Recommendation? edge retention

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HonzaK

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Hi, I would like to ask which knives can best hold the edge. By that, I mean which knives I can abuse and shave myself without sharpening. Just something that maybe will be really hard to sharpen but will stay sharp for a really long time. Also, corrosion resistance would be nice but not necessary.
 
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S390 is pretty tough, has incredible wear resistance, but is not at all stainless. The knife I have in it is 67 HRC and unless you have the proper equipment (and time) you would probably want to have it professionally sharpened.

I'm pretty happy with CPM-M4 as far as the edge retention and toughness, but again it's not stainless.

A lot of people like the new CPM-Magnacut because it balances, toughness, and stainlessness. However, it's not going to stay as sharp as long as what has been mentioned thus far.

What are you using your knife for when you say "abuse?" What steel(s) are you currently using?
 
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Maxamet from Spyderco. I have the PM2, P3 and the Sage. There is also a Native 5 FRN. Pick your poison. What is interesting about Maxamet that is is kinda self sharpening. As you use it, the edge, instead of becoming dull, develops microscopic serrations, that just keep cutting. It took me more than a month of daily hard use in a garden (cutting plant fibers, soft and hard wood full of dust and sand) to dull the PM2. The Native's and the Para3's blade geometry lends itself most to *some* abuse, the PM2 with its thin tip and the Sage with its thinner blade thickness less so.

Never had a problem with corrosion, Maxamet develops a nice patina.
 
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Define "abuse"... it will certainly vary from one individual to another and we would need to know in order to suggest "the most appropriate" steel.

M4 is reasonably tough, holds a great edge for a long time but you would sacrifice corrosion resistance, however, you already said that it was not a primary factor.

S90V will hold a great edge for a long time, but is not tough, but has good corrosion resistance.

"Abuse" is going to define how far out we can go on the other scales.
 
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As mentioned, you generally have to pick a compromise between edge retention, toughness, and corrosion resistance. Also, what are you using the knife for? If it's mainly things like cutting cardboard, a thin edge geometry might contribute more to a "sharp" feeling knife that slices easily than the keenness of the edge. The toughness of the steel and how roughly you use it will determine how thin you can go on the edge.

Something with a thin hollow grind or a high flat grind and a steel with plentiful carbides but good toughness might be the ticket. The Spyderco Gayle Bradley in M4 that I used to have would have been a good choice, not sure how the new version differs.
 
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Again, like others have mentioned, you have to define "abuse". Also whether your looking for a fixed or folder.

But I'm a huge fan of K390. Plenty though, and holds an edge for a crazy long time running a "toothy" edge. Others have addressed issues with corrosion, but short of some patina, I've never had any actual rust issues with mine.
 
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Knife Grinders in Australia has a specialty of sharpening knives sharper than razor sharp, that is, BESS scores below 50. They report that all steels dull at about the same rate from razor sharp to extremely sharp. After that, the "super" steels dull more slowly than other steels. So if you are really going to shave with a knife, you may need to sharpen it often no matter what steel it is.

I cannot vouch for this information personally because I have not shaved in about 40 years.
 
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This is a difficult subject. You've defined the sharpness requirement but you haven't defined the "beat on it" part. Tool steels can have high toughness, or high wear resistance, but there is a tradeoff. You can't have both, if you increase wear resistance you decrease toughness. Compounding the issue some steels can be hardened more than others and that helps with wear resistance. Also people will tell you that the geometry of the edge is as important as the steel itself.

IMO steels such as M4, Rex45, K390, 15V are steels that can hold a good edge and still have some amount of toughness. Maxamet was already mentioned and it has good edgeholding but is very low on the toughness scale. Personally I like Rex45 and K390, but I don't beat on my knives.
 
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If corrosion resistance isn't of prime concern, I'd probably go with K390. MagnaCut or CruWear could do well also. If by abuse you mean edge impacts, prying, and stuff like that, just get something less expensive that you can replace for a decent price when it gets too beat up or broken. No steel is immune to edge damage when you get rough enough or start putting it up against metal, rock, concrete, etc.

Edit to add, AEB-L and similar steels(Like 14C28N or Nitro-V) can perform very well in rough use. They don't have the raw wear resistance of some steels, but make up for it with fine microstructure and excellent toughness. They will resharpen much more easily when damaged.
 
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HonzaK said:
knives I can abuse and shave myself without sharpening.
Click to expand...
Unobtanium.

Another Shepherd said:
Knife Grinders in Australia has a specialty of sharpening knives sharper than razor sharp, that is, BESS scores below 50. They report that all steels dull at about the same rate from razor sharp to extremely sharp. After that, the "super" steels dull more slowly than other steels. So if you are really going to shave with a knife, you may need to sharpen it often no matter what steel it is.

I cannot vouch for this information personally because I have not shaved in about 40 years.
Click to expand...

They aren't the only ones to discover that.
 
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HonzaK, maybe you would like a specific knife recommendation?
I propose a Spyderco Delica K390 in Wharncliffe. They happen to be less than $100 USD right now, which is not normal, and that blade shape may suit what you're looking for.
It's also an extremely durable and reliable item, and I think you'll be impressed by the blade's edge retention.
On the downside, it's got FRN handles (Fiberglass Reinforced Nylon, like tough plastic), and the blade is not stainless and will darken/patina, and it's not very glamorous. Maybe you want to spend more $ and get something really beautiful in S90V.
Enjoy your search!
 
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kobold said:
Maxamet from Spyderco. I have the PM2, P3 and the Sage. There is also a Native 5 FRN. Pick your poison. What is interesting about Maxamet that is is kinda self sharpening. As you use it, the edge, instead of becoming dull, develops microscopic serrations, that just keep cutting. It took me more than a month of daily hard use in a garden (cutting plant fibers, soft and hard wood full of dust and sand) to dull the PM2. The Native's and the Para3's blade geometry lends itself most to *some* abuse, the PM2 with its thin tip and the Sage with its thinner blade thickness less so.

Never had a problem with corrosion, Maxamet develops a nice patina.
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I have a Manix 2 LW in Maxamet that is a cardboard cutting monster. I just strop it on the same cardboard when done and it keeps on going.
 
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norcalAF said:
I have a Manix 2 LW in Maxamet that is a cardboard cutting monster. I just strop it on the same cardboard when done and it keeps on going.
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But Maxamet is not a steel you want to abuse...there have been plenty of stories on that score.

The issue here is that the OP has not defined for us what he considers "abuse" to be...and therein lies the rub.

Maxamet is an awesome steel for cutting and maintaining a sharp edge.
 
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