Dream Shop - Old Shop Demolition finished. Demo photos added.

The shop is in my backyard and on a court with 3 houses. The shop will match my house and the others in shape, siding, and roofing. I don't think the city would let me build a steel building in a residential neighborhood anyway.

The 40X20 is what fits the space and my wallet. I would love a 60X30 with a bathroom, and the lot would take it, but the build would be 5 or 6 times the cost. I waited to see if I would hit the lottery, but no luck so far.

When all is done in construction, and all the inspectors have been gone for a while, there will be some accessory buildings for outside equipment (compressor, main dust vacuum, gas tanks, etc.) Other surrounding improvements will slowly appear ;)
 
Last Wednesday:
OK, update time. Last Wednesday the City said they couldn't approve the permit because part of the shop is in a FEMA flood zone. I got the FEMA map overlaid on the survey, and the map is wrong. The land they show as being in the zone has been raised to well above the flood plane shown. Also, even though it is the new 2017 map, the plat and street are shown with 10 year old information, which has all been changed. I went out and shot elevations and all are above what FEMA says. Some places in FEMA's flood zone are actually higher than ones they say are out of the zone. I was told that there is a form and process that can get the flood map changed. It will cost about $1000-2000 and take at least a year.

They did say that if I made the shop no more than 600 sq.ft. I could build it where I planned by using FEMA flood resistant materials compliance codes. I would have to raise it about 2 feet and have the lower 48" of the walls pressure treated material, plus different nails, etc. Not a total killer, but about the same cost, but 25% smaller . Not what I really want/need.

Today:
I just got back from am meeting with the City guy and the builder. We found a way around the latest FEMA build requirements. It looks like if I move it to the other side of my lot , away from the creek, and out of the FEMA area they will let me build it full size as the plans are now. The difference is that if it sits in the Blue FEMA area, we are dealing with federal codes and bureaucracy. If it sits in the Brown City area, we are dealing with the guy downtown who approves the permit with a single pen stroke. I had the surveyor redraw the plan an hour later and am marking the new corners on the lot in a few minutes. The contractor will revise the permit and plans accordingly and re-submit them. Fingers Crossed XXXXX
 
Good luck. I'm going to move where there are no building codes, and I can build the shop that I want!
 
Glad you got it worked out to your satisfaction, let the building begin!
 
I just finished re-surveying the lot and the shop fits in the clear area with almost 10 feet to spare from the flood plane at the closest place. I prepared a flip sheet survey where the flood zone can be laid over the new survey and shop. It makes it clear that there should be no issues.

While doing the measuring I affirmed something I always was sure of. The neighbor's fence starts out 3" to his side of the property line halfway down the lots. But it ends up two feet on my side at the end of the lots. He also ran it four feet past the property lines into the right of way of the circle (which isn't a big deal). The guy who put the fence up many years back was a gun toting butt hole biker, and I just let it go, knowing that at some time I can take the fence down if I need to. When he sold the house and everyone in the neighborhood was happy. I may talk to the guy who lives there now and ask what he wants to do, but he is only a renter. The owner lives in Chicago and hasn't been around for 5 years. I had a very good relationship with him, so if I have to get with him, it won't be a problem. For now, I plotted the shop parallel to the fence and used a 4' setback.
 
Stacy if the fence line isn't an issue now that's fine, but the clock on adverse possession is ticking away. It varies for different states.
 
yeah you might want to get on that sooner than later about the fence line. My new neighbor whose been re-landscaping his back yard found out that decades ago the fence put up between us by previous owners of each house was a good 3ft off the actual property line, in my favor and my shop is at the bare minimum setback to said fence line.

The law was on my side if he had decided to be a dick about it as the fence was up for 20+years(it's falling apart currently, my next summer project!) but thankfully he was cool with it, and said "hey, i bought the place thinking that was the property line, you bought your house thinking it was too and you were here first, so lets stick with it". But if things had gone the other way, it woulda been a pricey and time consuming battle.
 
Where the heck are the pictures? Lot layout? Blue prints? Come on, help a brother out. My workshop is stuck in a 1-car garage and I'm out of space.

Power Hammer? Press? Salt bath kiln?
 
I'll get some photos up this weekend. I am working on my notes and outline for a lecture I am doing at the local Community College next Wednesday, so I won't be out in the shop.

I plan to take care of the fence issue during this build. I am double checking with the surveyor and going to try and get with the owner of the house or his agent.
As far as adverse possession goes, trust me, it is much harder than people think. It also generally refers to land abandoned by a government entity and in use by a resident for a long period of time., not usually land belonging to an individual ( that is called squatting). Houses/lots have surveys and platted deeds. Putting a fence in the wrong place does not give away or change the deed. My lot and the rest around it are the only adverse possession deed in the city of Norfolk. This was land that was granted to the Berkley family by King George originally. It became Norfolk county eventually, and when the City of Norfolk annexes the count as well as part of Princess Anne county, it became Norfolk City land. The two guys who loved on the end of the street had a woods behind their houses, and the end of the inlet was on the other side of the woods. The area was about 5 acres. One was a relative of a large local law family. The two guys filed an adverse possession deed on the "abandoned" property. They had to clear the land and improve it. Then they had to pay taxes on it for 10 years. Once the time was up, they were deeded the property from the City. They subdivided it into five lots, of which I own two. The short street behind my house is called Bi-county road because it was the line between the two counties. At one point my front lot deed was in Norfolk and my back lot deed was in the old Princess Anne county courthouse.

