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Door to door mormons:an opportunity for compassion
- Thread starter MauiRob
- Start date
:thumbup: 
- Joined
- Mar 26, 2002
- Messages
- 1,861
A few years back I was love bombed into Joining the Mormon Church. I found that from the outside the Mormons are a beautiful people. They understand financial and family values like few other religious groups. Children are so well behaved they seem like robots. I mean this in a kind way. A very beautful people!
But to my mind their theology is very, very strange!
And very "us" and "them" as far as the rest of the world is concerned. They are "chosen" and will live forever, too complicated to go into this right now --- but the rest of the "unsaved" (by Mormon standards) will not have an afterlife, or if they do, it will be very bad.
They call us "gentiles." Their laws do not apply to "gentiles." The Bishop of our local church told me that he wanted to sell his old car. "But, Bill, don't sell it to anyone in the Church becasue the engine is shot and I have it full of 90 weight oil so it won't knock and smoke. Sell it to a gentile."
Business deals with outsiders? The gloves are off. Business deals within the Church? Better be right!
The missionaries are always in pairs. Want to know why? So they can watch each other for vices. Also mutual support. But "vices" is way up there.
Patriarchal beyond belief. As a Melchazadek priest I was given charge of a group of young women to advise about finances. They has recently garudated high school and were up to their necks in credit card debt. Credit cards had been mailed to them.
I suggested that they draw up a budget, burn the cards, get with their fathers to help them get a bank consolidation loan and pay the balances off with lower interest money.
The Bishop called me inot his office. He was furious! screaming at me! I was concerned that some sort of sexual impropriety had been brought up. I had been VERY careful about this, but his manner suggested I had done something entirely reprehensible.
"Borther Marsh! WHAT DO YOU THINK YOU ARE DOING?"
"Ummh, helping these young women get out of debt?"
"WE DON'T WANT THEM 'OUT OF DEBT!' WE WANT THEM TO MARRY A MORMON MAN WHO WILL TAKE CARE OF THEM AND THEIR DEBTS! YOUR JOB IS TO TEACH THEM TO PRAY ABOUT FINDING A MAN SOON AND HAVE CHILDREN, HE WILL HANDLE THE MONEY. WOMEN ARE INCAPABLE OF UNDERSTANDING MONEY."
From the inside out I know the Church of LDS. I have too many other stories. I consider it a Cult with all the stuff that goes with it. You are dealing with fanatics here. I left the Church.
Now they are certain I am going to fry.
Hope that I don't offend anyone here.
But to my mind their theology is very, very strange!
And very "us" and "them" as far as the rest of the world is concerned. They are "chosen" and will live forever, too complicated to go into this right now --- but the rest of the "unsaved" (by Mormon standards) will not have an afterlife, or if they do, it will be very bad.
They call us "gentiles." Their laws do not apply to "gentiles." The Bishop of our local church told me that he wanted to sell his old car. "But, Bill, don't sell it to anyone in the Church becasue the engine is shot and I have it full of 90 weight oil so it won't knock and smoke. Sell it to a gentile."
Business deals with outsiders? The gloves are off. Business deals within the Church? Better be right!
The missionaries are always in pairs. Want to know why? So they can watch each other for vices. Also mutual support. But "vices" is way up there.
Patriarchal beyond belief. As a Melchazadek priest I was given charge of a group of young women to advise about finances. They has recently garudated high school and were up to their necks in credit card debt. Credit cards had been mailed to them.
I suggested that they draw up a budget, burn the cards, get with their fathers to help them get a bank consolidation loan and pay the balances off with lower interest money.
The Bishop called me inot his office. He was furious! screaming at me! I was concerned that some sort of sexual impropriety had been brought up. I had been VERY careful about this, but his manner suggested I had done something entirely reprehensible.
"Borther Marsh! WHAT DO YOU THINK YOU ARE DOING?"
"Ummh, helping these young women get out of debt?"
"WE DON'T WANT THEM 'OUT OF DEBT!' WE WANT THEM TO MARRY A MORMON MAN WHO WILL TAKE CARE OF THEM AND THEIR DEBTS! YOUR JOB IS TO TEACH THEM TO PRAY ABOUT FINDING A MAN SOON AND HAVE CHILDREN, HE WILL HANDLE THE MONEY. WOMEN ARE INCAPABLE OF UNDERSTANDING MONEY."
From the inside out I know the Church of LDS. I have too many other stories. I consider it a Cult with all the stuff that goes with it. You are dealing with fanatics here. I left the Church.
Now they are certain I am going to fry.
