Durable folder question

rodriguez7

rodriguez7

Gila wilderness knife works
Joined
Feb 1, 2009
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Just curious. My birthday is coming up, and I'm in the market for a new folder, the catch is, I'm looking for something extremely durable, that has good edge holding steel. Currently I have an adamas, I'm thinking of stepping up to a strider sng, or smf. Are they any more durable? Is it worth spending the money, am I really upgrading? Or should I just stick to my adamas? Maybe going with the benchmade loco. I'm having a hard time deciding. Thanks
 
Medford, Three Sisters Forge, Microtech... even look on ebay for some entry level Darrel Ralph custom Dominators.
 
The Striders will probably be better made, but I don't know of any production folders that are gonna be more bulletproof that the Adamas. Cold Steel has a stronger lock, but almost every other component of the Adamas is thicker and more overbuilt than equivalent CS folders.

If it were me, I would stick with the Adamas and pick up something slicey and nonthreatening to pair it with. Maybe a Northwoods Everyday Barlow, a G Sakai ZDP Fieldman Trekking Tool or a Spyderco Chaparral. That way you have a folding prybar for tearing apart furniture and such, but also a good slicer that you can use around pretty much anyone without cause for alarm and will slice your fruit a lot more cleanly than the Benchmade.
 
I was going to wait for the max-4 but I'm getting impatient. I just picked up a spyderco para sprint run in s35 off the exchange. So I'm carrying them both right now. I just hear a lot about strider and hinderer. I am impressed with the adamas so far, it's a beast.
 
Zero Tolerance bought from an AD, will not disappoint and have a great warranty. My preference is the 560 -your choice for ascetics.
 
There is no folder more rugged or durable than what Cold Steel offers. If you like the looks and feel you cannot beat them. The American Lawman and Recon 1 are great knives and the soon to be released 4-Max should be great, too.
 
Totally forgot about CS. I've been known to carry a pair of Rajah 2 folders.

[video=youtube;OWylqMcMpEE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWylqMcMpEE[/video]
 
The only thing I don't like about cold steel, is their steel choices. They don't hold that good of an edge. Cts-Xhp is ok, but aus 8 sucks, in my opinion. That's why I want a max-4, much better steel for my uses. That's why I was thinking a strider, maybe find one in z-wear or pd1. I use my knives for everything from cutting sheet rock at work to skinning game, or cutting various things around the farm. I do like edge retention. I have various zt's, a cold steel ultimate hunter, and various spydercos. Looking to possibly step up from there.
 
I would buy a Sebenza... if it had a 5" sharpened length of .160" stock and .187" Ti.
 
Thick blades and titanium slabs don't do a lot if the knife falls apart. Last year I was on the lookout for the most durable folder I could afford ( < $500) and I looked at a BUNCH of options. I've always said that a lot boils down to the screws. ...the material they are made from, how they are machined, thickness, where they are placed in the handle/pivot. If they screw into the opposing handle scale, into the spacers themselves, or into a female post/nut (by far the preferred method).

The best example of a perfectly executed folder is the CRK Sebenza 21.

The knife that I chose is the Hinderer XM-18. I do believe I is the most durable <$500 knife out there.

And stay away from "hidden stop pins". That causes a huge amount of the blade tang to be milled away, making a big unnecessary hole in a load bearing area.

I should also mention that I've never considered an "integral handle" folder because the lock bar can't be bent in if need be.
 
archieblue said:
And stay away from "hidden stop pins". That causes a huge amount of the blade tang to be milled away, making a big unnecessary hole in a load bearing area.
Click to expand...

This is a little too worrisome...

I've used my André Thorburn L51 pretty hard and it has a "hidden stop pin". I've done things like chopping and whacking the edge through thick plastic with a hammer and it's fine; the lockup is still early and it's in 1-piece.

It's a knife, not a load-bearing masonry wall...
 
rodriguez7 said:
Just curious. My birthday is coming up, and I'm in the market for a new folder, the catch is, I'm looking for something extremely durable, that has good edge holding steel. Currently I have an adamas, I'm thinking of stepping up to a strider sng, or smf. Are they any more durable? Is it worth spending the money, am I really upgrading? Or should I just stick to my adamas? Maybe going with the benchmade loco. I'm having a hard time deciding. Thanks
Click to expand...

My son and I are going backpacking this weekend. Last trip before the snow flies. The living room is full of unpacked gear and in a few hours, I'll be relying on a packing list that I review on a regular basis. Helps with my decision making. Did I use this last time? Can I survive an emergency without this?

Perhaps the same sort of questions would help here.
+ Have you are ever broken or damaged a folder before?
+ What were you doing when you busted a knife?
+ What kind of knife failed on you?
+ What is the realistic probability that you will stress a knife enough to break it?


In my journey with knives, I've found durability to be an interesting and surprising thing. I grew up with a Buck 110 and associated durability with weight.
Big folders by Pinnah, on Flickr

Turns out that the 2oz Opinel #9 is infinitely more durable. In fact, I think you would have to get creative to figure out a way to break it.

