Edge retention of Scandi grind?

Sorry not exactly answering the OP, but what I find unique about the scandi grind is that you can do things with it wood carving-wise that you can't with other grinds. Laying the knife on the wide bevel of the grind itself positions it for a nice shallow cut into wood at a consistent angle. This happens automatically when shaving with the knife and you don't even really notice you are doing it, except that the knife automatically aligns itself and makes nice uniform curls. With every other grind you have to set and hold the angle of the blade manually (almost like sharpening) during the cut.

Personally, I don't find that a bit more aggressive 2nd bevel hurts performance, at least in the above aspect, all that much.
 
Any chipping I have seen on a Scandi grind, happened right from the manufacturer, and never occurred again, once sharpened out.

This is mainly do to the ruined heat treat at the very edge, from using grinders and power belts to sharpen the edge. These fast moving abrasives heat up the very thin edge too much, ruining the heat treat. Once you do an initial sharpening or two, you get back into unaffected metal, which is the proper hardness, and will not chip.

As you can see, this is a trait of heat treating, not of the grind itself. Go ahead and make a Scandi grind, you will be very happy with it. Now that I have found the Scani grind, I will never go back to anything else!!!
 
northern1 said:
i've wondered the same thing.is it possible??

i just got my first scandi last week and just from cutting card board and push cutting paper i am very impressed.its a koster nessie.

i dont sharpen with stones,dont even own one and i dont see how i'm going to sharpen the whole bevel on a sharpmaker.

it wouldnt be the end of the world to put a tiny sec bevel on it but i like the idea of the zero.

my lack of sharpening skills bites again.
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Find a short ruler. Get one of those paper clips you use to clip about 20 sheets of paper together with that is like a spring with two finger things you squeeze.

Cut a strip of wet/dry sandpaper the size of the ruler and clip one end with the paper clip and then use that to sharpen your blade.

If you then follow that up with a strop you are likely to have a very slight secondary convex.
 
edge retention of a scandi grind, like any other grind, comes down to how thin it is ground.

if you grind it down to 10* inclusive it is going to be far more fragile than one ground to 25* inclusive.

it seems to me that almost all scandis are ground to between 20* and 30*, most of them are at around 25*.

i haven't seen any issues with a scandi grind having durability problems except when cutting very hard materials or when it is ground too thin or tempered too soft or hard. ..

in other words, as long as its done right it should be fine.

as to how a scandi does vs other grinds in "everyday" type chores...if you have a heavier stock scandi, like the koster or others it will not be too efficient in cutting things like cardboard or hard vegetables and fruits. the shoulders of the grind provide alot of drag when cutting and in the hard vegetables and fruits it will split the material instead of cutting it. with thinner stock scandis like the moras there is not as much drag even with the same angle. the thinner stock is less wedge like and cuts more efficiently.

i like the convex grind because it eliminates the shoulders but still gives a razor sharp edge and the micro bevel effect of the convex helps to provide more stablity and toughness for the edge.

i have a slightly convexed scandi grind (the shoulders are softened) and even though it is one of my thickest knives in this size it cuts great in cardboard and hard foods with very little drag.
 
Many finns that use their knives for GP have a slightly convex grind, it is somewhat more difficult to maintain than flat but works better for wood. If used for hunting only many keep their blades flat.

Really a matter of taste and usage.

Steel and HT are actually more meaningful in most cases.

TLM
 
TLM said:
Many finns that use their knives for GP have a slightly convex grind, it is somewhat more difficult to maintain than flat but works better for wood. If used for hunting only many keep their blades flat.
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Just for my own understanding, are you speaking about knives with entire convex/flat grinds, or scandi grinds with convex secondary bevels?
 
Just for my own understanding, are you speaking about knives with entire convex/flat grinds, or scandi grinds with convex secondary bevels?
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It does not matter that much if the grind is full or partial, that tends to affect the angle and from that the ease of cutting but not that much the handling otherwise. Just a very small secondary bevel does not really bring the advantages in whittling.