Hope that I don't offend anyone here.
- Joined
- Nov 15, 2000
- Messages
- 3,708
I see where you're coming from Steve. My point was that I chose to have a different reaction than I used to. One that didn't raise my blood pressure and leave me feeling bad about what I'd said and the example I'd set for my kids.
It is possible to disagree with them and politely send them away also. That is the approach that is right for me, but I understand everyone needs to do what they feel is right for them.
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2005
- Messages
- 19,761
Don't like it. Not just the two mentioned above. Here I get a lot of Southern Baptists. Don't like it. Please don't come to my door judging me and try to scare me and my kids into your meek assed posture.
A cult? Yep. IMHO all orgainized religion is a cult.
I try to be polite, but quick.
I won't ever let Hannah goto church with other kids either. Here in Atlanta those SB's will attack a non SB child at church. There was an incident a few years back where a Jewish child went to church (SB) with a friend. They got that child alone for a talk with the minister. He wound up signing a conversion to Christianity document out of fear for his burning soul. Lemme tell you how POed the parents were. Been me the minister better hide because when I'm done with the father of the friend I'm a' comin'.
A cult? Yep. IMHO all orgainized religion is a cult.
I try to be polite, but quick.
I won't ever let Hannah goto church with other kids either. Here in Atlanta those SB's will attack a non SB child at church. There was an incident a few years back where a Jewish child went to church (SB) with a friend. They got that child alone for a talk with the minister. He wound up signing a conversion to Christianity document out of fear for his burning soul. Lemme tell you how POed the parents were. Been me the minister better hide because when I'm done with the father of the friend I'm a' comin'.
I had a similar experience.
We had two girls (young 20 year old women) show up at our door on a very cold winter's day. They were out doing their required Morman tour of duty (it's not just the boys anymore) and had been getting doors slammed in their faces all morning. Their noses were red and runny when we (me-wife-kids) invited them into the house to warm up in front of the fireplace, have a mug of hot chocolate, and play with Murphy Brown, our Golden Retriever puppy.
They were real shy at first but after little "Where are you from, etc." they started talking about their responsibility to go on this crusade. Neither had ever been east of the Mississippi River before or really associated with anyone not a Morman. I had the feeling they were both a bit shell-shocked dealing with the general public.
We sat a bit and discussed what they thought were some important aspects of life and living. After about an hour they thanked us and headed out on their rounds. Good kids, tough job! They left me a "Book of Morman" (with marked passages to read). I gave them a copy of the Lutheran monthly bulletin we get in the mail (they had never heard about Martin before). They were very interesting to talk with and I enjoyed their insights as we knew very little about their faith.
I never felt they intruded on my space. I looked at it as a learning experience and the neighborly thing to do.
We had two girls (young 20 year old women) show up at our door on a very cold winter's day. They were out doing their required Morman tour of duty (it's not just the boys anymore) and had been getting doors slammed in their faces all morning. Their noses were red and runny when we (me-wife-kids) invited them into the house to warm up in front of the fireplace, have a mug of hot chocolate, and play with Murphy Brown, our Golden Retriever puppy.
They were real shy at first but after little "Where are you from, etc." they started talking about their responsibility to go on this crusade. Neither had ever been east of the Mississippi River before or really associated with anyone not a Morman. I had the feeling they were both a bit shell-shocked dealing with the general public.
We sat a bit and discussed what they thought were some important aspects of life and living. After about an hour they thanked us and headed out on their rounds. Good kids, tough job! They left me a "Book of Morman" (with marked passages to read). I gave them a copy of the Lutheran monthly bulletin we get in the mail (they had never heard about Martin before). They were very interesting to talk with and I enjoyed their insights as we knew very little about their faith.
I never felt they intruded on my space. I looked at it as a learning experience and the neighborly thing to do.
- Joined
- Mar 26, 2002
- Messages
- 1,861
aproy1101 said:
AMEN to THAT!
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2005
- Messages
- 4,106
Gentlemen please ! I have just had an adequate breakfast and all this talk of scary looking moons has me a bit queasy .
Perhapsif we took this from a religious point of view (No jokes about Catholic priests permitted .)
Could this be the start of a new religion ? The mooning of missionaries we greet at the door .
We could put forth that it is a humbling of ourselves . (and those we greet .)
After all if we put forth our backside as our best side then who knows where things could progress from there ?
I know with me it would be the "church of the steel toed boot ! L:O:L
Perhapsif we took this from a religious point of view (No jokes about Catholic priests permitted .)
Could this be the start of a new religion ? The mooning of missionaries we greet at the door .