I can cite a case in particular that shows the error of thinking you own a piece of land just because it is on your side of the fence. My son had a house in Richmond with a huge back yard. There was a fence along the back that separated them from the neighbors. There was a gate in the fence, as is usual in large lots. The neighbor was friendly and they often strolled into each others yard through the gate to say hello. My son put a large garden in the back by the fence for many years. When they had a child and got a dog, put a new chain link fence along his side boundaries ( replacing the old wire fencing). It tied in to the fence between the back yards as before. A few years later, the neighbor had developed some mental issues due to age. He came out one day and cut the fence off the poles and rolled it back 20 feet. He also pulled up all the plants in the garden, and then replaced the existing fence wire with new chain link fence and no gate.. Mark went to ask him why he did that and the guy said he was tired of people trespassing on his property. He said he had put the fence where it was because of the trees, and the property line was 20 feet past it. It had been that way for over 30 years. My son asked when he didn't put the new fence on his property line and the guy said he didn't want to have to mow more grass. My son went to the police and the City and was told that the man had a right to his property and you can not attach your fence to his fence without his permission. Mark asked about an adverse possession challenge and was told that it didn't matter where the man put his fence, the property lines are what they are. My son put up a new fence along his property lines, leaving a fenced in 20 foot area between the two fences. When the grass and weeds got several feet high, he called the city to make the man mow it. The guy had to get someone to lift a mower over his fence and mow it for him. Eventually the man died and the new owners cut the old fence down and made the fence and property lines right. Point is, the fence isn't the property line.
 
OMG. I'm so sorry you live in the city and have neighbors. I have built my farm up to 100 acres and pretty much do whatever I please. Don't ask. Don't tell. And no neighbor is about to complain about anything.
 
Nearly 50 years ago I was offered to buy a 2000 acre property in southwest VA by a family friend. It was part of an estate and the family wanted to get rid of it. It had a nice 4 bedroom house only 8 years old (completely furnished), a smaller 2 bedroom home ( used for storage), several barns, a stable ( not used for a good while), sheds, 2 deep wells, a reasonable size stream on it, tractors and other farm equipment, and all but 300 acres was in timber. Most of the cleared land was farmed and leased by the neighbor. The buildings were on around 5 acres of grass. They had listed it for over a year at $40 an acre, but said they would sell it to ne for $30 an acre including the buildings and all contents. I could have sold a small part of the timber and paid for the whole place. Only problem was it was far away from Norfolk where my new wife's family lived, pretty far away from anything that looked like a city (an hour's drive to get to Roanoke, and my wife wasn't a country girl. I would have bought it in a heartbeat otherwise. I would probably live there today if I had done the deal .... The stuff we do for love.
 
IMG_20190801_141708.jpg IMG_20190801_141623.jpg I had a spare workscopy of the survey here in the office. I drew in the flood zone and the placement of the shop as I wanted it in blue.I drew the new location in red.IMG_20190801_141623.jpg
 
OK, I went down to the City again with the new survey. I even made an overlay sheet of the FEMA map so you could see it with and without the flood zone. The head guy said he liked the overlay so he could see how close/far the shop would be from the flood zone. He said it was fine in the new spot … then told me to get the surveyor to draw a new survey sheet showing the FEMA zone on the page (with his seal and signature). I just smiled and said, "OK". I went to the surveyor and he re-drew the survey as requested in 15 minutes … and charged me nothing again. I owe this fellow a really nice kitchen knife and a steak dinner when this is all done. I went back down to the Inspector and he said it was good. Building permit application was redrawn for the new locating and moving the doors from the right side to the left side. Everything else will be the same. Fingers crossed for a quick approval and starting construction by the end of the month.
 
Updater to 8/27/19:

Two weeks after re-submitting the application as in the last post, it comes back denied. I talked with the fellow on Friday the 23rd and he said it was going fine and should be back in a day or two.
Then I get an email from the builder on Monday the 27th they sent him a denial in which the reason comments were that I have to raise the floor 18 inches and move it two more feet from the property line, and add the driveway to the plans. Two weeks ago they said it was fine in the new location on the ground with the 6" raised floor we had in the plans, and they told us to use a 3' minimum setback. I had the survey re-done with a 4 foot setback.

I went down to the city yesterday to talk with the zoning and permits people and they assured me that these four things are all I need to do:
1) Have the surveyor re-draw the survey and add the elevation and grade info in the exact words the city provided on the rejection. - No Problem.
2) Move the shop two feet farther away from the property line. This is because my lot is a thru lot between two streets and technically doesn't have a backyard. It has two front yards and the setback rules for garages that face the front street are the same as a primary building. - No problem.
3) Raise the floor 18" above grade, for the same front yard elevation as a primary building. - No Problem
4) Add the drive and its elevation/slope to the plans, including the material used for the surface. - No problem.