TLM
 
I've batoned wood and metal street signs with a SS Mora and it was fine, except a little dull. It did get damaged at the edge slicing grip tape for a skateboard though.

I have a scandi Brusletto with a ~5 inch blade I've batoned and chopped with, also in stainless. No damage.

I have a scandi ground custom that's very acute at the edge, some type of carbon steel. Done light chopping and a lot of hardwood carving and whittling. No damage.

In my experience most US made knives are ground at ridiculously obtuse angles, hence my appreciation for finnish scandi ground fixed blades.
 
A few years back I was trying to evaluate which hunting knives could cover the full spectrum of field dressing tasks. One of my concerns was whether a knife could be pounded through ribs. To evaluate this I got some beef rib bones and chopped notches in the sides of them with a variety of knives.

One knife I used was a cheap Frosts of Sweden military survival knife. This had a scandi grind and a somewhat soft stainless blade (12C27 around 56 RC (oops I didn't mean 26)). The blade edge rippled and rolled significantly in the contact area. The combination of thinness of the grind and the softness of the material caused the edge to buckle over when too much pressure was applied.

So that is where I would start to question a scandi grind, when you start working on material as hard as bone I would want to have the harder carbon steel blade rather than the stainless.
 
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One knife I used was a cheap Frosts of Sweden military survival knife. This had a scandi grind and a somewhat soft stainless blade (12C27 around 26 RC?).
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If true that steel would be ridiculously soft for the intended use. I have used my knives on moose, not on the bones but cut the ribs on the cartilage etc. never had any problems (except when I was a bit lazy on sharpening).

Most types of scandi knives have evolved over hundreds of years for their purpose (mostly to be small general purpose knives with limited capacity for heavy work), they were used with heavier knives or axes or hatchets so no heavy work was expected.

TLM
 
Sorry that hardness I put into my post was a typo. My actual estimate is more like 56 (maybe 55).
 
Sorry that hardness I put into my post was a typo. My actual estimate is more like 56 (maybe 55).
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I kind of guessed that, 55-56 HRc would be reasonable.

TLM
 
I've used my Mora carbon steel Clipper not only in the kitchen and camp site, but also to field dress and skin whitetail, coyote and various small game. Not only has it held an edge extremely well, but is easy to resharpen, which is not very often. I have also used one of the cheap red handled Mora's with a 5-inch blade to butcher Whitetail and seperate joins. It works wonderfully and the edge suffers no damage. I have used the same knife to split kindling using a baton through various hard woods--no chipping and holds a very good edge. I use Mora's and Finnish knives with scandi grinds almost exclusively in the out doors.
 
I've been using my mora carbon clipper hard for the past few weeks I've used it to make numerous bowdrill sets, traps, and spoons.. it is my go to knife... I just bought 3 more.. excellent edge holding ability, easy to sharpen, responds to stropping, Ive battoned with it several times...with no ill effects... great bang for the buck blades, and an outstanding entry level bushcraft knife.. scandi grind is my favorite grind for wilderness use...stropping after use will prolong the life of the edge making it comparable to other grinds..
 
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Vivi said:
I've batoned wood and metal street signs with a SS Mora and it was fine, except a little dull. It did get damaged at the edge slicing grip tape for a skateboard though.

I have a scandi Brusletto with a ~5 inch blade I've batoned and chopped with, also in stainless. No damage.

I have a scandi ground custom that's very acute at the edge, some type of carbon steel. Done light chopping and a lot of hardwood carving and whittling. No damage.

In my experience most US made knives are ground at ridiculously obtuse angles, hence my appreciation for finnish scandi ground fixed blades.
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vivi are you pro or am?
 
I primarily use a Kosters in S3v (Bushcraft) and I will use it all day on medium to hard wood and parts of the blade will still shave.

I then generally give it 5 - 8 runs a side on my very fine DMT stone - strop it quickly (on demin) and it shaves again.

I find that very nice. I like the fact that sharpening it is so very simple and I don't have to worry about carrying anything special in my kit. Any flat stone does the job.

TF
 
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