We could put forth that it is a humbling of ourselves . (and those we greet .)
After all if we put forth our backside as our best side then who knows where things could progress from there ?
I know with me it would be the "church of the steel toed boot ! L:O:L
My friend Jake has suffered for years from periodic bouts of extreme jock itch. Nothing has ever helped. He recently heard that Mormons wear "Magic Underwear" and he sees this as his possible salvation.
He is waiting for the missionaries to call and he plans to capture them and steal their britches. I told him I didn't think that would work because it was probably only the Mormon women who had to wear the Magic Underwear.
He said that was OK because he needed a new bicycle helmet anyway.
He is waiting for the missionaries to call and he plans to capture them and steal their britches. I told him I didn't think that would work because it was probably only the Mormon women who had to wear the Magic Underwear.
He said that was OK because he needed a new bicycle helmet anyway.
Svashtar said:
I don't know if that's a new rule or not, but I'm sure glad it didn't apply to us when I served a mission in Dallas among the Spanish-speaking. Just about every door we went to, another awesome hispanic family would invite us in for some hot-off-the-sarten (griddle) tortillas, tacos, enchiladas, beans and rice, chicken mole, etc. It was culinary heaven on earth for someone that loves authentic Mexican cooking.
Had a great time. Too great. My body adjusted to all that lard, keeping me a level 140 lbs the whole time. When I returned home, I dropped 17 pounds in two weeks. Urk.
In general, no white person would ever want to give us the time of day. The Latinos, however, were humble and kind; they'd speak with us no matter their economic or religious situation. We developed friendships where no interest was ever displayed in our message or church. To this day I stay in touch with a Nicaraguan family that never showed any interest.
Just treat 'em like normal human beings and not freaks, especially since a) the majority of them are there because they want to be there, doing what they do, and b) they are there on their own dime. That's fairly admirable, no matter the religious group or collective delusion. So tell them you're comfortable where you're at, but no thanks and have a nice day. Hang a sign for them and other unwanteds if you work nights.
If you've ever shown any interest in religion, however, ask for a Book of Mormon and give it a read. For that matter, if you've never broadened your horizons beyond the sports page and this forum, also check out the Bible, the Qur'an (Koran) and maybe the Baghavad Gita. Interesting stuff.
bc
- Joined
- Jan 30, 2002
- Messages
- 7,269
Manners transcend situations.
"Just treat 'em like normal human beings and not freaks, especially since a) the majority of them are there because they want to be there, doing what they do, and b) they are there on their own dime. That's fairly admirable, no matter the religious group or collective delusion. So tell them you're comfortable where you're at, but no thanks and have a nice day. Hang a sign for them and other unwanteds if you work nights."
I noticed that at an age at which most young people of other "faiths" or belief systems are experimenting with excess of one sort or another, LDS has young folks who take it upon themselves to explain their moral and religious values. Hard to argue their sincerity.
The belief system is not to my way of thinking, but who's to say I'm right?
Should there be a determining being, then it is at that meeting a determination will be made. Until then, respect, tolerance, and courtesy in, and by, any person should make for a good life lived.
"Just treat 'em like normal human beings and not freaks, especially since a) the majority of them are there because they want to be there, doing what they do, and b) they are there on their own dime. That's fairly admirable, no matter the religious group or collective delusion. So tell them you're comfortable where you're at, but no thanks and have a nice day. Hang a sign for them and other unwanteds if you work nights."
I noticed that at an age at which most young people of other "faiths" or belief systems are experimenting with excess of one sort or another, LDS has young folks who take it upon themselves to explain their moral and religious values. Hard to argue their sincerity.
The belief system is not to my way of thinking, but who's to say I'm right?
Should there be a determining being, then it is at that meeting a determination will be made. Until then, respect, tolerance, and courtesy in, and by, any person should make for a good life lived.
Sure would be nice if we LDS would ditch the special underwear, because somehow threads in other forums about Mormons always degrades to this topic.munk said:
Garments as explained on the Wiki
bc
DGG said:
Good on ya'.
But no one is required. The "sister" missionaries go at 21 yrs old if they want. The 19 yr old "men", are expected but not required. Like someone else said, it's unofficially considered a rite of passage. In the past, not going carried a big enough stigma (LDS young women were taught to date men that love the Lord and go on missions), that it was the same thing as required. That's a little less so now. Since about 1999, the church's leaders "raised the bar" on who gets to go. Quite a few are kept back now if they have emotional, social or other problems. My brother in-law, for example, had an insomnia issue and frankly wasn't mature enough yet. He was denied a mission call.