Do you remember the old Tootsie Pop commercial? "How many licks does it take to get to the center?" I wondered what it would take for Bladeforums hard users to break an even lighter Opinel #8, so I did a pass around. It finally had the tip busted off buy a guy who used it to drill plastic piping in sub-zero weather. Several guys hated the knife (like beer, tastes differ) but nobody was able to break the joint.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1097460-Opinel-Pass-Around-amp-Walk-About

EDITED TO ADD: Please note, I'm not recommending an Opinel #9 (or 10), although they are quite tough. Just noting the durability is a funny attribute for a folding knife and it's never clear to me if durability is the real need being met or if, instead, it's more about justifying a knife that we really really like (which should be enough reason to buy a knife).
 
Most of my folders are likely to outlast me, unless I use them to pry lug nuts or similar abuse. That would include 110s, several Axis lock Benchmades, Sebbie 21, Opinel, various stockman whittlers, sodbusters, CS Voyagers, my snazzy new American Lawman (CTS-XHP is amazing steel, right up there with S35Vn IMHO), so durability isn't an issue with me.
 
While the 4-Max is definitely a good and durable folder (once it finally hits the market), it isn't like you're realistically going to beat on an American Lawman or an Ultimate Hunter hard enough to ever really cause severe damage to the knife, unless you're trying VERY hard to do so.

CTS-XHP is an awesome all-around steel, and while 20CV will usually have higher edge retention, at the thickness that it will likely end up behind the edge on the 4-Max, you're not liekly to really see any higher edge retention from it over regular CTS-XHP. So basically, what you will likely end up with is a steel that doesn't really hold an edge much longer without being re-profiled, which is a little harder to sharpen than CTS-XHP, and has about the same toughness really.

Frankly, I would just save the money and go with the American Lawman, the AK-47, or the Ultimate Hunter, in CTS-XHP, and then beat the living crap out of it to your heart's content. The steel will be adequately tough for whatever tasks you need it to do, and it will still be easy enough to sharpen back up if you do manage to chip it or roll the edge.
Trust me, I love high edge-retention steel as much as the next guy, trust me, and I have messed with as many of them as I can, but the truth of the matter sometimes is that if you want a truly tough folder, you are probably going to have to make at least some compromise in the edge retention in order for the steel to be tough enough to handle a true beating, and still be easy enough to sharpen if/when you do manage to mangle the edge on accident.

Just my $0.02, but I would highly recommend NOT making your beater knife cost much more than $100, so that if you somehow ever DO manage to kill it, a replacement is easy to find and not going to break the bank.
 
Blues Bender said:
This is a little too worrisome...

I've used my André Thorburn L51 pretty hard and it has a "hidden stop pin". I've done things like chopping and whacking the edge through thick plastic with a hammer and it's fine; the lockup is still early and it's in 1-piece.

It's a knife, not a load-bearing masonry wall...
Click to expand...

It still makes the blade less durable and it is completely unnecessary. As far as I can tell, the only reason for a "hidden stop pin" is to place it where it will not be in the way of a flipper. Carving out this pocket in the blade also creates a place for gunk and grit to hide which can lead to lockup issues and corrosion since the knife may need to be taken apart to clean. Either way, the best and likely most durable placement of a stop pin is on the blade. A person can say "I've not run into that issue" all they want. The topic is less about one persons uses vs another's and more about which knives have the potential to be more durable than others.

The Southard AVO displays every aspect of how I feel a knife should not be designed or
assembled (yes I have owned one) but it is not likely to be broken because it is not likely to be put through heavy stress.

I do not seek a hard use folder because of my daily tasks or because I plan to use a knife in any certain abusive ways. I seek a hard use folder because I enjoy picking apart knife design and because it blows my skirt up. YMMV.
 
archieblue said:
It still makes the blade less durable and it is completely unnecessary. As far as I can tell, the only reason for a "hidden stop pin" is to place it where it will not be in the way of a flipper. Carving out this pocket in the blade also creates a place for gunk and grit to hide which can lead to lockup issues and corrosion since the knife may need to be taken apart to clean. Either way, the best and likely most durable placement of a stop pin is on the blade. A person can say "I've not run into that issue" all they want. The topic is less about one persons uses vs another's and more about which knives have the potential to be more durable than others.

The Southard AVO displays every aspect of how I feel a knife should not be designed or
assembled (yes I have owned one) but it is not likely to be broken because it is not likely to be put through heavy stress.

I do not seek a hard use folder because of my daily tasks or because I plan to use a knife in any certain abusive ways. I seek a hard use folder because I enjoy picking apart knife design and because it blows my skirt up. YMMV.
Click to expand...

Well, that's your opinion, and not fact... I disagree and have had many knives with said design, and I use the hell out of my knives. Never had an issue.

If a knife with a hidden stop pin can be used on a construction site without problems, then that's enough evidence provided that it's a non-issue...
 
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