thing that I have noticed is that some people that purchase knives with damascus blades with the full intent of using end up not doing so. This is because they end up thinking that they are just too darn nice and they don't want to scratch them up. This feeling can be accentuated by the fact that they may have paid quite a bit for the knife.
 
I just want to pop in here and say, I hear all the time that damascus knives are to pretty to use and that damascus doesn't make for good working knives. Well to that I say poppy cock.

I agree that a knife CAN only be as good as the steel used to make it, but most all your damascus makers use nothing but high carbon steels in their billets. I use 15n20 which is awfully close to the same as L-6, along with 1095,1080,1084 in billet combinations. Now any of these steels alone make for a great knife, so why do people think by combining them, that there user value decreases. If the steel isn't heat treated properly it won't perform to its best ability but that goes for any steel, damascus, plain high carbon or stainless.

I have 2 local people that have given me handle material in trade for damascus blades. I made the knives to their desired sizes and shapes
and told both that these knives are made to use, I assured them if they had any problems with them to just bring them back and I would either replace them or straighten out the problem, scratches, nicks,etc. Just so they would feel comfortable about useing these blades. Its a win, win situation. I get my blades tested and they get knives they always wanted.
Well, this was early last fall, 1 gentleman is a cattle man and hunts a great deal when not looking over his stock. He informed me this winter that his new knife is carried almost every day. He field dressed and skinned 3 whitetail deer with it and it has seen several other every day cutting duties and up to Febuary when I had talked to him last the blade had never needed reshapening. This sounds like a pretty good user to me. The other gentleman is a boat mechanic and a bit more demanding of his knife. He told me just last week that he was totally surprised by the ability of his damascus knife to hold an edge and that he has had several customers want to look it over when he pulls it out to cut something, he said he has had to resharpen his knife 1 time, but it was because he has stripped several wires when rewiring a couple jobs and cut a few things that actually he should have used side cutters for. Sounds like a pretty fair user to me also.
Both men had a complete change of heart about damascus and its ability. Matter of fact both stated that these were the best knives they've ever used.

As for the price difference, sure you can go and buy a blade made from L-6 or 1084 and get the same performance for less money, but there's a lot more time and workmanship involved in making damascus. Its like making kitchen cabinets from Oak or pine, they both perform the same function but the time and material used in one is more demanding to obtain, to make, and requires a higher skill level then just a plain cabinet maker. Now I'm not putting anyone down here, for I've been up this path and still have great volumes to learn. But damascus is another level up on the skill level of knifemaking and should be compensated for, as is knowledgable skills with any job 1 pertakes in.

Man, this little pop in, has become long winded, Sorry. But damascus does make for a good using blade, its not just pretty to look at. One more thing, the addition of nickel into a billet, it was stated you should stay away from those for a working knife, I agree to some extent there, but if the nickel satuated areas stay a reasonable distance from the cutting edge then the blades ability shouldn't be affected. Matter of fact, the way I understand it, by mixing higher carbon powders with powders high in nickel count (2%-4%), carbon migration transforms though the nickel making it a great deal stronger. Therefore depending on the ratio of the mix, possibly like L-6. But I need to do a little more studying on this subject.

Just my .02

Bill
 
Bill, I agree with what you have added to this thread, but can you tell me something. Is there any added utility benefit to a damascus blade? Sure you are getting a blade that shows a different level of skill on the part of the maker, but for the added cost of the damascus, are you getting any added utilty benefit on a user knife?

I have never thought that a damascus blade was of any less use than one made from any other high quality non-stainless high carbon steel. My point is that it costs a lot more money and other than appearance, I don't see any benefit that it offers.
 
Originally posted by c_meisenzahl
I only know a little about knives and steels etc. I used to have an SOG fodler and now I carry a Spyderco Meerkat.

I was thinking of getting my dad a small folder w/ Damascus steel. What kind of prices do they start at? Any brands particularly notable?


Thanks very much,

Christopher

You've been getting a lot of good advice. Would you mind dropping me an email? I just might be able to help you out...
 
Keith,

As I stated before, you can buy a blade made from L-6 or 1084 for less money and get the same perfomance. But the damascus blade is in my opinion more of a work of art, and from what I've made, a one of a kind.

Some will say, that because of the 2 or more steels used in a damascus blade, that you get different hardnesses layered though the steel, even though all layers make for a superb cutting edge, the different hardnesses wear away at different rates, therefore working to resharpen itself as it wears. I don't know if this is totally true or not, it does make a great deal of sense to me and I have had some damascus blades that seem to out last others when put to some tests, even though the blades were from the same steels,ground the same, heat treated the same but layered differently.

Your question seems like its saying why should I buy a damascus knife when a plain high carbon knife will do the same thing for less money.
Well then, why buy a $30,000 car when a $15,000 car will do, why buy a rolex when a timex will do. Its the uniqueness, the art, and the craftmanship. The farther up the scale one goes in craftmanship the better the product.

Again Just my opinion.

Bill
 
i really like the look of damascus
having said that, i won't be looking at damascus as an EDC

if i scratch it when cutting something, it's not going to be fun getting the scratches out
i also like to use my EDC to the fullest
when a knife costs that much, my pocket hurts to see me putting it through it's paces

but my opinion has got nothing to do with the performance of the steel
imo, the rc hardness of damascus steels have just about as much relationship to the usability of the knife as therc hardness of stellite/talonite
don't knock it if you haven't tried it :)
 
Back
Top