It didn't used to be so strict and there were a number of companions I worked with or knew, that had no business being there. I'm glad they started filtering better.
bc
I am sorry for your wierd experience with the Church. I have been a convert for about 18 years now. None of what you have described has anythijng to do with the doctorine taught by the Church. I have never seen any of these things in any Priesthood manual or spoken of by any Church General Authority or written in any books or manuals of Church Doctorine. In fact, one of the things that I liked about the Church was their acceptance of everyone and all religions. We recognize truth wherever it is. And for anyone to say that someone else is going to hell is arrogant and wrong. I got that growing up from many religions. Someone has undoubtably taught you a distorted version of the three degrees of glory. I don't know who these people were, but anyone teaching and conducting themselves this way would be soundly rebuked by any General Authority or Stake president that I know of.I am saddened that you have had this experience . Please know that this is not the Church.Bill Marsh said:
Terry
We were heading to California from visiting some friends in Electric City, Washington. It was getting dark and cold when a car finally stopped.
He said he didn't usually pick up hitchhikers, but he was worried about "the little lady" so he stopped. Hearing that, I figured we had met up with some kind of pervert or predator. But then the conversation turned to spiritual subjects.
I told him how we were really on a spiritual journey and had friends all over the country that we would visit and bring whatever truths we had discovered on our quest. Then he said, "If you really want to bless people you have to.....". I can't remember what he said.
He told us his name was Joe Smith and that he was a Bishop in the
Church of Latter Day Saints. I don't know if he traced his lineage to THE Joseph Smith or not. That subject never came up. Neither did anything directly related to the practice of his religion. But, we connected and communicated on some deep spiritual level.
He was about to drop us off at the intersection where he turned to go to his house. There was a pasture with some cows and a grove of pine trees at the far side. I said that looked like a good place to spend the night, and thanked him for the ride. When he heard that, he didn't want us to get out of the car and suggested that we spend the night at his house. Sensing our apprehension, he said to relax, his wife and kids would be there.
He introduced us to his wife, teen age son and two pre-teen daughters. Everybody was friendly and accepting. We sat quietly on the sofa in the den while they all got ready to go to a family activity at the youth center gym.
The youngest boy, about three or four years old, was too small to go and was playing with a toy truck on a big round braided rug at our feet.
Evidently some problem had arisen and the baby sitter couldn't make it. So Mr. Smith asked if we would mind watching the kid for an hour or so. How they could trust strangers they had only known for a couple of hours with their child, their house, and all their possessions was beyond my understanding. I didn't say anything except, "Sure".
Smith looked at me and said, "But you're not strangers. We know you well. We can see your light." His wife and kids all smiled and nodded their heads in agreement.
Even though I don't remember what he had said about blessing people, I think he had just done it.
He said he didn't usually pick up hitchhikers, but he was worried about "the little lady" so he stopped. Hearing that, I figured we had met up with some kind of pervert or predator. But then the conversation turned to spiritual subjects.
I told him how we were really on a spiritual journey and had friends all over the country that we would visit and bring whatever truths we had discovered on our quest. Then he said, "If you really want to bless people you have to.....". I can't remember what he said.
He told us his name was Joe Smith and that he was a Bishop in the
Church of Latter Day Saints. I don't know if he traced his lineage to THE Joseph Smith or not. That subject never came up. Neither did anything directly related to the practice of his religion. But, we connected and communicated on some deep spiritual level.
He was about to drop us off at the intersection where he turned to go to his house. There was a pasture with some cows and a grove of pine trees at the far side. I said that looked like a good place to spend the night, and thanked him for the ride. When he heard that, he didn't want us to get out of the car and suggested that we spend the night at his house. Sensing our apprehension, he said to relax, his wife and kids would be there.
He introduced us to his wife, teen age son and two pre-teen daughters. Everybody was friendly and accepting. We sat quietly on the sofa in the den while they all got ready to go to a family activity at the youth center gym.
The youngest boy, about three or four years old, was too small to go and was playing with a toy truck on a big round braided rug at our feet.
Evidently some problem had arisen and the baby sitter couldn't make it. So Mr. Smith asked if we would mind watching the kid for an hour or so. How they could trust strangers they had only known for a couple of hours with their child, their house, and all their possessions was beyond my understanding. I didn't say anything except, "Sure".
Smith looked at me and said, "But you're not strangers. We know you well. We can see your light." His wife and kids all smiled and nodded their heads in agreement.
Even though I don't remember what he had said about blessing people, I think he had just done it.