Last night the builder gets an email stating that we cannot build any secondary building (garage/workshop/shed) within 100 feet of the water flood zone ... yeah, the same zone they said we had to only be out of two weeks ago. That distance would be two lots over from mine. BTW, there is a ground level two car garage/workshop in the neighbors back yard.

It seems that the new CBPA - Chesapeake Bay Preservation Area - has new rules to prevent any building being built even near the water. Keep in mind, I am at the end of a creek feed by a drainage ditch and storm drains and am over two miles from the bay down that waterway. My end has sand at low tide and maybe a foot of water at high tide. During a very high Nor'easter or seasonal flood tides, it has three feet of water. During our 1000 year flood a few years ago, it had maybe 5 feet of water. That is still was three feet below the lowest part of the lot and five feet below the proposed shop floor. With raising the floor 18" the shop would be about three feet higher than the downstairs of the house across the street.

They said that I could appeal if I could show a hardship. I'll try, but it seems that they are set on preventing any new construction in Norfolk except the million+ dollar homes near the bay and along the rivers by big construction companies with money ties to the council and city leaders.
They caught Ronnie Boone giving bribes to the City Treasurer and at least one other city official, convicted him of bank fraud and bribery ... and only only gave him house arrest. His company is still doing business and breaking the rules while he is going where he wants under the guise of "doing business" or "going to the doctor". They busted him driving a car ( he isn't allowed to drive), and let him off, busted him drinking at a bar he owned ( he isn't allowed to drink) and let him go, and they regularly find him building where he isn't allowed and say, "Well, the place is already up, so lets just give him an exemption...". That shows what money does. Try and do it legit and they just say, NO!

I won't let this get me down. We will set up a meeting with the CBPA guy who says yes/no and find out what he requires. If it is still a NO, I will appeal to city council and the CBPA. If that fails, I may move the shop up by the house, which is 13 feet above the creek and in no flood zone at all. Not what I wanted, and will cost a good bit more, but an option. It may solve the power problem, though. It will also make going back and forth easier as I age, as I could have a direct access door from the house. It will also increase the home value a lot more than the shop out back will ... and , yes, the city will increase my taxes more than if I build it out back.

More later as this unfolds.
 
Sorry to hear that Stacy, but to be honest, I'm not surprised.

One of my best friends is having similar sort of issues with the house he purchased earlier this year in building his shop. His problem is with the septic system. When the original one was put in, they neglected to get the final plans stamped with the right person, and for the past 6 months has been getting the same, "This is all you need to do", "This is fine", "No, this isn't fine, you need to do this", stories that change each time he checks in with the county wondering why he still doesn't have a permit issued.

I have another friend who's a contractor who purchased a house that's already built in a neighboring county, but needs finishing, and getting the same back and forth while trying to get an occupancy permit to sell the place.
Good luck.
 
I left out the fact that this morning a lady backed out of a parking space without looking and ran into my Benz. It has gone 16 years without a scratch. Small dent in the back side panel. I was going to have it repainted this coming spring anyway, so this may just be part of that. If it was the old Chrysler minivan, I wouldn't even fix it.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
I left out the fact that this morning a lady backed out of a parking space without looking and ran into my Benz. It has gone 16 years without a scratch. Small dent in the back side panel. I was going to have it repainted this coming spring anyway, so this may just be part of that. If it was the old Chrysler minivan, I wouldn't even fix it.
Click to expand...
Ouch... when it rains it pours. :thumbsdown:
 
OK, Brace yourself:
This morning I got a call from the fellow who rejected the project saying it had to be 100 feet from the watershed. He was adamant that I couldbuild nothing but a full house in the back, and the house would have to be 8 feet above the ground.I held my temper, but made it clear I was very pissed over this screwing over I have been getting. I told him the long saga and how the city had been having me do all this for 9 months at the cost of $5000 so far and suddenly he says we should never been allowed to submit the plans! He said I could appeal the decision, but he would reject it again. I asked who was higher up than he is and he said I could talk with hs boss if I wanted to and gave me the number. It is a massive understatement that I have not been in a good mood so far today.

A few minutes ago, I get a call from his boss at the CBPA. He had been made aware of this by the first fellow. He looked at the plans and maps and said, this man can't possibly build his shop following the rules, we have to find another way. He went to the big boss, who said, yes, it won't work with the 100 foot setback, so find a way to make an exception. Then he called me and I have the nicest conversation I have had in weeks. He said his job is to protect the bay, but also to protect the rights of homeowners. The first thing he made clear was he would find a way to make my project possible. I thanked im and said I wanted to do whatever was needed to get it built. A few more minutes of conversation and some of the reasons behind the shop and he was totally on my side. He will meet me next thursday and we will form a plan to submit that he will approve. I'm having a GREAT DAY now.
 
Wow Stacy - your last post sure sounds good. GOOD LUCK!!!

While I do understand the need for building codes and permitting in areas where the houses are really close together, I sure don't like living in those areas..... but I do! I bought outside city limits, but this summer they moved the city limits so they now join my property on the north side. BIG BUMMER! Messed up my shooting range.
 
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